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Hindenburg’s Smoking Room

airships.net

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Re: Hindenburg’s Smoking Room

#161

Post by hnlmorg »

kortilla wrote: post #113
dangus wrote: post #57

Earlier quoted context omitted.

In the context of the alternative which was “nobody really smokes or vapes” it’s not really a good outcome. Sure, smoking rates cratered. It was great. But now vaping rates have gone up and it just didn’t have to happen that way at all. Go back a few years and less people vaped with similarly low smoking rates. Vaping didn’t replace smoking, its net new usage.

No, the context was getting a handle on smoking, not some alternative goalpost. As lung cancer rates plummet from lack of second hand smoke nobody should ever lament that even if people are doing something else not great. Classic “perfect is the enemy of good”.

That’s a little like celebrating the reduction of heroin usage while ignoring that fentanyl addition has sky rocketed.

While I do agree that vaping is better than smoking. The real crux of the problem is the addition that needs treating. Celebrating the rise of vaping feels a little like celebrating an own goal. You’ve put all that time and effort into reducing the effects of smoking and yet you haven’t actually solved the underlying problem at all.

This isn’t “perfect is the enemy of good”, this is ensuring that tax money is spent on the right problem and not something more financially comfortable for companies producing these addictive substances.

Re: Hindenburg’s Smoking Room

#162

Post by simonebrunozzi »

gwbas1c wrote: post #42

One interesting lesson from airships is about disruption and how people take old assumptions into new paradigms. Today we're used to being on plans for short periods of time. We get on, sit down, wait, and then arrive at our destination. Airships came about when long distance travel meant you were spending multiple days in a vehicle, either a train or boat. An airship was a place that was set up for you to spend a fe…

> with a place to stay, lounge, and eat

As clearly seen in the Indiana Jones movie number 3, with Sean Connery. Loved these scenes!

Re: Hindenburg’s Smoking Room

#163

Post by fragmede »

hnlmorg wrote: post #161
kortilla wrote: post #113

Earlier quoted context omitted.

No, the context was getting a handle on smoking, not some alternative goalpost. As lung cancer rates plummet from lack of second hand smoke nobody should ever lament that even if people are doing something else not great. Classic “perfect is the enemy of good”.

That’s a little like celebrating the reduction of heroin usage while ignoring that fentanyl addition has sky rocketed. While I do agree that vaping is better than smoking. The real crux of the problem is the addition that needs treating. Celebrating the rise of vaping feels a little like celebrating an own goal. You’ve put all that time and effort into reducing the effects of smoking and yet you haven’t actually solv…

But without the inordinately deleterious effects of smoking, why is it a bad thing? Nicotine is a powerful nootropic and enhances cognitive function. If there was a healthy way to get it into the body, it would be celebrated as a good thing. The comparison to look at is caffeine and coffee. Is a coffee addict someone we look down on, and hope they would quit?

I'm not arguing that vaping is healthy, just that, culturally, we should examine how much the argument against vaping is because of the history of smoking and the culture surrounding it, rather than an objective consideration of the benefits and consequences of the activity.

(Ftr, imo disposable vapes are absolutely the worst.)

Re: Hindenburg’s Smoking Room

#165

Post by jiri »

TacticalCoder wrote: post #95
canpan wrote: post #89

Earlier quoted context omitted.

These places still exist, but you need to look for them. Here in Japan, some remote islands, you can travel overnight boat. I love those. There might be a speed boat or plane, but I love boarding the boat in the evening, everyone feels like having a party, sleeping in a bed and arriving fresh in the morning. (If you are in Tokyo, the nearest is Oshima Island). There is also slow rail travel, with pretty trains, sleep…

> I think Europe has sleeper trains too. Europe has sleeping boats too: you can go from, say, south east of France to the Baelaric island (like Ibiza) in 12 hours overnight.

Yeah - I regularly go to Corsica from Italy or France, overnight. It's nice when you have to drive several hours to the port, but if I lived near the port, I would definitely go for day travel — it's much faster and way cheaper.

Re: Hindenburg’s Smoking Room

#166

Post by onetokeoverthe »

edm0nd wrote: post #141
Brian_K_White wrote: post #131

Earlier quoted context omitted.

No one takes the train in the US because they don't go anywhere you need to go and aren't nice to be on.

They are also simply too expensive that's why no one takes them imo. Why spend $2,500-$5,000 and your trip takes ~30+ hours when you can spend $650 and get there in a few hours via flying

it's expensive but it's $500.

you dont have to go first CLass.

Re: Hindenburg’s Smoking Room

#167

Post by iso1631 »

jasonkester wrote: post #152
canpan wrote: post #89

Earlier quoted context omitted.

These places still exist, but you need to look for them. Here in Japan, some remote islands, you can travel overnight boat. I love those. There might be a speed boat or plane, but I love boarding the boat in the evening, everyone feels like having a party, sleeping in a bed and arriving fresh in the morning. (If you are in Tokyo, the nearest is Oshima Island). There is also slow rail travel, with pretty trains, sleep…

There are good overnight ferries from England to France, Ireland and the Netherlands. Cheap too. We live in France and often spend the summer visiting family in the north of England. For a family of four, it works out about the same price to take the Rotterdam to Hull night ferry (outside cabin, meals and all) as it would to go through Calais and spend the night in a hotel instead. And then it’s 2 hours of driving in…

Spain, Shetland, Channel Islands too. Sadly the old overnights to Denmark and Norway no longer run.

Loads in the Baltic and Mederteranian too, Spain to the Canaries and Mallorca, Sicily to Naples, Venice and many other Italian ports to Greece, several in Greece. Alas no longer a ferry from Greece to Cyprus/Israel/Egypt.

Bulgaria to Georgia too [0], cross the caspian sea [1].

[0] https://horizonhunt.com/en/a-slightly-differen-cruise-ferry-...

[1] https://www.madornomad.com/caspian-sea-ferry/

Re: Hindenburg’s Smoking Room

#168

Post by rob74 »

Waterluvian wrote: post #5

It’s really amazing just what extent people went to in order to smoke. Apparently people smoked on submarines for a while. And planes. And everywhere else. Smoking is just such a disease and it feels like only now are we kind of getting a handle on it.

Yeah, that was my first thought too - why not just ban smoking on the airship altogether? But then again, before smoke detectors were invented, it was better to provide a place where people could smoke under monitored conditions than have them smoke clandestinely somewhere where it might be dangerous...

Re: Hindenburg’s Smoking Room

#169

Post by b65e8bee43c2ed0 »

hnlmorg wrote: post #87
b65e8bee43c2ed0 wrote: post #86

Earlier quoted context omitted.

the flavorants are fairly mysterious, yeah. we know diacetyl is bad to inhale, we don't know how many others are. but if you DIY, only propylene glycol and nicotine are strictly required. vegetable glycerin and flavorants are optional. I'd choose even the most mysterious Chinese bathtub e-juice over cigarettes though.

Or, maybe do neither ?

if you aren't already a smoker? yes, absolutely. but if you are, and you are not the one in ten who has the iron will to quit cold turkey and never relapse, you're better off getting your nicotine fix delivered by ANY medium other than toxic smoke.

Re: Hindenburg’s Smoking Room

#170

Post by b65e8bee43c2ed0 »

cogogo wrote: post #91
b65e8bee43c2ed0 wrote: post #63

Earlier quoted context omitted.

on the contrary, I strongly believe that tobacco companies are the driving force behind the attempts to equate vaping and smoking. idk about the current year, but tobacco companies had little to no influence over the vaping market during its early years. the hardware was 5% American from small companies and 95% Chinese, the nicotine fluid had local producers everywhere because of how cheap and easy it is to make. alm…

I think the argument is that vaping is far more addictive for young people because of exactly what you say. Does not feel harmful and they end up very addicted at higher doses of nicotine than cigarettes

so let it only be sold to adults, sure. I'm just saying that equating vaping to smoking is absurd, because it's not nicotine that breaks your heart and your dick and gives you cancer, it's the smoke.
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