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Migrating from AWS to Hetzner

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Re: Migrating from AWS to Hetzner

#161

Post by jnsaff2 »

adamcharnock wrote: post #150

I cannot overstate the performance improvement of deploying onto bare metal. We typically see a doubling of performance, as well as extremely predictable baseline performance. This is down to several things: - Latency - having your own local network, rather than sharing some larger datacenter network fabric, gives around of order of magnitude reduced latency - Caches – right-sizing a deployment for the underlying har…

There is a graph database which does disk IO for database startup, backup and restore as single threaded, sequential, 8kb operations.

On EBS it does at most 200MB/s disk IO just because the EBS operation latency even on io2 is about 0.5 ms. Even though the disk can go much faster, disk benchmarks can easily do multi-GB/s on nodes that have enough EBS throughput.

On instance local SSD on the same EC2 instance it will happily saturate the whatever instance can do (~2GB/s in my case).

Re: Migrating from AWS to Hetzner

#163

Post by baobun »

bdcravens wrote: post #142
baobun wrote: post #134

Earlier quoted context omitted.

In the adjacent category of self-managed omakase postgres: https://www.elephant-shed.io/

While I'm sure it's a great project, a few issues in the README gave me pause to think about how well it's kept up to date. Around half of the links in the list of dependencies are either out of date or just plain don't work, and referencing Vagrant with no mention of Docker.

It's indeed undermaintaned so it's not a case of only plug-and-play and automated pulls for production. Still a solid base to build from when setting up on VMs or dedicated and I'm yet to find something better short of DIYing everything.

Re: Migrating from AWS to Hetzner

#164

Post by Thicken2320 »

adamcharnock wrote: post #150

I cannot overstate the performance improvement of deploying onto bare metal. We typically see a doubling of performance, as well as extremely predictable baseline performance. This is down to several things: - Latency - having your own local network, rather than sharing some larger datacenter network fabric, gives around of order of magnitude reduced latency - Caches – right-sizing a deployment for the underlying har…

Using the S3 API is like chopping onions, the more you do it, the faster you start crying.

Re: Migrating from AWS to Hetzner

#165

Post by ants_everywhere »

The public cloud is priced as if availability, reliability, durability, and latency matter to your business. If they don't, you can get far with just a single machine.

A great deal of the work in cloud engineering is ensuring the abstractions meet the service guarantees. Similarly you can make a car much cheaper if you don't need to guarantee the driver will survive a collision. The cost of providing a safety guarantee is much higher than providing a hand-wavy "good enough" feeling.

If your business isn't critical then "good enough" vibes may be all you need, and you can save some money.

Re: Migrating from AWS to Hetzner

#166

Post by swiftcoder »

normie3000 wrote: post #92
pwmtr wrote: post #47

We’ve been seeing the same trend. Lots of teams moving to Hetzner for the price/performance, but then realizing they have to rebuild all the Postgres ops pieces (backups, failover, monitoring, etc.). We ended up building a managed Postgres that runs directly on Hetzner. Same setup, but with HA, backups, and PITR handled for you. It’s open-source, runs close to the metal, and avoids the egress/I/O gotchas you get on A…

This is one key draw to Big Cloud and especially PaaS and managed SQL for me (and dev teams I advise). Not having an ops background I am nervous about: * database backup+restore * applying security patches on time (at OS and runtime levels) * other security issues like making sure access to prod machines is restricted correctly, access is logged, ports are locked down, abnormal access patterns are detected * DoS and…

to be fair, AWS' database restore support is generally only a small part of the picture - the only option available is to spin an entirely new DB cluster up from the backup, so if your data recovery strategy isn't "roll back all data to before the incident", you have to build out all your own functionality for merging the backup and live data...

Re: Migrating from AWS to Hetzner

#167

Post by breadislove »

jgalt212 wrote: post #123
breadislove wrote: post #19

Hetzner is really great until you try to scale with them. We started building our service on top of Hetzner and had couple 100s of VMs running and during peak time we had to scale them to over 1000 VMs. And here couple of problems started, you get pretty often IPs which are black listed, so if you try to connect to services hosted by Google, AWS like S3 etc. you can't reach them. Also at one point there were no VMs a…

1000 VMs? So you have approx 1MM concurrent customers? That's a big number. You should definitely be able to get preferred pricing from AWS at that scale.

We have extremely processing heavy jobs where user upload large collection of files (PDFs, audios, videos etc.) and expect to get fast processing.

Re: Migrating from AWS to Hetzner

#168

Post by 9cb14c1ec0 »

kachapopopow wrote: post #81

This is pretty bad still, with colocation you can get the costs down to 1/100th with good deals at datacenters especially ones that are struggling to attract customers. Most of your bill is power so if you rack efficiency optimized servers you can have a lot of compute for very cheap. In terms of networking many offer no-headache solutions with some kind of transit blend. I recently had to switch away from hetzner du…

Cogent just offered me this colo deal:

Full Rack = $100/month* with $500 install, Power (20A) = $350/month with $500 install, DIA (1Gbps) = $300/month

Total = $750/month plus $1,000 Install on 12 month term

Re: Migrating from AWS to Hetzner

#169

Post by amelius »

debazel wrote: post #155
amelius wrote: post #131

Earlier quoted context omitted.

How long after shutting you down did they delete your data? That period should definitely be longer than a few days.

Hetzner will almost immediately nuke your data if you miss a payment and often outright ban you and your business from ever using them again. Hetzner is great for cheap personal sites but I would never use them for any serious business use-cases. Other than failed payments, Hetzner also has very strict content policies and they use user reports to find offenders. This means that if just a few users report your websit…

That sounds really bad.

Re: Migrating from AWS to Hetzner

#170

Post by dboreham »

Qasaur wrote: post #125

Hetzner is great for dedicated servers, but for those of us who need smaller-scale secure/confidential VMs I'm afraid that there isn't really any other choice than hyperscalers. Does anyone know if there is a VM vendor that sits somewhere in between a dedicated server host like Hetzner in terms of performance + cost-effectiveness and AWS/GCP in terms of security? Basically TPM/vTPM + AMD SEV/SEV-SNP + UEFI Secure Boo…

Interested to hear more about your use case and threat model, if you are willing to share. I ask because although I've looked into (and done some prototyping) with secure cloud hosting, I/we came to the conclusion that there's no current technology that is "actually secure" and so abandoned the approach. Curious if things have improved now, or if you're operating in some security theater context where it's ok.
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