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Novo Nordisk's Canadian Mistake

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Re: Novo Nordisk's Canadian Mistake

#161

Post by adastra22 »

seszett wrote: post #155
delfinom wrote: post #108

Earlier quoted context omitted.

I mean that entire region has bought the president, even got themselves a military base being built on American land now too. So why not.

> got themselves a military base being built on American land now too As a European I'm as critical of the US government as can be and their president has definitely been bought, but there are already several countries that have some training facilities and military personnel in the US. Calling it a foreign military base is really unnecessarily hyperbolic. And given the amount of military bases that the US have on fo…

I suspect he was repeating a soundbite and doesn’t know the actual (entirely reasonable) situation.

Re: Novo Nordisk's Canadian Mistake

#162

Post by petesergeant »

0cf8612b2e1e wrote: post #30

I had never considered it-what makes a drug prescription vs OTC? Every substance has safety concerns(dose makes the poison), so with a lot of the financial gone, will the GLPs ever not require a prescription?

They don’t require one in the UAE (in practice, anyway), which has a well-regulated med scene.

Re: Novo Nordisk's Canadian Mistake

#163

Post by vitorgrs »

chrisweekly wrote: post #133
vitorgrs wrote: post #31

In Brazil it will expire in July 2026. It's pretty relevant as it's kinda already announced they will put the generics on the public health care (SUS) for free... Which is big deal as an Ozempic shot costs almost the same as the minimum wage. This year they already did an analysis to include Ozempic, but it was denied, probably because of the cost difference... But they were trying on justice to extend the patent...

"same as the minimum wage" ... an hour's wage? a week? a month? annual?

Yeah, sorry, it's just here we just talk about monthly wages. A month!

Re: Novo Nordisk's Canadian Mistake

#164

Post by vitorgrs »

matheusmoreira wrote: post #127
vitorgrs wrote: post #31

In Brazil it will expire in July 2026. It's pretty relevant as it's kinda already announced they will put the generics on the public health care (SUS) for free... Which is big deal as an Ozempic shot costs almost the same as the minimum wage. This year they already did an analysis to include Ozempic, but it was denied, probably because of the cost difference... But they were trying on justice to extend the patent...

SUS doesn't have a good track record when it comes to offering modern drugs and treatments. It takes years if not decades for medications to be covered, even when generics are available. Patients often had to go to court with documents from their doctor in order to make things happen. I've lost count of how many patients I've helped get their treatments... And now the supreme court has closed the door on them. Still,…

Depends the price of the generics, of course. But I wouldn't doubt if the governament itself would manufacture it. Fiocruz (federal gov lab) already manufacture several drugs.

Also, Rio mayor already said he will just give to everyone basically lol

You also need to remind that on a public health care system, having less obese people means you'll spend less on health care.

Re: Novo Nordisk's Canadian Mistake

#165

Post by vitorgrs »

1oooqooq wrote: post #118
vitorgrs wrote: post #31

In Brazil it will expire in July 2026. It's pretty relevant as it's kinda already announced they will put the generics on the public health care (SUS) for free... Which is big deal as an Ozempic shot costs almost the same as the minimum wage. This year they already did an analysis to include Ozempic, but it was denied, probably because of the cost difference... But they were trying on justice to extend the patent...

being free means taxpayers will pay. and being on the public system means it will be prescribed only for health risk, just like plastic surgery already is. you don't see people getting nose jobs just because.

First, it seems obvious to me that they'll prescribe it to everyone who, supposedly, undergoes bariatric surgery through the SUS. Generic Ozempic is certainly cheaper than bariatric surgery.

That said, I believe it will go even further.

To get medication through the SUS, you only need a prescription from a doctor. Any doctor. So even if the SUS itself don't prescribe, you can just find a doctor who will do it...

But, likely SUS will prescribe anyway. Rio mayor:

"Rio will be a city where there will be no more chubby people; everyone will be taking Ozempic at family clinics." "Said the mayor, adding that he has already taken the medication. He claimed to have lost 30kg with the medication."

Re: Novo Nordisk's Canadian Mistake

#166

Post by m463 »

0cf8612b2e1e wrote: post #14
jzebedee wrote: post #4

> Prof. Michael Hoffman from Toronto put me on to the Canadian Patent Database, where you can find that Novo did file a patent there for semaglutide. . .but the last time they paid the annual maintenance fee on it was 2018! > You can even find a letter where their lawyers send a refund request for the 2017 maintenance fee ($250) because Novo apparently wanted some more time to see if they wanted to pay it. > On the s…

I always wonder-in this case of such an epic company fuck up, does anyone ever get fired? Or is responsibility so diffuse that nobody is ultimately responsible? Pharma companies are really nothing more than holders of time-limited, expensive, exclusive IP. The number one priority should be to maintain those protections as long as possible. How could any patent be allowed to lapse, even if there was limited commercial…

to me, I am reminded of countless DNS renewal mistakes that are publicized.

Re: Novo Nordisk's Canadian Mistake

#167

Post by workerthread »

cperciva wrote: post #149
nijuashi wrote: post #131

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Saying pharma companies are just holders of ‘expensive, time-limited IP’ is not only wrong, it’s offensive to those of us who actually do the science. We spend years designing, testing, and validating drugs, not scheming to hike prices. We’re not all Shkrelis out here.

I may be wrong, but aren't most drugs sold by large pharma companies actually developed elsewhere and then acquired?

Novo Nordisk does the vast majority of their RD in-house. I can’t speak to other companies.

Re: Novo Nordisk's Canadian Mistake

#168

Post by vitorgrs »

alister wrote: post #44

> Interviewer at Endpoints: You plan to potentially launch a generic GLP-1 in Canada and Brazil in 2026. Looking at the original interview on Endpoints, Sandoz CEO Richard Saynor says this about Brazil: In Brazil, the biggest prescribers are dentists. Everyone says, “Why dentists?” They do aesthetic work, and then you have your Botox, and then you want a bikini body. It’s behaving like an OTC consumer brand. Imagine…

In Brazil, medicines lose patent protection 20 years after the original filing date. The filing date was in 2006, so the patent expires in 2026.

But note that the patent was only granted in 2019, it took 13 years. They went to court last year, but the justice (as far as I know) has continued to follow the precedent that the original filing date applies.

So they went to the federal government to try to change the law, but the government has refused so far.

The INPI (Brazilian Patent Office) used to take a VERY long time to register/grant patents. It's faster now (about 4 years on average), but it's still slow.

But I'm seeing here that in the US it was 2017. So not that different from 2019 anyway.

PS: Brazil also have several local labs focused on generics, and besides this, there's also state-owned lab, Fiocruz, who makes vaccines and medicines as well, several of them, to distribute though SUS.

In Brazil by the constitution, everyone has the right of health, so if the public health care (SUS) don't distribute, you can sue the governament and get the medicine. So there's a big incentive for the governament to make patents expire as soon as possible to have generics and include on SUS.

e.g Fiocruz manufacture PrEP, and started now PrEP injection (Cabotegravir).

Re: Novo Nordisk's Canadian Mistake

#170

Post by bawolff »

simonh wrote: post #151
nl wrote: post #150

Earlier quoted context omitted.

I'm having trouble understanding the argument outlined in the legal.io link: > Nordisk has rejected any suggestion that the loss of its Canadian semaglutide patent was a simple mistake. In a statement cited by Fortune, the company stressed that its intellectual property strategy is “carefully considered at a global level,” indicating intentionality rather than a blunder. > Legal analysts believe the decision was deli…

It depends what the “simultaneous filing of the CSP” was simultaneous with. If it was simultaneous with letting the patent expire that makes no sense. If it was simultaneous with the original filing of the patent that does make sense.

Based on the gov website it sounds like it has to be filed within 120 days of filing the patent, so i guess its the latter.

It might not be as nonsensical as the alternative, but I still dont understand how the CSP filing makes it any less likely letting the patent lapse was a mistake.

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