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Why senior engineers let bad projects fail

lalitm.com

161–168 of 168 posts

Re: Why senior engineers let bad projects fail

#161
post #44
post #35

Earlier quoted context omitted.

> Reminds me of one of my managers who said, “Sometimes, you have to let people fail.” I often say "Sometimes, you have to let the manager fail." Some managers don't like being told their ideas won't work. If you refuse or argue, you are seen as the reason his idea failed. I've found what works best with them is to proceed with the work, but keep them informed very frequently, so they can see how things evolve, and w…

I can’t imagine holding a job where I had to do work that I expect will fail. Sounds absolutely depressing. What keeps you motivated?

> I can’t imagine holding a job where I had to do work that I expect will fail. Sounds absolutely depressing. What keeps you motivated?

The paycheck. I had never expected work to NOT be depressing by definition, though. The only reason I'm working on what my employee wants me to is because I can't afford to live otherwise. They'll get the minimal effort needed for me to not get fired, but not a single minute more.

Re: Why senior engineers let bad projects fail

#162
If the author had replaced the term "UX" with design, then the article would make more sense to me. To continue with the misuse of UX in IT to mean fancy and unnecessary design seems quite strange, because design has always been a factor in how successful projects will be (not just the interface but the whole process of delivery on an outcome).

Re: Why senior engineers let bad projects fail

#163
I don't think it is just big companies. I worked for startups and small companies; when there are a number of managers/VP's involved there is trouble. Bad ideas persist because managers/leaders do not throw stones at each other. As an engineer I tend to just do what makes sense then justify it afterwards; I have trouble with managers who are just administrators with no relevant technical background.

Re: Why senior engineers let bad projects fail

#164

I think this advice is pretty apt for small to medium sized companies. We're all invested in the company succeeding, but you don't want to become known as the person that always says "no". At large companies, I've rarely found a reason to speak out on a project. Unless it has a considerable effect on my team/work (read: peace of mind), it just doesn't make sense to be the person casting doubt. There's not much ROI fo…

The effort required to be ready with the fix is often SO much less than what you need to convince folks the problem exists in the first place. I find it's frequently the only viable option on an individual or team scale.

Re: Why senior engineers let bad projects fail

#165
Open source project maintenance follows a similar model, but with a different set of stakes.

The "price tag" of voicing concerns is lower, yet raise them too often and you still earn a reputation as obstructionist. Meanwhile, the cost of accepting problematic changes can be higher—you may end up maintaining that code long after changing jobs. And unlike corporate politics, the "influence bank account" is public: communications are archived indefinitely.

There is a fascinating shift in how "withdrawals" are calculated: In a corporate hierarchy, the cost of dissent feels exponential: something like `cost = exp(their_level - your_level)`. Say, as a Google L3/L4/L5 engineer, opposing L6-L8 feels like trying to make a massive withdrawal with a tiny balance. In contrast, in OSS the cost almost stays constant despite the corporate level difference.

This created a paradox for me: leaving Google means less time for LLVM maintenance, but it also lets me voice objections more freely, without the shadow of internal performance ratings or hierarchical friction.

That said, I know I've been "withdrawing" heavily, including from a lot of previous colleagues. In a recent LLVM Project Council meeting:

> There is a pattern of behavior here of blocking contributions due to concerns about maintenance cost and design simplicity.

(I appreciate the transparency of making these meetings public, by the way.)

I had to respond at https://discourse.llvm.org/t/llvm-project-council-meeting-no...

Re: Why senior engineers let bad projects fail

#167
post #82

Are people here reading the article comfortable sharing it, or similar articles, with their teams? I can't do it, and i'm not really sure why.

This article resonates with me a lot, but as a senior engineer I would not share it in a big team setting. Even though it's correct, it's too cynical for big team morale. I think it would be worth sharing with peers or managers when discussing whether and how to intervene on a bad project.

Re: Why senior engineers let bad projects fail

#168

From the article: > You rarely get credit for the disasters you prevented. Because nothing happened, people forget about it quickly. There is another problem left implicit in the article: clueless people doing drive-by project reviews without any context or understanding of the whole problem domain, and proceeding to give unsolicited and unreflected advice supported by partial knowledge. Also, sometimes projects with…

I use the phrase "drive-by review" frequently too. As a senior engineer, I worry about doing drive-bys myself. Sometimes my gut tells me something is not quite right about the project, but I just don't know enough about the problem domain or technology/architecture choices to advise definitively.

In this case, I try to question the project owners on their assumptions and whether they have validated them. Usually this line of questioning reveals whether they have "done their homework".

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