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Credit report shows Meta keeping $27B off its books through advanced geometry

news.ycombinator.com

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Re: Credit report shows Meta keeping $27B off its books through advanced geometry

#161

Post by illwrks »

Aurornis wrote: post #147
illwrks wrote: post #106

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Instinctively I try and simplify things. It this was a person with an excellent credit score, it’s as if the person is taking on extra debt to start to create something they need, but trying to hide it.

But that simplification isn’t the whole story. If that person took on debt as part of an LLC they started, not their personal bank account, then they have certain protections in the event of default of the LLC . They will also have to pay a premium and give up more for debt to the LLC because the lenders know this. The same is true for Meta. The finance world isn’t blind. None of us hear are stumbling upon hidden kno…

Ah ok, now that makes sense. Thank you.

Re: Credit report shows Meta keeping $27B off its books through advanced geometry

#162

Post by skybrian »

siliconpotato wrote: post #27

There are better articles explaining this: https://www.forbes.com/sites/petercohan/2025/11/25/metas-ai-... and https://www.wsj.com/tech/meta-ai-data-center-finances-d3a6b4...

The Forbes article says that "to be an operating lease [...] Meta must have the obligation to absorb the venture’s losses or the right to receive its benefits."

I don't know enough about finance to tell for sure, but this seems backwards?

Re: Credit report shows Meta keeping $27B off its books through advanced geometry

#163

Post by lazide »

toomuchtodo wrote: post #79
loeg wrote: post #77

Earlier quoted context omitted.

No one is lying or deceived here.

Ehh, tell me the credit ratings assigned by rating agencies to mortgage backed securities circa 2005-2007. Its an ecosystem with misaligned incentives, and some cohort of investor will be left holding the bag. Big Tech, investment banks, and ratings agencies will get off with no consequences when this Jenga-esq capital apparatus eventually collapses.

Except for a few instances, there wasn’t any lying or outright fraud in that situation, just like there probably isn’t here either.

Just desperate, stupid, or naive lenders trying to get solid returns (and convincing themselves there are no major risk).

Just like ‘08, frankly.

Have enough lawyers, and you can make almost anything legal and aboveboard, no matter how sketchy it actually is. Buyer beware!

Re: Credit report shows Meta keeping $27B off its books through advanced geometry

#165

Post by lenerdenator »

austin-cheney wrote: post #17

> This treatment is considered acceptable because the people who decide what is acceptable have accepted it. Wasn't that the root of the 2008 crash? The debt spiral was acceptable because people were making enough money in the present that regulators were powerless to advise against it. In a sane world people often go to jail for decades when doing this at pennies on the dollar.

> Wasn't that the root of the 2008 crash? The debt spiral was acceptable because people were making enough money in the present that regulators were powerless to advise against it. In a sane world people often go to jail for decades when doing this at pennies on the dollar.

I mean, yeah, but at the same time, and?

The lesson learned from 2008 was that no one was going to do anything of consequence to degenerate gamblers who kneecapped a generation's economic prospects. Then, in 2024, we doubled down on that position.

The behavior will continue until an effective consequence is introduced.

Re: Credit report shows Meta keeping $27B off its books through advanced geometry

#166

Post by Hamuko »

turtlesdown11 wrote: post #50

remember that time Facebook spent $10s of billions on the metaverse?

Meta (which is short for the metaverse btw) occasionally remembers the metaverse existing, too, whenever there's a small break to be had from the AI stuff.

https://bsky.app/profile/mailia.bsky.social/post/3lwys6d6r6s...

Re: Credit report shows Meta keeping $27B off its books through advanced geometry

#167

Post by bdangubic »

Aurornis wrote: post #148
bdangubic wrote: post #57

Earlier quoted context omitted.

could get you fired in more and more places though… :)

If you only see the world through crazy headlines, this probably seems true.

not just headlines, former colleagues and friends

Re: Credit report shows Meta keeping $27B off its books through advanced geometry

#168

Post by swatcoder »

mrandish wrote: post #146

It would be deeply ironic if this data center (or similar ones using creative accounting), are among those featured in the TV commercials Meta has been running in expensive national prime time slots in recent weeks. I've seen at least two different commercials each focused entirely on the personal story of a relatable, folksy person living in a small town in a fly-over U.S. state, talking about how the town was decli…

I was sure you were exaggerating. But no!

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=xCVkA1xebrQ

It turns out the one in this ad is in Altoona, Iowa. The ad focuses on how it revitalized the community by providing jobs, kind of glossing over how that might be reflected in the massive facility's ~30 car parking lot.

And incidentally, that data center currently shows no open positions on Meta's career website, although third-party sites still have some dated listing for advanced IT positions that were probably filled by non-locals.

Ugh.

Re: Credit report shows Meta keeping $27B off its books through advanced geometry

#169

Post by michaelt »

mrandish wrote: post #146

It would be deeply ironic if this data center (or similar ones using creative accounting), are among those featured in the TV commercials Meta has been running in expensive national prime time slots in recent weeks. I've seen at least two different commercials each focused entirely on the personal story of a relatable, folksy person living in a small town in a fly-over U.S. state, talking about how the town was decli…

> Meta built a new data center nearby and this person along with many others got jobs there and now things are great.

Creating such bustling workplaces as https://maps.app.goo.gl/fc9AGtsVwiLA1vd88 https://maps.app.goo.gl/fHvTWK4rWqrsqsmr9 https://maps.app.goo.gl/RzggPfd3xbBQbdoo6 and https://maps.app.goo.gl/MBjun6ad4zJmmrRV7

These facilities will sometimes employ as many as 100 people - so a state that can attract three such data centres creates almost as many new jobs as an entire wal-mart store. Truly, a transformative number of jobs.

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