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Spidermonkey has passed V8 on Octane performance

robert.ocallahan.org

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Re: Spidermonkey has passed V8 on Octane performance

#161

Post by MichaelGG »

m_mueller wrote: post #121
swartkrans wrote: post #73

Earlier quoted context omitted.

I'm using Opera instead of Chrome. I use Chrome Canary for web dev, but Opera is basically Chrome sans-Google. It's got all the same features as Chrome as it's based on Chromium. Just none of the Google account features. I've also dumped gmail for fastmail and am trying out duckduckgo, but if that doesn't work out I'll just use Google in an incognito window.

I find duckduckgo quite usable for commonplace CS things such as programming in popular languages. For more obscure things I usually just enter g! [query] into my URL bar, so it will revert to an anonymous google. I find this better even just for the fact that I don't get the filtered down view of the world anymore - if there are things named similarly than the ones I use in the world, I want to know, so I can adjust…

Really? I tried to use DDG, I really did. But the results are just so subpar unless it was a simple "navigational" type search where I knew exactly what I was looking for. I really want to quit Google. I'd even pay for it. But they just dominate by such a large margin.

Re: Spidermonkey has passed V8 on Octane performance

#162

Post by MichaelGG »

MichaelGG wrote: post #98
wlesieutre wrote: post #42

Earlier quoted context omitted.

I've been using FF for a while, but partly switched off when I got a Surface (on account of IE's better touchscreen support). But soon I'll be moving from iOS to Android, the wonderful land of being able to change your default browser. And I'll be using FF there for the bookmark syncing. Firefox on 2/3 devices ain't bad. There was a lot of hate over the australis redesign, but I like it better than Chrome.

Android is also the land where almost every single app can see who you call, who calls you, and get a unique serial number for your phone hardware. All because Google smuggled "check to see if the user's on the phone" permission, which many apps rightfully need, into that whole bundle. As this is technically a very stupid move, it feels like the only way to interpret this is that Google wants more people giving up pr…

For those curious, go look up Phone State and Identity. If an app wants to behave while your in the phone, it also needs to be able to read your IMEI and the number calling or called. So a flashlight app that wants to disable in call can now see that you're calling a cancer doc. This hardly seems accidental, given that knowing if the user is oh the phone isn't s sensitive operation.

As far as Chrome: go compare. Enable things like spell check, which put up a normal little explanation. Then try DNT, which elicits a scary disclaimer and swaps the OK and Cancel buttons.

Re: Spidermonkey has passed V8 on Octane performance

#163

Post by Dylan16807 »

shadowmint wrote: post #160
wyager wrote: post #106

Earlier quoted context omitted.

It is effectively impossible to have an unsafe memory access error in Rust. The compiler eliminates a huge variety of bug types, including null pointer dereferences, use-after-free bugs, memory leaks, etc. All arrays are bounds-checked and rust encourages good programming practice like using abstracted list-processing mechanisms (like mapping instead of loops) and algebraic types instead of e.g. null pointers.

It is effectively impossible to have an unsafe memory access error in Rust Please, don't say that. Lets be reasonable. Rust is great, but Rust code crashes and segfaults too, just like any language, programs have bugs, and those bugs can cause program failure. Rust just has less of them, because it has a smart compiler. ...but it's not right to suggest that it has none. Remember: There is no way of ensuring that a ru…

I don't understand your post. If you mean 'unsafe' as in 'may misbehave' then the compiler can definitely ensure there will be no segmentation faults and there cannot be certain classes of race condition. If you mean 'unsafe' as in the keyword that lets you do dangerous things, it's trivial to check if your source has blocks marked with that keyword.

There's no way to ensure the compiler is perfect, but rust itself is not capable of certain types of errors.

You can always code the wrong algorithm, but that doesn't mean you can segfault or use after free (in the default safe mode you almost never have an excuse to leave).

Re: Spidermonkey has passed V8 on Octane performance

#164

Post by espadrine »

0942v8653 wrote: post #158
oceanstone wrote: post #94

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Don't forget about omnibox predictions. By default, all keystrokes in the address bar are being sent, even while you're logged out. References: "Get predictions in the address bar" https://support.google.com/chrome/answer/95656?hl=en "Logging policies for omnibox predictions" https://support.google.com/chrome/answer/180655?hl=en

uhh… with any "omnibox" UI in any browser, every keystroke is sent to Google.

Based on my current knowledge, I believe you are wrong. Firefox' Desktop Awesomebar (which actually predates Chrome's omnibox) does not send every keystroke to Google[0], and never has.

Even Firefox' Mobile Awesomebar doesn't do that[1] unless you click that "Yes" button.

On the other hand, Google's Chrome browser is clear about the fact that it does send everything in the omnibar[2]:

> When you type URLs or queries in the Chrome address bar (omnibox) or App Launcher search box, the letters you type may be sent to your default search engine so that the search engine’s prediction feature can automatically recommend terms or URLs you may be looking for.

If you still believe you are right, I would be interested in seeing your sources.

[0]: https://support.mozilla.org/en-US/kb/awesome-bar-find-your-b...

[1]: https://blog.mozilla.org/privacy/2013/01/08/search-suggestio...

[2]: https://www.google.com/chrome/browser/privacy/

Re: Spidermonkey has passed V8 on Octane performance

#165

Post by MichaelGG »

shadowmint wrote: post #160
wyager wrote: post #106

Earlier quoted context omitted.

It is effectively impossible to have an unsafe memory access error in Rust. The compiler eliminates a huge variety of bug types, including null pointer dereferences, use-after-free bugs, memory leaks, etc. All arrays are bounds-checked and rust encourages good programming practice like using abstracted list-processing mechanisms (like mapping instead of loops) and algebraic types instead of e.g. null pointers.

It is effectively impossible to have an unsafe memory access error in Rust Please, don't say that. Lets be reasonable. Rust is great, but Rust code crashes and segfaults too, just like any language, programs have bugs, and those bugs can cause program failure. Rust just has less of them, because it has a smart compiler. ...but it's not right to suggest that it has none. Remember: There is no way of ensuring that a ru…

This is misleading. Apart from bugs in the core code (compiler and stdlib) you shouldn't be memory unsafe in an exploitable way. Even segfault from deref null should be rare. It's like saying Java isn't safe because it might call some JNI. While pedantically true, it's qualitatively different.

That's why effectively impossible is an OK statement. Unless you go out of your way, your program will not contain such bugs.

Re: Spidermonkey has passed V8 on Octane performance

#166

Post by Ded7xSEoPKYNsDd »

0942v8653 wrote: post #158
oceanstone wrote: post #94

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Don't forget about omnibox predictions. By default, all keystrokes in the address bar are being sent, even while you're logged out. References: "Get predictions in the address bar" https://support.google.com/chrome/answer/95656?hl=en "Logging policies for omnibox predictions" https://support.google.com/chrome/answer/180655?hl=en

uhh… with any "omnibox" UI in any browser, every keystroke is sent to Google.

The point is: Omnibox in Chrome sends every key stroke. The Awesomebar in Firefox doesn't send anything to Google until you initiate a search.

Re: Spidermonkey has passed V8 on Octane performance

#167

Post by omeid2 »

MichaelGG wrote: post #39
rdtsc wrote: post #3

I have been very impressed by Firefox lately. Kudos to the whole team at Mozilla. Just about 5 years ago, it was looking to me like it was the end of Firefox. It was Chrome all the way. New features were coming out one after another. Faster rendering. Safe process isolation for each tab. Looked better. But I just switched back last month. It happened kind of randomly. Saw an announcement of a new release ( 33, I thin…

Same here. Especially as Google becomes more and more evil, Chrome looks less attractive. Even on mobile, I use FF, despite it needing a lot of work and having a lot of rendering and input issues. And Chrome on Android looks very sexy. On desktop, FF is fine, once more. Rust is also one of the most promising languages with a potentially massive impact on the world. Not only safer software, but exposing more programme…

I am actually still going back and forth between chrome and firefox and it's design was something that was holding me back, specially in a stacking window. Now looking at this I looked through themes and found Simple White[1] something that way out dones chrome and et all in sexy factor.

[1] https://addons.mozilla.org/en-US/firefox/addon/simplewhite/

Re: Spidermonkey has passed V8 on Octane performance

#168

Post by barrkel »

SwellJoe wrote: post #91

I switched back to Firefox from Chrome a couple years ago, because I no longer trust Google to have my best interests at heart. It's been fine; I have a beefy machine with plenty of RAM, but I also use it on my horribly slow Android phone (an old HTC Sensation 4G that has never been worth a crap), and it works OK there, too. My only complaint is that it requires a plugin to get a reasonable number of tabs in a window…

TreeStyleTabs.

Re: Spidermonkey has passed V8 on Octane performance

#169

Post by SquareWheel »

skrowl wrote: post #28
rdtsc wrote: post #3

I have been very impressed by Firefox lately. Kudos to the whole team at Mozilla. Just about 5 years ago, it was looking to me like it was the end of Firefox. It was Chrome all the way. New features were coming out one after another. Faster rendering. Safe process isolation for each tab. Looked better. But I just switched back last month. It happened kind of randomly. Saw an announcement of a new release ( 33, I thin…

I've been reminding everyone I know who still uses Chrome to try Firefox again. Many have switched back. It's simply a better browser. One e10s is in stable, it's going to be even better. Google is a for-profit company that makes money selling your data and targeted, personal ads. Mozilla is not-for-profit and just wants to make the web better.

>makes money selling your data

To... other advertisers? Google is the advertiser. It not only goes against their Terms of Service to sell that data, but also makes zero business sense.

I swear people just make things up when it suits their world views.

Re: Spidermonkey has passed V8 on Octane performance

#170

Post by SquareWheel »

asadotzler wrote: post #74
wodenokoto wrote: post #49

Earlier quoted context omitted.

I'd like to see a source for the billion-dollar-a-year campaign, that sounds crazy. That's 3 times Mozilla's entire budget, if memory serves me right.

365 days a year for several years Google has had a Chrome banner ad on www.google.com showing to Firefox users. That page is the most lucrative property on the web in terms of eyeballs, so take your most outrageous ad rate you can find and do the math. It's billions per year worth of advertising.

It's also completely free for Google to advertise on their own website.
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