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Lead pigment in turmeric is the culprit in a global poisoning mystery (2024)

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Re: Lead pigment in turmeric is the culprit in a global poisoning mystery (2024)

#161

Post by kurthr »

infinitifall wrote: post #71

I'm put off by how this is framed as a detective story. Pesticides that contain heavy metals and other carcinogens are a well known issue, with India (and South Asia more generally) being the worst affected. > You'll never guess the culprit Not knowing about turmeric comes off as deeply ignorant when a billion people consume it as part of their daily diet. > They don't know that this is harmful for human health Let m…

I'm from the US, but I at least vaguely follow food safety. The idea that this poisoning was a surprise is bizarre. It was the absolute first thing I thought of. It is the most common form of corruption. Similar thing just exploded in china with a red dye for children's school food. Like EV olive oil, salmon, and honey a majority of the food is adulterated. You just hope that it's non-toxic.

The real issue is a complete lack of testing or regulation, and I fear soon a loss of "rule of law" in the US. I mean if you bought the right person and airplane or some meme-coin, I'm pretty sure you could sell melamine in baby formula or lead paint in junk food, and it would be blamed on "those damn furriners"!

Re: Lead pigment in turmeric is the culprit in a global poisoning mystery (2024)

#162

Post by ericmay »

abeppu wrote: post #157
BobbyJo wrote: post #138

Earlier quoted context omitted.

> But is it really so strange to you to think that the richest and most powerful country might have some role to play in international problems that arise from comparative poverty? I think this is a mischaracterization of parent's point. He didn't say it was strange , and he didn't say we had no role to play. > that the use of our military is more criticized than any other. But we're big and rich and powerful and we'…

Ok, so ericmay was not entirely explicit and perhaps we read his point differently. > then I don’t want to hear a peep about us taking any other actions in the world that we deem just I think the noteworthy peeps are not about the mere fact that we involve ourselves in the world outside our borders but that we often do it pretty badly. We attack Iraq with "shock and awe" over WMDs that do not exist, and create the Ab…

I’m not going to clarify my post too much because it will lead to a more interesting discussion based on the results I’ve seen so far, but I do want to say I specifically had an issue with the notion, however loosely applied, of assigning blame on the American taxpayer.

With respect to your point about foreign intervention, I actually have come about on Iraq and think that it might have turned out OK if perhaps not worth it monetarily or morally (arguably lying to the American public - I don’t think it’s very arguable but I want to leave room for reasonable discussion) because as I see things today - I think the quality of life in Iraq has improved and frankly they are not under the thumb of a brutal dictator. I wish I knew some folks from Iraq to educate me either way.

With that being said - often times our foreign interventions are seen as good/bad but it just depends on who you ask. We think (and I think) arming Ukraine and Taiwan are good policy - is it? What does China or war-torn Ukraine have to say about that (again with respect to Ukraine please note I am a huge hawk on arming Ukraine against Russia and would advocate for direct US intervention to stop the war), but reasonable people can have differences. The point there just being that sometimes it seems obvious that American taxpayer dollars are well spent but not always. We should just be flexible in that understanding. Just don’t try to assign blame for Americans not wanting to pay for XYZ issue. It’s wrong and counterproductive, in my view.

Not that it matters but thanks to both of you for interesting conversation and dialog.

Re: Lead pigment in turmeric is the culprit in a global poisoning mystery (2024)

#163

Post by refurb »

steveBK123 wrote: post #126
ericmay wrote: post #124

Earlier quoted context omitted.

> The agency of Americans is also contributing to this reccuring. I’m going to push back very, very hard on ascribing any sort of blame on anyone other than those who are committing these acts. Least of all the American taxpayer, regardless of whether or not dismantling USAID is a good idea. If the rest of the world is so helpless that all hope depends on Americans to solve even problems such as this and it’s our fau…

Right, I'm 100% against the dismantling of our foreign aid programs, USAID included.. However, the world playing both sides of the coin on "US World Police" being bad when it does stuff but also bad when it doesn't do stuff is part of how we end up where we are. It's a minuscule part of our budget, but an easy sell for right wingers to say "well the world isn't grateful for it and its all a bunch of waste so we are k…

I think it’s important for people to educate themselves about USAID. International aid isn’t the point, it’s a channel for shaping the world according to the US’ goals.

For example, look up the role of USAID in the Vietnam war. It was used to fund village self defense forces and the Phoenix program which used targeted apprehension and assassination to combat the Viet Cong. Sure it dug a few wells but net net I don’t think anyone can argue USAID had a positive impact for Vietnam.

USAID is 98% political interference and 2% aid. You’d think people who oppose US interference in other countries would applaud shutting USAID down.

But apparently not.

Re: Lead pigment in turmeric is the culprit in a global poisoning mystery (2024)

#164

Post by aaron695 »

phendrenad2 wrote: post #57

I think this NPR article is too quick to put a positive spin on this. They have made a nice little story here with a happy ending. Farmers had blackened turmeric -> they used a random yellow die they found -> massive lead spike in everyone's bloodstream -> Americans came in with a xray gun and saved the day -> no more lead in the blood. But if you ascribe even the slightest but of agency to any of the non-Americans i…

[dead]

Re: Lead pigment in turmeric is the culprit in a global poisoning mystery (2024)

#165

Post by dgfitz »

abeppu wrote: post #133
ericmay wrote: post #124

Earlier quoted context omitted.

> The agency of Americans is also contributing to this reccuring. I’m going to push back very, very hard on ascribing any sort of blame on anyone other than those who are committing these acts. Least of all the American taxpayer, regardless of whether or not dismantling USAID is a good idea. If the rest of the world is so helpless that all hope depends on Americans to solve even problems such as this and it’s our fau…

The article makes clear that the initiative, though announced by USAID with other partners, was funded primarily by philanthropy. > The money – most of it from Open Philanthropy – will go to more than a dozen countries from Indonesia and Uganda to Ghana and Peru. From other sources, I think the US _financial_ commitment was actually pretty minimal ($4M). But if USAID had been providing important governance, administr…

> The article makes clear that the initiative, though announced by USAID with other partners, was funded primarily by philanthropy.

So, it doesn’t seem like it matters much if USAID was dismantled then.

> But if USAID had been providing important governance, administration or coordination, withdrawing its involvement could still destabilize an effort that otherwise could have been impactful.

But, if. “Maybe we can make a lot of assumptions about a lot of things and pretend they’re true, and make an argument about it.” Isn’t the play. Not a real point, or something to even debate.

> “Blame" is a loaded word. But is it really so strange to you to think that the richest and most powerful country might have some role to play in international problems that arise from comparative poverty? And that the country with the largest military in the world also should be held to a high standard in how it uses that tremendous force.

You completely lost the plot here. You can’t have it both ways. Sure would be pretty neat if _any other country in the WORLD_ stepped up and did… something. Anything. Your argument really died here.

Re: Lead pigment in turmeric is the culprit in a global poisoning mystery (2024)

#166

Post by giraffe_lady »

droopyEyelids wrote: post #156
zargon wrote: post #37

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Burlap and Barrel tests their turmeric for lead and publishes the results. It’s a lot more expensive than Indian store turmeric, but personally I’m no longer willing to buy untested turmeric. (Relatedly, Lundberg publishes the arsenic levels of their brown rice, so that’s basically the only brand of rice I buy any more.)

Don’t know what part of the country you’re in, but in Chicago even the basic chain grocery stores carry fresh unprocessed turmeric now. There’s basically no reason to ever use powdered or dried.

Except that it's a different ingredient, that tastes different and works differently. I still use cayenne for some things even though I have fresh chile peppers I don't put fresh ginger in ginger snaps etc.

Re: Lead pigment in turmeric is the culprit in a global poisoning mystery (2024)

#167

Post by BobbyJo »

abeppu wrote: post #157
BobbyJo wrote: post #138

Earlier quoted context omitted.

> But is it really so strange to you to think that the richest and most powerful country might have some role to play in international problems that arise from comparative poverty? I think this is a mischaracterization of parent's point. He didn't say it was strange , and he didn't say we had no role to play. > that the use of our military is more criticized than any other. But we're big and rich and powerful and we'…

Ok, so ericmay was not entirely explicit and perhaps we read his point differently. > then I don’t want to hear a peep about us taking any other actions in the world that we deem just I think the noteworthy peeps are not about the mere fact that we involve ourselves in the world outside our borders but that we often do it pretty badly. We attack Iraq with "shock and awe" over WMDs that do not exist, and create the Ab…

> I read his point as, "if we have an obligation to fix other people's problems, we shouldn't be subject to complaints when our foreign adventures go wrong".

That's a bad faith reading imo. They said "action we deem just" not "things we mess up".

> Getting involved and helping to solve a problem doesn't need to mean being the police.

It generally does when the source of the problem is people. When you're actively preventing people from doing something, that is "policing". Policing isn't just arresting/shooting/bombing, it's the general enforcement of rules.

> And I'm not an expert, but I think almost none of the stuff that flowed through USAID was about being "police".

That's somewhat beside the point, as the source in both USAID and the "policing" is the US government. You dont name your hand and consider it a different person.

Re: Lead pigment in turmeric is the culprit in a global poisoning mystery (2024)

#168

Post by khelavastr »

Lack of firearms regulations stops public action against lead poisoners. In South America, where street gangs are far more common, you don't see rampant lead pollution the same way.

Nobody dumps lead in narco territories because order of law is so much better enforced than relatively lawless democratic countries like Bangladesh.

Re: Lead pigment in turmeric is the culprit in a global poisoning mystery (2024)

#169

Post by oharapj »

onlyrealcuzzo wrote: post #59
oharapj wrote: post #47

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Can someone validate the water test for lead adulterated turmeric? https://youtu.be/tXWPf0HQd5U?si=-SkT4EQB9SvMx7io

[flagged]

My ChatGPT said lead chromate isn't soluble in water so it's unreliable :(

Re: Lead pigment in turmeric is the culprit in a global poisoning mystery (2024)

#170

Post by oharapj »

GloriousKoji wrote: post #58
oharapj wrote: post #47

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Can someone validate the water test for lead adulterated turmeric? https://youtu.be/tXWPf0HQd5U?si=-SkT4EQB9SvMx7io

I don't follow youtube links during work hours as a personal policy but an India government webpage outlines the water test for whole tumeric: https://eatrightindia.gov.in/dart/ > Test 14 : Detection of lead chromate in turmeric whole > Testing Method: > * Add small quantity of turmeric whole in a transparent glass of water. > * Pure turmeric will not leave any colour. > * Adulterated turmeric appears to be bright in…

The Youtube video was also made by the Indian Government. Validating the Indian Government's claim against the Indian Government's same claim (Test 15 in this case) probably doesn't tell us much
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