Hacker News Board Hacker News, browsed like a classic message board
Live data from Hacker News

Uncle Sam wants to scan your iris and collect your DNA, citizen or not

theregister.com

Post reply on HN
Print view View original

161–170 of 283 posts

Re: Uncle Sam wants to scan your iris and collect your DNA, citizen or not

#161

Post by amrocha »

whoooboyy wrote: post #141
rootusrootus wrote: post #55

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Yes, it has been accelerating a long time. But I worry a bit about toning it down too much by both-sides-ing it. The Dems were no angels, but they most assuredly did not ever try to overturn the counting of the vote for president. They did not relentlessly claim the whole game was rigged. They never openly mocked the citizens who did not vote for them, made policy specifically to spite red states, etc. Or created gov…

I'm sorry, I refuse to just simply not acknowledge the role liberalism has in the rise of fascism. Whether it's in the past or today, fascism don't just materialize because one guy talks good. It's neither incorrect nor inappropriate to say (neo)liberalism and austerity are direct antecedents to fascist rhetoric. It's not both sidesing to identify and critique the role democrats had to play here, especially when I sa…

I didn’t agree with your first comment, but reading this one I think we actually have very similar opinions. I think your first comment sounded a bit too much like the libertarian nut jobs that comment on here all the time claiming drivers licenses are fascism.

There’s this quote I read recently: “When a political system collapses, the replacement is chosen from the choices available at the time ”.

I think it’s pretty clear to anyone with a brain that neoliberalism has failed the majority of people. Trump provided an alternative, and democrats ran on “nothing will fundamentally change”. The results are what we see today.

Re: Uncle Sam wants to scan your iris and collect your DNA, citizen or not

#162

Post by darkwater »

jandrewrogers wrote: post #104
yannyu wrote: post #22

Earlier quoted context omitted.

This is a particularly incendiary way of putting this information out there. What is collected and stored is a small blood-spot sample from a heel prick on a newborn. This is used to test for various kinds of conditions that affect newborns. This isn't a full DNA genome sequence or even any data at all, just the blood-spot specimen. Law enforcement does not have automatic access to this sample, but individual samples…

The blood sample isn’t a DNA sample right up until the point they decide to sequence it. This is the same legal doctrine allowing the government to systematically collect all of your personal data without violating your privacy as long they don’t look at what they collect without a warrant. The government has granted themselves an option on your personal data that can’t be revoked.

I agree but the State has already the monopoly on violence, which is something that only the State has. If they have a warrant, they can also break into your private property and you have to accept it. This is not too dissimilar.

Re: Uncle Sam wants to scan your iris and collect your DNA, citizen or not

#163

Post by rsynnott »

postingawayonhn wrote: post #12
harimau777 wrote: post #9

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Wouldn't it be weird if that didn't shape their perception? It's not surprising that people are less trusting when an authoritarian is in power.

But the assumptions should always be that one day someone like that could take power and gain access to that data.

I mean I think, while that possibly always _should_ have been the assumption, 20 years ago the assumption would have been very much that someone like that could _not_ take power, and that the worst the US had to fear was the likes of Dick Cheney (admittedly still pretty bad). The idea that the US might just transform into a weird batshit autocracy is really _pretty new_; it wasn't taken all _that_ seriously even in Trump's first term, because, well, the courts will just slap him down, right?

Re: Uncle Sam wants to scan your iris and collect your DNA, citizen or not

#164

Post by b112 »

bobmcnamara wrote: post #102
EvanAnderson wrote: post #71

Earlier quoted context omitted.

It'll be treated just as stupidly as Social Security numbers, and soon we'll have biometric data breaches. >sigh Aside: Social Security numbers should be public now, too. That ship sailed a long time ago and it should be recognized.

Hey now, at least I'm able to change my social security number and passwords. Good luck changing eyes.

https://youtu.be/nAttA7gzhOI?t=41

Re: Uncle Sam wants to scan your iris and collect your DNA, citizen or not

#165

Post by hnbad »

KumaBear wrote: post #149
hoppp wrote: post #115

Earlier quoted context omitted.

We don't know why the world itself exists so everything is magic

There doesn’t need to be a why the world exists. It does that’s all there is to know. There doesn’t have to be purpose just an explanation of how not why

GP probably meant "how" as in "By what mechanisms" not "why" as in "For what purposes". So "why" as in "what makes it do what it does".

Re: Uncle Sam wants to scan your iris and collect your DNA, citizen or not

#166

Post by psychoslave »

Animats wrote: post #151

Don't most people in the US get fingerprinted at some point? Let's see. I've been fingerprinted, all 10 fingers, for, at least, 1) the US Army, 2) security clearance for a DoD job, multiple times, 3) a permit to ride a horse on SF Water Department property, and 4) Customs and Border Protection Global Entry, which also took an iris scan. California DMV takes a thumbprint, but not all 10 fingers. They've been recording…

Depend what the "position of trust" is taken. Security clearance for departement of defense is certainly not something the median citizen can be expected to go through.

Re: Uncle Sam wants to scan your iris and collect your DNA, citizen or not

#167

Post by vintermann »

nomel wrote: post #88
yannyu wrote: post #22

Earlier quoted context omitted.

This is a particularly incendiary way of putting this information out there. What is collected and stored is a small blood-spot sample from a heel prick on a newborn. This is used to test for various kinds of conditions that affect newborns. This isn't a full DNA genome sequence or even any data at all, just the blood-spot specimen. Law enforcement does not have automatic access to this sample, but individual samples…

No, they are correct, and it's disingenuous to claim otherwise. They have a DNA sample of everyone. Those samples haven't been sequenced . As you've pointed out, they are sequenced when the state needs them to be. It would be like scanning your drivers license and putting it in a sealed envelope and claiming "I don't have your home address!", when I'm known to get the home address from other peoples envelopes when as…

At least they can't trawl them for random matches when they're like that, the cost of sequencing is a barrier. Probably even more in that a 20 year old blood spot on a piece of paper isn't an ideal DNA sample.

Re: Uncle Sam wants to scan your iris and collect your DNA, citizen or not

#168

Post by Nursie »

Vespasian wrote: post #159
qingcharles wrote: post #68

Earlier quoted context omitted.

This WorldCoin image will forever live rent free in my head: https://www.crikey.com.au/wp-content/uploads/sites/3/2023/08...

What exactly am I looking at?

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/World_(blockchain)

A Sam Altman project which seemingly popped up out of nowhere, and offered people free money in exchange for biometric registration on the network, in a lot of countries all over the world. It seemed to be an attempt to set up some sort of global electronic ID system and currency all in one.

That silver sphere is an iris scanner, IIRC.

Got shut down pretty hard in a bunch of places as a potentially illegal invasion of privacy.

Re: Uncle Sam wants to scan your iris and collect your DNA, citizen or not

#169

Post by hnbad »

Animats wrote: post #151

Don't most people in the US get fingerprinted at some point? Let's see. I've been fingerprinted, all 10 fingers, for, at least, 1) the US Army, 2) security clearance for a DoD job, multiple times, 3) a permit to ride a horse on SF Water Department property, and 4) Customs and Border Protection Global Entry, which also took an iris scan. California DMV takes a thumbprint, but not all 10 fingers. They've been recording…

Surely there's a difference between collecting a thumbprint for a driver's license or even collecting full fingerprints for a specific job type, and collecting your DNA and an iris scan just for being a citizen?

I'm German. My government literally issues ID cards and requires fingerprints for those nowadays as well (because terrorism or the children or whatever works as the excuse at the moment) but the idea of a government agency collecting my DNA seems far more invasive given the kind of things you can do with that information and the kind of things governments (especially in my country but in the US and Canada too) have historically done to groups of people under them.

If you think there's nothing concerning about the government wanting to collect extensive biometric data including DNA from not only people applying for immigration but also people associated with them or their application, maybe it would sound more concerning to you if I said that in German.

Re: Uncle Sam wants to scan your iris and collect your DNA, citizen or not

#170

Post by hnbad »

thayne wrote: post #117
yannyu wrote: post #22

Earlier quoted context omitted.

This is a particularly incendiary way of putting this information out there. What is collected and stored is a small blood-spot sample from a heel prick on a newborn. This is used to test for various kinds of conditions that affect newborns. This isn't a full DNA genome sequence or even any data at all, just the blood-spot specimen. Law enforcement does not have automatic access to this sample, but individual samples…

> This is used to test for various kinds of conditions that affect newborns. Then why do they keep the samples?

Because the US has laughably weak privacy laws and most Americans snicker at the EU GDPR because of "cookie banners" (which btw isn't a thing - most consent dialogs are non-compliant as they shouldn't serve to just inform you but to actually obtain voluntary, revokable and specific informed consent) instead of thinking about what it means to actually have a fundamental human right to privacy and ownership of your own data or not.

They keep the samples for the same reason US tech startups keep deleted data and track seemingly useless behavior. Because they might find a use for it someday and there's literally no law preventing them from doing it.

Post reply on HN