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Temporary Cloudflare accounts for AI agents

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Re: Temporary Cloudflare accounts for AI agents

#161

Earlier quoted context omitted.

You're describing a way to get the technical people to do the work, but that was never the problem. If you want them to do it you just tell them to, and then they spend however many hours doing it, instead of doing something else. All technical problems are like that. You throw labor hours and hardware at them and progress is made. The question is, how much does it take, and is it worth that much? Which in turn depen…

Isn't that the point OP made, only repeated?: The price cap functionality which customers want, is missing, not for lack of feasibility or capability (as was previously claimed above), but because the company makes more money overcharging customers, and thus doesn't want to fix the problem.

The cynical option isn't the only one.

Suppose it would cost them X million dollars a year to provide the feature and providing it would cost them nothing in terms of sales, and indeed get them a few more because people like the feature. Well, it still costs them that amount to provide it, so then the question is whether X is less than Y. But you don't control how much it costs them to implement it, only how much of your business you're going to take somewhere else without it, and if nobody is willing to do that then why would you expect them to spend the money?

It doesn't have to be that they're purposely screwing you. It's just that if you don't care enough to choose differently then why would they?

Re: Temporary Cloudflare accounts for AI agents

#162

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Isn't that the point OP made, only repeated?: The price cap functionality which customers want, is missing, not for lack of feasibility or capability (as was previously claimed above), but because the company makes more money overcharging customers, and thus doesn't want to fix the problem.

The cynical option isn't the only one. Suppose it would cost them X million dollars a year to provide the feature and providing it would cost them nothing in terms of sales, and indeed get them a few more because people like the feature. Well, it still costs them that amount to provide it, so then the question is whether X is less than Y. But you don't control how much it costs them to implement it, only how much of…

> The cynical option isn't the only one.

> Suppose it would cost them X million dollars a year to provide the feature and providing it would cost them nothing in terms of sales, and indeed get them a few more because people like the feature. Well, it still costs them that amount to provide it, so then the question is whether X is less than Y.

lol, that is the cynical option!

It's just "we profit more by charging people for overages than we would if we put in a price cap", with more words!

It's the same as making a subscription people can enroll in online, but cancelling it requires going to the HQ in person, or writing a registered mail demand letter, etc.

After all, why build a way to cancel online subscriptions online if X is more than Y? Maybe it's more profitable to keep charging people for something they don't want.

"The cynical option" is any option which consistently puts pure profitability ahead of doing the right thing by customers, society, or human decency in general, and that is precisely the Cloudflare decision criteria we're discussing.

Re: Temporary Cloudflare accounts for AI agents

#163
post #62

Earlier quoted context omitted.

I’m running entire leadjobs.dev on cloudflare workers and its kind of unreliable for the traffic it gets - around 100 visitors/day. There are some weird errors in d1 from time to time which i cannot debug since its all black box. Also latencies are greater than I would expect, especially, again for d1. Overall its great value for money to get a globally available, low latency service - but I would think twice before…

I'll let you in on a sort of dirty secret: It's almost always better to use Durable Objects storage, rather than D1. Even if you only want a single global database, it's better to implement that as a singleton Durable Object, than by using D1. Because that's all D1 itself actually is: a singleton Durable Object that exposes an API to its SQLite database. It's just a wrapper. With raw Durable Objects, you get to bring…

It would really help if this advice was more legible to agents. Spent the last week in Claude Code building a reasonably complex app running entirely on CF Workers, Containers, KV, and D1. Pages were slow due to the multiple round trips to storage on each page since Claude Code used D1. Despite repeated prompting Claude Code had no suggestions for how to improve within the CF platform. I ended up having Claude Code switch to Postgres with an eye towards switching the compute layer to AWS in the near future, since I'm very familiar with how to get performance out of that platform. Claude Code overcame my lack of familiarity to get something running on CF, but it wasn't good enough to get a design that could perform.

Re: Temporary Cloudflare accounts for AI agents

#164
post #159

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Just had 10 rounds of busses, motorcycles and fire hydrants with Google before I decided I don't actually want to see that page so much. So Cloudflare is unfortunately not the only offender here.

There's a certain type of Recaptcha challenge (the 4x4 single-photo one) that I have a 100% failure rate on. If Google decide to serve me 15 of those in a row, I will invariably fail 15 times until they decide to serve one of the other types for round 16. I'm very close to believing that that challenge is actually bugged and unsolvable for everyone, and simply nobody ever bothered to fix it.

Nah, I think this is Google's way of pushing against those who value privacy. Firefox? With uBO? No cookies? Not fetching Google fonts? Must be a bot for sure. /s

Re: Temporary Cloudflare accounts for AI agents

#167

Earlier quoted context omitted.

The cynical option isn't the only one. Suppose it would cost them X million dollars a year to provide the feature and providing it would cost them nothing in terms of sales, and indeed get them a few more because people like the feature. Well, it still costs them that amount to provide it, so then the question is whether X is less than Y. But you don't control how much it costs them to implement it, only how much of…

> The cynical option isn't the only one. > Suppose it would cost them X million dollars a year to provide the feature and providing it would cost them nothing in terms of sales, and indeed get them a few more because people like the feature. Well, it still costs them that amount to provide it, so then the question is whether X is less than Y. lol, that is the cynical option! It's just "we profit more by charging peop…

We can distinguish between two things, right?

1) They don't build it because they purposely want to screw customers with overage charges.

2) They don't build it because building it costs money and the customer demand (i.e. willingness to switch) over that feature isn't sufficient to justify the expense.

The first one is way more cynical than the second one.

Re: Temporary Cloudflare accounts for AI agents

#168

Earlier quoted context omitted.

> The cynical option isn't the only one. > Suppose it would cost them X million dollars a year to provide the feature and providing it would cost them nothing in terms of sales, and indeed get them a few more because people like the feature. Well, it still costs them that amount to provide it, so then the question is whether X is less than Y. lol, that is the cynical option! It's just "we profit more by charging peop…

We can distinguish between two things, right? 1) They don't build it because they purposely want to screw customers with overage charges. 2) They don't build it because building it costs money and the customer demand (i.e. willingness to switch) over that feature isn't sufficient to justify the expense. The first one is way more cynical than the second one.

The first one is a straw man, a cartoon villain misanthrope. If your point is "at least they hurt people for money, rather than out of savage hatred", I guess that is an optimistic way of seeing things.

The second one is what everyone here is talking about, and it is the cynical option. The non-cynical option would be doing the right thing every once in a while, even if it doesn't earn profits.

Re: Temporary Cloudflare accounts for AI agents

#169
post #157

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Cloudflare support is pretty active and very responsive to incidents. Here's a token of appreciation.

I report several phishing sites to them per week. They take ages to respond, often close to a week. And often, the response will be that they couldn't find any abuse, because I also report to the host which is often much quicker to respond. Any process that doesn't take down phishing sites within a few hours at most is inadequate for protecting potential victims. Especially when I compare it to all the other provider…

Pretty much this. We see CF hosted/protected content all the time. CF does nothing for days or weeks. By then the campaign is gone and on a new account etc. Tycoon and Kratos are two phish kits that heavily use CF.

CF does have small anti-abuse teams, but it’s just not a business priority for the company to do better. We’ve tried many times to engage at a corporate level and the bottom line is they don’t care - they don’t want to police content as often stated by the executives.

Re: Temporary Cloudflare accounts for AI agents

#170
post #47

Looks like Cloudflare still haven't shipped the most valuable possible feature for Cloudflare Workers though: hard billing caps. I want to set a cap of $100/month and know, for sure, that if something untoward happens my apps will all stop serving traffic rather than me getting hit with a bill for $1000s. The safest way to use Workers is on the free tier, which will shut off after 100,000 requests/day: https://develo…

It's not valuable for them to have this, and not because they want to skim big bills off of little guys. It's because customers small enough to care about this are not only not worth the investment in the feature, even having them on the platform is nearly a net negative.

Having the little guys on Cloudflare is most of the reason why HN regularly talks about Cloudflare.
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