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Dropdowns Should Be the UI of Last Resort

lukew.com

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Re: Dropdowns Should Be the UI of Last Resort

#161

Post by simoncion »

pandler wrote: post #27
userbinator wrote: post #2

IMHO the best option for inputting a small integer value is the combination of a text field and a stepper, which has been around for a long time and has its own name (for touchscreen operation, the +/- buttons could be made larger and horizontally, like the steppers shown): https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Spinner_(computing) For dates, a calendar control would probably be appropriate. I'm a bit puzzled as to why dropdo…

I find myself having to manually close dropdown menus on my iPhone 5s. 1. Click to open 2. Scroll 3. Select Option 4. Click to close

That's awful. They don't work that way on stock Android.

Re: Dropdowns Should Be the UI of Last Resort

#162

Post by simoncion »

vidarh wrote: post #93
coldtea wrote: post #38

Earlier quoted context omitted.

On the other hand, any list of "significant length" is best served by a dropdown. None of the options he shows in the article works well there.

A list of significant length is often best served by search .

Unless -of course- you don't have a good idea of what it is that you want to search for!

This happens to me far more frequently than I would like. :)

Re: Dropdowns Should Be the UI of Last Resort

#163

Post by simoncion »

charlesarthur wrote: post #120
justuk wrote: post #104

Earlier quoted context omitted.

It feels like desktop is taking a hit for the team because a less sophisticated member is tagging along. I watch all these websites convert over to responsive designs and very few of them are a step forward. It's like they've gone from tools aimed at adults to toys for children.

What's happened is that they've gone to "sites with smaller viewports and less precise input methods because they don't have a mouse and keyboard attached". And in case it had also passed you by, mobile is the predominant method of browsing for a huge number of sites all over the world. Consider Google, which says that mobile search outnumbers desktop in 10 major countries. Do you hear Larry Page moaning about how pe…

> ...sites with smaller viewports...

Every smartphone sold in America in the last four years has a far higher screen resolution than the machine on which I first browsed the internet back in the 1990s. Indeed, most of them have a higher screen resolution than the laptop on which I regularly browse the internet today!

So, no, the viewports on mobile devices aren't really smaller.

It is -however- very true that one's input method is substantially less precise than when using a mouse. But, it's not that much less precise than when using a pen or stylus. :)

> Instead, Google rejigged its algorithm to favour "mobile-friendly" sites.

Sure. But, OP is not talking about Google's search ranking algorithm. Google didn't make dumbed-down versions of the UI of their sites because folks are mostly visiting with finger-navigated devices. Until recently, Google worked hard to make UIs that are both full-featured and useful for folks navigating with a mouse and with their finger.

Re: Dropdowns Should Be the UI of Last Resort

#164

Post by err4nt »

lelandbatey wrote: post #147
err4nt wrote: post #132

Earlier quoted context omitted.

> Screenshotting is something that almost nobody knows how to do I got a really good laugh at this one, a cursory glance of user-generated content online shows tons of people not only know how to screenshot their devices, but are quite adept at figuring out how to share those screenshots with each other and the world.

The people that are taking those screenshots to generate that content make up a tiny minority of users. Most people don't know how to screenshot, and the basic point that you shouldn't have to take a screenshot to zoom into a page is still a good one.

You shouldn't have to zoom in to a page, how do you use apps?

Re: Dropdowns Should Be the UI of Last Resort

#165

Post by function_seven »

err4nt wrote: post #111
vidarh wrote: post #91

Earlier quoted context omitted.

If I try to zoom, it is already a demonstration that your design does not work for me on my device. I would not prefer to pan - if I resort to it, it's because I have to because the site design is broken. At that point you better not have disabled zoom too, if you want me to come back to your site.

> If I try to zoom, it is already a demonstration that your design does not work for me on my device. THIS! This is how I feel exactly! When you load up a site I do it is as well designed as a mobile app. Surely people don't complain about the inability to zoom in their iOS settings app, or in the clocks app. Why would my site be any different?

> When you load up a site I do it is as well designed as a mobile app. Surely people don't complain about the inability to zoom in their iOS settings app, or in the clocks app. Why would my site be any different?

They have that ability (at least on iOS. Don't know about Android, but I assume it has similar settings). It's under the Accessibility options.

Why don't you allow users the ability to zoom your sites?

Re: Dropdowns Should Be the UI of Last Resort

#166

Post by dragonwriter »

simoncion wrote: post #163
charlesarthur wrote: post #120

Earlier quoted context omitted.

What's happened is that they've gone to "sites with smaller viewports and less precise input methods because they don't have a mouse and keyboard attached". And in case it had also passed you by, mobile is the predominant method of browsing for a huge number of sites all over the world. Consider Google, which says that mobile search outnumbers desktop in 10 major countries. Do you hear Larry Page moaning about how pe…

> ...sites with smaller viewports... Every smartphone sold in America in the last four years has a far higher screen resolution than the machine on which I first browsed the internet back in the 1990s. Indeed, most of them have a higher screen resolution than the laptop on which I regularly browse the internet today! So, no, the viewports on mobile devices aren't really smaller. It is -however- very true that one's i…

> Every smartphone sold in America in the last four years has a far higher screen resolution than the machine on which I first browsed the internet back in the 1990s. Indeed, most of them have a higher screen resolution than the laptop on which I regularly browse the internet today!

A good point, and important to keep in mind.

> So, no, the viewports on mobile devices aren't really smaller.

Except, in the ways that they are. A 5" 4K display is still literally a smaller viewport than a 13" 1366x768 display or a 20" 1920x1080 display, and this is quite important in design.

Re: Dropdowns Should Be the UI of Last Resort

#167

Post by simoncion »

brudgers wrote: post #141
EStudley wrote: post #130

Earlier quoted context omitted.

I get the simplicity, but I really disagree that visual aspects of a website/program are not "something useful". I would bet that a well designed and clean GUI would be easier to use for a large percent of the population than text alone..

Why can I use a cookie rather than a GUI to log into HackerNews? Why can I use Oauth to log into StackOverflow? Would it be better if we all had to use a keyboard wudgut? The idea that GUI's are great was good forty years ago when men worried about catching typing-pool-koodies from keyboards; college students would hire typists to turn longhand drafts into print on a page; and the only form of search was query and th…

You suggest that we use CLIs for pretty much every task?

I -happily- spend most of my day in one CLI or another, but there are many, many things for which interactive graphical display of information is just the best choice.

If you never have done so, find a copy of Edward Tufte's "The Visual Display of Quantitative Information". You really need to find a professionally-printed dead-tree version; computer screens still can't do the book justice.

Oh:

> "koodies"

That word is spelt "cooties". ;)

Re: Dropdowns Should Be the UI of Last Resort

#168

Post by simoncion »

brudgers wrote: post #148
yesimahuman wrote: post #72

Earlier quoted context omitted.

...as he (probably) posts to HN through a web GUI

I used a browser and a keyboard to hit the address bar and enter the URI and type my comment. Logging into HN did not required HTTPS, not GUI.

Did you know that even Lynx is properly considered a GUI? It's a text-mode GUI, but a GUI nonetheless.

Edit: To figure out where you're coming from: do you consider text editors like vim, nano, and pico to be GUIs or CLIs? Why do you hold this opinion?

Re: Dropdowns Should Be the UI of Last Resort

#169

Post by function_seven »

err4nt wrote: post #131
Lewton wrote: post #117

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Consider your post score an informal poll....

Have I been on sites where I wished zoom was enabled? Yes Have I been on sites where I wished zoom was DISabled? Yes The point is, I design my stuff so it feels like a native app. I design my stuff so it is as accessible as the apps that came with the device. Zooming is a feature added to mobile browsers so mobile users have a fallback to view websites that dont support mobile screen sizes, but designing websites for…

> Without zooming, how do you all use things on your phones that ARENT websites? They don't zoom either...

yes they do. I have it enabled on my phone. Here' the iOS Reddit app, first[1] the way I normally use it, and second[2] they way it would look on a default phone.

[1] http://i.imgur.com/cf85gPv.png

[2] http://i.imgur.com/Kjz6QD8.png

Re: Dropdowns Should Be the UI of Last Resort

#170

Post by simoncion »

Klathmon wrote: post #42
oneeyedpigeon wrote: post #37

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Why not support both methods? Chrome lets you type, or use a calendar picker (which itself has flaws, but at least they're trying ...)

I don't know of the specifics on this one, but in the UI/UX world it's rarely a good idea to "support both". They generally lead to bad looking UIs that "almost" work for everyone, but aren't a good fit for anyone.

A calendar that also lets you click on the displayed date [0] in order to type in the desired date is almost never disliked.

[0] By that, I mean a string somewhere on the widget like "2015-07-20", or however dates are displayed on the system.

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