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Digital Sovereignty Becomes an Imperative as the US Reads Dutch Emails

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Re: Digital Sovereignty Becomes an Imperative as the US Reads Dutch Emails

#161

Post by lII1lIlI11ll »

Chris2048 wrote: post #157
lII1lIlI11ll wrote: post #153

Earlier quoted context omitted.

> where do you get power Wind, hydro, sun? This is 2026 after all. > personnel Depends on what that theoretical country would offer. Some kind of strong constitutionally-enshrined protections for privacy and perhaps from tyranny-of-the-majority exploiting upper-middle class like all other western countries and with strong IT jobs market? Are you kidding, sign me up!

The original post was "somewhere in Antarctic", what does that offer?

I chose Antarctic as an example because it is one of few places on Earth with significant uninhabited land where one could theoretically establish a new sovereign state. Are you implying that all popular green energy technologies are somehow unfeasible there?

Re: Digital Sovereignty Becomes an Imperative as the US Reads Dutch Emails

#162

Post by themaninthedark »

postepowanieadm wrote: post #5

They have been doing it for years? ECHELON isn't exactly new. Also, recent EU and UK actions are not exactly privacy friendly.

So they aren't one of the Five Eyes, they joined later...

https://tuta.com/blog/fourteen-eyes-countries

And are proposing their own EU version as well....

>Incoming Dutch coalition floats European version of ‘Five Eyes’

https://www.politico.eu/article/new-dutch-government-floats-...

Re: Digital Sovereignty Becomes an Imperative as the US Reads Dutch Emails

#163

Post by AnthonyMouse »

hnben wrote: post #72
mrtksn wrote: post #70

Earlier quoted context omitted.

I don't think Americans understand what US used to mean for the rest of the world. America was supposed to be the next step of humanity, a new land stripped from the ills of the old world where you invest or you go to build things, where your past or identity wasn't the primary concern but your dreams your abilities were. It wasn't nationalistic place, it was open to all and pretty much it was the group work of human…

> America was supposed to be the next step of humanity, a new land stripped from the ills of the old wor wat

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/The_New_Colossus

Re: Digital Sovereignty Becomes an Imperative as the US Reads Dutch Emails

#164

Post by mrtksn »

notabotiswear wrote: post #148
mrtksn wrote: post #116

Earlier quoted context omitted.

I think you need to read more carefully, you are arguing against things you imagine I said. Write down what you believe you are objecting to, try to find that in the things I wrote.

>Americans themselves were used to seen as blameless, since those things were against what US stands for. ...

What do you think that means exactly? Please consider to use words instead of dots. I am sure that those dots have some concrete meaning but that is in your head, we are different people and I am not able to read what you constructed in your imagination.

Re: Digital Sovereignty Becomes an Imperative as the US Reads Dutch Emails

#165

Post by icantevenhold »

mrtksn wrote: post #80
icantevenhold wrote: post #74

Earlier quoted context omitted.

This kind of sums up my sentiment. All throughout my adult life the US (for all its apparent faults) was to me a shining example of progress and humanity. It was the best large scale implementation of human rights, laws, and democracy. Sure it was far from perfect but “as good as it gets, for now” Became very disillusioned with that image of the US in the last couple of years. Maybe it’s always been like that - but t…

Yes, US was also the guide star when it comes to dilemmas. When not sure, check out what Americans do and they will probably have it figured it out without the bias that we may have due to historical reasons. I firmly believe that the dominant feeling towards US today isn't anger or hate, its heartbreak and disappointment.

That’s a good way to frame it.

It might be different for US Americans themselves and a lot of other countries as well; but for a large part of the west this was/is true

Re: Digital Sovereignty Becomes an Imperative as the US Reads Dutch Emails

#166

Post by Chris2048 »

lII1lIlI11ll wrote: post #161
Chris2048 wrote: post #157

Earlier quoted context omitted.

The original post was "somewhere in Antarctic", what does that offer?

I chose Antarctic as an example because it is one of few places on Earth with significant uninhabited land where one could theoretically establish a new sovereign state. Are you implying that all popular green energy technologies are somehow unfeasible there?

Yes, the "somehow" is that no one want to live there, and the associated expense of building there probably outweighs the benefits. I'm also sceptical you could establish a new sovereign state there.

Re: Digital Sovereignty Becomes an Imperative as the US Reads Dutch Emails

#167

Post by AnthonyMouse »

ForHackernews wrote: post #132
SidewaysView wrote: post #115

Earlier quoted context omitted.

The constitution is a piece of paper written by dead white men. Principles have never been about that. The world has never been about that. It's never been something anyone who wasn't "that kind of nerd" could believe in. Not even up for debate.

You say that, but pieces of paper written by dead white men have remade the world for good and for ill. All of 20th century history stands in the shadow of Das Kapital .

It seems like a specific thing has changed.

It used to be that when the US did something bad, people would point to the constitution and the American ideals and say "this isn't living up to our promise".

Now instead when people point to the constitution and American ideals people say "those were written by dead white men" as if to justify cynically discarding them in favor of something heinous.

Re: Digital Sovereignty Becomes an Imperative as the US Reads Dutch Emails

#168

Post by gib444 »

Schlagbohrer wrote: post #96

Europe and many other nations will look back on the early 21st century and wonder how they ever thought it was a good idea to willingly give up so much soverignity to foreign powers

Well the history is more complex than that - let's not rewrite it. The US bossed around and bullied large parts of Europe for decades (and still does). Often we did not have a choice (or, siding with the US was the least-bad option)

Re: Digital Sovereignty Becomes an Imperative as the US Reads Dutch Emails

#169

Post by gib444 »

hunglee2 wrote: post #2

One understated outcome of Trump 2.0 is waking up some sections of the European intelligentsia to the risk of dependency on the United States. Trump 1.0 should've been enough, but instead European leaders were just too thankful for a Biden back-to-normal scenario that they basically took no action allowing the US to further extend its dominance. Better late than never. Incidentally, trying to build EU tech independen…

> basically took no action allowing the US to further extend its dominance.

I love this. Do you think everything is in Europe's control? Do you know anything about the US has operated since WW2? Have you noticed the mismatch in economic and military might between the two regions?

And what about all the US military bases in Europe? Do you think it's simply a case of asking them to please leave within 1 year, thanks, goodbye.

They've had us in a headlock for a very very long time

Re: Digital Sovereignty Becomes an Imperative as the US Reads Dutch Emails

#170

Post by hinata08 »

beloch wrote: post #94

If a politically stable nation with a good international reputation were to guarantee government respect for data privacy for data centres housed on its soil and run by its companies, that nation could become the Swiss bankers of data. Rolling your own "digital sovereignty" is not going to be cheap for most nations, and many other nations simply won't be trusted by anyone, least of all their own citizens. It's a bit…

> Rolling your own "digital sovereignty" is not going to be cheap for most nations

neither are Microsoft 365 subscriptions at governmental scales

No offence, but I do believe a few Dutch ppl could run email servers for cheaper

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