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Electric vehicle sales are booming in South America – without Tesla

reuters.com

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Re: Electric vehicle sales are booming in South America – without Tesla

#161

Post by JojoFatsani »

Animats wrote: post #14
juujian wrote: post #2

Not just Tesla, all established brands we know are left behind. I never understood Volkswagen's pivot from 'wait and See's to 'were inversing billions' to 'we were too late, abort'. Largest brands n terms of units, completely left behind in an emerging segment that's already dominating it's largest market (China). So many executives in the industry just didn't see the writing on the wall. I don't what GM was thinking…

Although Ford's CEO now gets it, Ford's product line doesn't reflect it yet. Farley has been bringing a few sample BYD cars to the US, for Ford people to drive around and to take apart. Farley dragged his executive team to China to see a BYD plant. They came back scared. But what Ford actually sells is 1) an F-150 converted to electric, 2) a Ford Mustang converted to electric, and 3) a Ford Transit converted to elect…

You’re mischaracterizing the Mustang Mach-E which never should have been named that because it has nothing to do with the ICE Mustang at all aside from the horsey badge.

Re: Electric vehicle sales are booming in South America – without Tesla

#162

Post by le-mark »

weinzierl wrote: post #18

When I grew up in Germany it always made me proud that 100% of taxis were Mercedes Benz. If a car can withstand the rough demands of taxi service, it has to be good. And even in South America back then German cares were ubiquitous, especially Volkswagen. When I was in Brazil this spring[*] I rode a lot of Uber and they were 100% BYD - 100%, no exception. It's not that my head hadn't known that German auto was dead bu…

Note the Mercedes as taxis in Germany are not the high end luxury car imports we are accustomed to seeing in the US. Mercedes makes a lot of more affordable cars for their domestic market we never see here!

Re: Electric vehicle sales are booming in South America – without Tesla

#163

Post by JojoFatsani »

darth_avocado wrote: post #37
Animats wrote: post #14

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Although Ford's CEO now gets it, Ford's product line doesn't reflect it yet. Farley has been bringing a few sample BYD cars to the US, for Ford people to drive around and to take apart. Farley dragged his executive team to China to see a BYD plant. They came back scared. But what Ford actually sells is 1) an F-150 converted to electric, 2) a Ford Mustang converted to electric, and 3) a Ford Transit converted to elect…

Ford is a bad example because they’ve pretty much abandoned all their non truck and transit van segments for years. Even if EVs weren’t a thing, they do not compete in any of the segments and haven’t for almost a decade. First it was Japanese and German companies eating their lunch, now it’s the Chinese. Also, F150 lightening is such a failure. There was a recent video of it trying to haul very minimal load and it pr…

The Lightning really isn’t meant for towing a horse trailer cross country. It’s meant for hauling a new vanity or a couple sheets of drywall from Home Depot. It does that suburban warrior stuff quite competently.

Re: Electric vehicle sales are booming in South America – without Tesla

#164

Post by JojoFatsani »

lostlogin wrote: post #55
reisse wrote: post #45

Earlier quoted context omitted.

I thought Toyota is doing quite well in emerging markets? However they skipped a lot of EV craziness and just do cheap-and-reliable ICE cars. I also never understood why established brands lobbied for EVs, and not against them. They clearly had no edge over Tesla and Chinese brands, why compete on rival's field?

Toyota hasn’t offered pure electric where I am, just hybrids. And they have only just started offering plug in models I can charge. I’d love a Corolla or Camri EV - I’m not sure what ‘the Corolla of EVs’ is considered to be.

It’s the Model 3, or maybe one of the Hyundai/Kia small EVs.

Re: Electric vehicle sales are booming in South America – without Tesla

#165

Post by khannn »

vel0city wrote: post #130
energy123 wrote: post #123

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Why the 120% price difference between China and South America?

Different government subsidies, different manufacturing costs, different regulatory requirements, and different markets have different market competition. Think about this concept. It costs you $1 to make a widget. It costs your competitors $1.25 to make a similar widget. They sell theirs for $5. Do you sell yours for $1.50 or $4.75? Obviously, other things could be in play for the market for widgets, but if you coul…

Your post is so muddled. The cheapest new EV on the US market is a Nissan Leaf at ~30k MSRP new, but I found a used 2025 model with 1341 miles for $17,899 in a cursory search. Nissan has a dealership in my city so I know it can be serviced here or at worst the next largest city near here while a Chinese brand would be a crapshoot until it spreads to my medium-small city. I can only imagine the stink people will put on Chinese cars, even hybrids and American made EVs get poo-poo'd.

I imagine that a Chinese automaker such as BYD would price itself low, something like an EV at ICE prices, to get a foothold in the American market. I really wish BYD was around here so I could drive one and look at the build quality myself, it's almost like the domestic Automakers and the CIA are putting out hit pieces about the brand.

Re: Electric vehicle sales are booming in South America – without Tesla

#166

Post by vel0city »

GiorgioG wrote: post #96
gmueckl wrote: post #56

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Long EV trips are possible amd convenient if there are enough chargers along the route. Sadly, this isn't the case on many routes in the US, at least. Europe is doing much better. I have no experience in other places.

Different people optimize for different things. I have a 450 mile trip (each way) next weekend. I can do it in 1 full tank of gas, but realistically I’ll stop once to fill up halfway. I don’t plan any other stops. If I had an EV, I’d probably have to stop twice, for 30+ minutes each, extending my already long trip by an hour each way.

> If I had an EV, I’d probably have to stop twice, for 30+ minutes each

You probably wouldn't for a 450mi trip, so long as you're driving an EV that's even halfway decent for road trips.

Re: Electric vehicle sales are booming in South America – without Tesla

#167

Post by JojoFatsani »

noosphr wrote: post #17
paxys wrote: post #7

Tesla was dead in the water when it became obvious that they couldn't make a sub-$30K car happen. They will still probably do well as a luxury brand, but China is going to fill in the demand for affordable EVs in the rest of the world outside USA/EU.

I don't think we've seen the end game yet. I have an electric cargo bike. During a kids party yesterday I ran 5 different errands with it while someone with a car managed to get stuck in traffic, not find a parking spot, and miss the whole thing. The only reason why cars are the size and shape they are is because ICE engines couldn't be made smaller. Electric engines on the other hand are small enough that I can have…

Have fun hauling a spouse, three kids, a dog and a Costco load a couple hours up the interstate in February in the Lego Technics car.

Re: Electric vehicle sales are booming in South America – without Tesla

#168

Post by bdangubic »

GiorgioG wrote: post #96
gmueckl wrote: post #56

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Long EV trips are possible amd convenient if there are enough chargers along the route. Sadly, this isn't the case on many routes in the US, at least. Europe is doing much better. I have no experience in other places.

Different people optimize for different things. I have a 450 mile trip (each way) next weekend. I can do it in 1 full tank of gas, but realistically I’ll stop once to fill up halfway. I don’t plan any other stops. If I had an EV, I’d probably have to stop twice, for 30+ minutes each, extending my already long trip by an hour each way.

1. if you are driving 450 miles you should stop at least twice

2. unless you have an old or low mileage battery you won’t have to stop more than once

3. if you do stop twice (which you should) you should not need more than 15-20 minute stop

Re: Electric vehicle sales are booming in South America – without Tesla

#169

Post by vel0city »

khannn wrote: post #165
vel0city wrote: post #130

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Different government subsidies, different manufacturing costs, different regulatory requirements, and different markets have different market competition. Think about this concept. It costs you $1 to make a widget. It costs your competitors $1.25 to make a similar widget. They sell theirs for $5. Do you sell yours for $1.50 or $4.75? Obviously, other things could be in play for the market for widgets, but if you coul…

Your post is so muddled. The cheapest new EV on the US market is a Nissan Leaf at ~30k MSRP new, but I found a used 2025 model with 1341 miles for $17,899 in a cursory search. Nissan has a dealership in my city so I know it can be serviced here or at worst the next largest city near here while a Chinese brand would be a crapshoot until it spreads to my medium-small city. I can only imagine the stink people will put o…

> The cheapest new EV on the US market is a Nissan Leaf

I said the cheapest car not the cheapest EV. And of that I meant new car. That would be the Nissan Versa, which has an MSRP of $18,385. After TTL, depending on your market you're probably looking at something around $20k out the door.

Re: Electric vehicle sales are booming in South America – without Tesla

#170

Post by dv35z »

Gualdrapo wrote: post #10

It was announced a few days ago some models of Tesla are coming to Colombia at cheaper prices than BYD and the like and people here seems to be crazy about Tesla now. Time will tell how reliable they are on our poor roads. And that's one thing about EVs here in general - they are coming with no spare tire but a flat tire repair kit, which it's fine for small issues but may not be enough for the problems said tough ro…

I'm in Medellin Colombia, and frequently see BYD cars on the road. I recently had an Uber which drove a BYD car - I was seriously impressed. For those who don't know, Medellin is extremely hilly, and somewhat of a mountainous bowl. I live pretty high up, and can feel the gasoline-powered taxis seriously strain & struggle. Meanwhile, in the BYD electric vehicle, it ascended the hill so easily. Truly felt effortless.

Recently saw a Tesla setup in the mall - so it does seem like they are kicking off a marketing campaign.

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