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We're no longer attracting top talent: the brain drain killing American science

theguardian.com

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Re: We're no longer attracting top talent: the brain drain killing American science

#161

Post by tzs »

oytis wrote: post #110
nerevarthelame wrote: post #101

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Terrence Tao expressed sentiments are at odds with you and which align with the article: > The U.S. used to be sort of the default, the no brainer, option. If you got an offer from a top U.S. university, this was like almost the best thing that could happen to you as an academic ... If it's just a less welcoming, atmosphere for science in general here, the best and brightest may not automatically come to the US as th…

He has a point, but there are no obvious alternatives. It's still a long way towards fascism for USA to actually lose its attractiveness, and it's not that other countries are getting more democratic either

For mathematics Europe is an obvious alternative. The US and Europe produce about the same level of high level mathematics research per year.

Re: We're no longer attracting top talent: the brain drain killing American science

#162

Post by [deleted] »

dheera wrote: post #54
inglor_cz wrote: post #40

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Not everything is about money. The killer app of the US used to be that the US was rich and welcoming to foreigners and politically quite free. China or Saudi Arabia can wave their money around, but at least some people will be repulsed by the obligation to keep their mouths shut and praise the Dear Leader. Their cultural insularity does not help either. You can live in China, but you will never be accepted as Chines…

> Not everything is about money. It is when researchers can't make enough money to eat and live, which is an actual reality in the US right now. Researchers at top institutions often make less than Uber drivers. There are other countries where you can live on less and the government isn't dipping their hands into your pockets every 5 seconds.

[deleted]

Re: We're no longer attracting top talent: the brain drain killing American science

#163

Post by eleventyseven »

ohyoutravel wrote: post #131
eleventyseven wrote: post #96

Earlier quoted context omitted.

> I'm not sure how anyone with a functional desire to improve humanity decides "Hey, those americans, they sure do deserve better vaccines." Because people understand that people don't get to choose their government or culture and that everyone deserves better healthcare. Every child who is at risk from the rise of anti-vax 100% deserves better vaccines and ought to bear 0% responsibility for what the adults do.

Lots of folks vote against better healthcare. Perhaps they “deserve” better healthcare regardless as they’re human, but perhaps they deserve the outcomes they specifically voted for. Otherwise it feels a little paternalistic.

[flagged]

Re: We're no longer attracting top talent: the brain drain killing American science

#164

Post by AuthAuth »

jazz9k wrote: post #143
e40 wrote: post #114

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Meanwhile, China has "genius camps" for young people, to skim off the cream of the cream of the crop, so they can go on to do amazing things for their country. It blows my mind what we've done in the last year, to damage our ability to compete on the world stage.

[flagged]

Its calling for the US to stop copying the bad parts of Chinese Policy and go back to matching the good parts.

Re: We're no longer attracting top talent: the brain drain killing American science

#165

Post by flawn »

nerevarthelame wrote: post #101
xiphias2 wrote: post #79

USA is still one of the top countries for scientists. Just as an example Europe had a few years of exporting the best GLP-1 drugs (finally something in which Europe was leader in science), Eli Lily quickly took it over. In software San Francisco is still the top for AI research: even when Peter Steinberger didn't know what he will do with OpenClaw, it was clear to him that the only place to move to was USA. Terrence…

Terrence Tao expressed sentiments are at odds with you and which align with the article: > The U.S. used to be sort of the default, the no brainer, option. If you got an offer from a top U.S. university, this was like almost the best thing that could happen to you as an academic ... If it's just a less welcoming, atmosphere for science in general here, the best and brightest may not automatically come to the US as th…

A more lengthy article about his resentment against the government: https://newsletter.ofthebrave.org/p/im-an-award-winning-math...

Re: We're no longer attracting top talent: the brain drain killing American science

#166

Post by kg »

ljsprague wrote: post #71
beloch wrote: post #25

>"Billions of dollars have been wiped from research budgets, almost 8,000 grants have been cancelled at NIH and the US National Science Foundation alone, and more than 1,000 NIH employees have been fired." ---------------- Scientists go where science is funded. A large proportion of U.S. scientists are also immigrants, who will tend to go where immigrants are welcomed.

They sound like very loyal people who I would love to have as my compatriots.

Loyalty is earned. They don't owe me or you any loyalty if we mistreat them.

Re: We're no longer attracting top talent: the brain drain killing American science

#167

Post by pchristensen »

pessimizer wrote: post #106
SetTheorist wrote: post #78

Earlier quoted context omitted.

77,302,580 people voted for Trump in 2024. That is not "half the country". Nor does he or ever did have the support of "(over) half the country". His maximum approval level in 2025 was at the beginning of his term at 47% "approve" and is currently around 36%, according to the Gallup poll.

It's over half the electorate. Stop changing the standards for democracy and holding the current ex-wrestling valet and game show host to standards than literally no one has been held to in history. It's a desperate, dishonest way to cover up the failure of the opposition to be any better.

There's a huge difference between "definitely won the election" and "a massive mandate for sweeping change".

Re: We're no longer attracting top talent: the brain drain killing American science

#168

Post by juniperus »

seattle_spring wrote: post #153
robk wrote: post #111

Earlier quoted context omitted.

I live in a civilized European country and gravely miss the freedom of speech I had in the USA that I don't here. I'm terrified one tweet will get me jailed for 30 months.

Considering the degree of "hate speech" a Tweet would have to contain to land someone in jail includes direct incitements of violence, I'm scared to ask what sort of opinion you'd like to share that you feel you legally cannot. The claim that you get thrown in jail in London "just for sharing your opinion" is a myth, unless your opinion is, "round up everyone of race X, put them in a hotel, and burn the hotel down."

the amount of people arrested for online activity in England is not the best example to use if you're arguing that such events are rare.

otherwise, your incredulity to such a belief is why the far-right continues to gain a constituency in Europe and elsewhere. so instead of dismissing the concern, which fuels the far-right, you could just acknowledge it is a real thing people are experiencing, and that it doesn't help a liberal free society to criminalize thoughts that are unsavory to the political elite.

Re: We're no longer attracting top talent: the brain drain killing American science

#169

Post by paulddraper »

michaelteter wrote: post #126
inglor_cz wrote: post #40

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Not everything is about money. The killer app of the US used to be that the US was rich and welcoming to foreigners and politically quite free. China or Saudi Arabia can wave their money around, but at least some people will be repulsed by the obligation to keep their mouths shut and praise the Dear Leader. Their cultural insularity does not help either. You can live in China, but you will never be accepted as Chines…

Are you suggesting that anyone who lives and works here in the US can be accepted as “American”? Are you also implying that in the US anyone is free to speak negatively of “dear leader”? There are a multitude of current examples to the contrary.

> There are a multitude of current examples to the contrary.

I see negative opinions of government officials constantly.

It's basically all I see whenever I have the misfortune of turning on the TV.

Re: We're no longer attracting top talent: the brain drain killing American science

#170

Post by pitched »

School-Cotton wrote: post #155
pitched wrote: post #150

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Canada is 70% white where the US is close to 50%. That 20% puts them far above the majority line though. Not at all homogeneous, just much more so than the US.

"White" is not one ethnicity or culture -- a lot of that 70% are French-speaking Quebeckers who surely cannot be considered part of a homogeneous mass with Anglo-Canadians.

I’m upvoting you because you’re 110% right but don’t discount how diverse the US is too, without an obvious divider like that. The New Orleans Cajun are also French immigrants, for example.
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