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Cuba and the U.S. will begin to normalize relations

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Re: Cuba and the U.S. will begin to normalize relations

#161

Post by wdr1 »

scardine wrote: post #152
xyahoo wrote: post #103

Earlier quoted context omitted.

On the other hand: - average life expectancy in Cuba is almost the same as the USA (and higher than Mexico, Belize, Bahamas, Brazil, etc.). - literacy rate in Cuba is higher than that in the USA - Physicians per 10,000 people: Cuba has 67, USA has 24 In the Ebola crisis, Cuba has been leading from the front.

I highly recommend reading "Guide to the Perfect Latin American Idiot" which explain how dictatorships can pick a handful of indicators and elevate them to first-world levels while still making everybody's life miserable. [1] http://www.amazon.com/Guide-Perfect-Latin-American-Idiot/pro...

Michael Moore needs to read this book.

Re: Cuba and the U.S. will begin to normalize relations

#162

Post by aaron-lebo »

avar wrote: post #154
pdeuchler wrote: post #132

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Comparing statistics from small, homogeneous populations to statistics from larger, heterogeneous populations is fraught with peril. Doubly so for metrics on education and health. (I like to call this the Scandinavian Fallacy) As engineers we would never compare uptime statistics from a small, niche startup serving a couple thousand people to uptime statistics from, say, Google. Why do we immediately ignore these pri…

What does the heterogeneous populations of the US have to do with it? Maybe when it comes to life expectancy you're right, because genetics is a large factor in that. But when it comes to literacy rate and the proportion of physicians that's entirely down to government policy. Do you really think the US couldn't beat Cuba on those metrics if they decided spending money on those topics was more important than spending…

I believe the point that is being made is that the US was designed from the outset with the idea that diverse factions compete against factions, and that was the only way such a large and varied democracy could work. See Federalist 10.

Citizens of the US have wildly varied views about what it means to be a good American, and we often have greater cohesion to groups such as race or state, etc. Just about the only thing we do agree upon is when there is an existential threat to the country, hence military growth over time.

Cuba or Norway have much less divided societies to govern, and Cuba's leadership is so small that it can focus on specific issues in a way US politics cannot.

Re: Cuba and the U.S. will begin to normalize relations

#163

Post by mentalhealth »

mudil wrote: post #137
toomuchtodo wrote: post #129

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Please explain how that's any different than the US when you can't afford medicine or care? It makes little difference whether the shortage is due to no physical supply vs not being able to afford it. If you can't get healthcare, you can't get it. http://www.nerdwallet.com/blog/health/2014/03/26/medical-ban... “In 2013 over 20% of American adults are struggling to pay their medical bills, and three in five bankruptci…

I am an anesthesiologist. I worked in some of the best hospitals in the country in residency (UCSF and Harvard's BWH), and I worked in Detroit and I work now in a small Catholic hospital. And I can tell you that quality of care poor get is the same as rich ones get. Then I also grew up in Soviet Union, where supposedly great healthcare was developed. And I can tell you they had a horrible health care like they have i…

And I can tell you that quality of care poor get is the same as rich ones get.

That's because you're an anesthesiologist, and you see the acute cases which have already been admitted to the hospital. Poor people don't receive comparable long-term care. They don't receive comparable followup care after procedures. They can't afford lifesaving medication, they can't afford physical therapy, and they can't afford psychiatric care. They're denied for transplants, and many surgeons won't accept them as patients because their recovery stats are so much lower due to the aforementioned lack of followup.

All of this, without even mentioning the increasing number of specialty surgeons that operate on a cash-only basis, or the poor who don't go to the doctor simply because they cannot afford to. There's no comparison between the care that the rich and poor receive in this country, except possibly once they're unconscious in the OR.

Re: Cuba and the U.S. will begin to normalize relations

#164

Post by jlebar »

valarauca1 wrote: post #5

This is actually (amusingly) incredibly unpopular in cigar circles who are calling this the "end of an era". Most discussions seems to center around the doom and gloom of quality dropping and prices increasing as the US/Cuban cigar market opens and the demand for CC increases. No discussion on the legality of owning CC changing amusingly. As apparently everyone forgets that smoking a Cuban Cigar can be considered an…

> smoking a Cuban Cigar can be considered an act of treason currently.

"Treason against the United States, shall consist only in levying war against them, or in adhering to their enemies, giving them aid and comfort. No person shall be convicted of treason unless on the testimony of two witnesses to the same overt act, or on confession in open court."

Like most of the Constitution, I'm sure that there's way more to understanding this section than reading the written words. Nonetheless I'm skeptical of the claim that smoking a cigar could be considered treason.

Re: Cuba and the U.S. will begin to normalize relations

#165

Post by afterburner »

mudil wrote: post #116
Florin_Andrei wrote: post #72

Earlier quoted context omitted.

> my point is that significant trade doesn't necessarily trickle down to the poorest Nothing trickles down to the poorest, spontaneously, almost anywhere in the world.

That's absolutely not true. People live better across the world today than they lived 50 or even 20 years ago. I read statistics somewhere that people in some obscure African country today (can't recall the name) have a living standards of Finland of 20 years ago. Think about this: the major health issue nowadays across the world is obesity, not hunger.

The key word was "spontaneously". You have to make sure the money gets there.

Re: Cuba and the U.S. will begin to normalize relations

#166

Post by joezydeco »

encoderer wrote: post #122
joezydeco wrote: post #17

The timing seems really clever here. The USA and OPEC flood the market with oil (literally), crashing prices and sending the Ruble into a spiral. Just as Cuba starts to worry about Russian support going forward, the USA swoops in to provide some economic bracing.

I think you're giving these people way too much credit. As if the shale oil boom was a plot all along. And it doesn't seem like they've had much support from Russia for most of the last 25 years so why would they worry about losing it now? I think it's tempting to connect the dots. But they're just dots.

I believe Cuba is just collateral damage in the bigger things going on, but if the US can snatch away one of Putin's toys at an opportune time and turn the screws a little harder, why not?

Cuba will happy accept economic aid from the US (in the form of lifted sanctions) in the light that the Russian oil industry faces the possibility of collapse. Everyone expects a sudden humanitarian/tourist opening, but I don't believe that's going to be as quick.

Re: Cuba and the U.S. will begin to normalize relations

#167

Post by mkramlich »

morenoh149 wrote: post #102
glup wrote: post #54

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Agriculture, including tobacco production, accounts for only approximately 4% of Cuban GDP--after heavyweights like tourism (embargo just prevents Americans from going there), gas export, industrial production, and the medical sector. Of greater interest to HN readers than the implications for one trivial luxury good, Cuba has one of the greatest mismatches between literacy (~97%) and telecom development and accessib…

exactly. Awesome opportunity to build a vocational school there to crank out quality devs. :))

I'd argue quality devs are mostly born and self-made and then slowly polished over a long period of time -- not the kinds of folks who are cranked out of a vocational school. It's an intellectual craft. It's not manning a fry bin.

Re: Cuba and the U.S. will begin to normalize relations

#168

Post by [deleted] »

mentalhealth wrote: post #163
mudil wrote: post #137

Earlier quoted context omitted.

I am an anesthesiologist. I worked in some of the best hospitals in the country in residency (UCSF and Harvard's BWH), and I worked in Detroit and I work now in a small Catholic hospital. And I can tell you that quality of care poor get is the same as rich ones get. Then I also grew up in Soviet Union, where supposedly great healthcare was developed. And I can tell you they had a horrible health care like they have i…

And I can tell you that quality of care poor get is the same as rich ones get. That's because you're an anesthesiologist, and you see the acute cases which have already been admitted to the hospital. Poor people don't receive comparable long-term care. They don't receive comparable followup care after procedures. They can't afford lifesaving medication, they can't afford physical therapy, and they can't afford psychi…

[deleted]

Re: Cuba and the U.S. will begin to normalize relations

#169

Post by themartorana »

Amezarak wrote: post #53
themartorana wrote: post #32

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Have to agree. What does Obama have to lose by just going out on a limb and ending a horribly failed policy? Realizing of course there are so many others he promised to end and hasn't...

> Have to agree. What does Obama have to lose by just going out on a limb and ending a horribly failed policy? Because "like so many others" he simply doesn't have the power to; it requires Congressional approval. I suppose he could do what you want and unilaterally declare it over, but that would be a very clear breach of power and would result in many moderates and liberals decrying his overreach. It would end up -…

I know this. But I seriously doubt impeachment.

More interesting would be to see who supports a continued embargo and why? Instead of rubber-stamping it, congressmen would have to take a position one way or the other, and I doubt there's much good argument for its continuation en-masse.

Obama could force Congress to have to address Cuba head-on. I don't know if it's the most important thing or not, but you'd at least get to see why we continue a useless embargo.

Re: Cuba and the U.S. will begin to normalize relations

#170

Post by Someone »

mathattack wrote: post #47
iandanforth wrote: post #7

I've visited Cuba on a Canadian passport. Aside from the beautiful beaches the thing that struck me most was the desperate poverty of people living in shacks outside the 5 star resorts. While I hesitate to predict that this change will be all for the good, I do believe that the poorest in Cuba will benefit significantly from increased trade.

When you start from such a low base, there is enormous room for growth. The question is what can they export? Cigars? Medical personnel?

Cane sugar, nickel (at least, looking at http://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/Cuba#/image/File:Tree_map_exp...) and tourism. Until the Cuban Revolution, Las Vegas had tough competition from Havana (http://petermoruzzi.com/2011/10/31/family-feud-havana-vs-las...)
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