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Games run faster on SteamOS than Windows 11, Ars testing finds

arstechnica.com

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Re: Games run faster on SteamOS than Windows 11, Ars testing finds

#161

Post by Sammi »

hypeatei wrote: post #44
fooqux wrote: post #40

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Anti-cheat today is a stop-gap measure at best. For various reasons such as improved OS security and security concerns with this software, ring zero anti-cheat won't be around forever. Besides, it's a cat and mouse game where the vendor is the mouse. We already have the technology now to do it better. A combination of only sending what info a client should have, and server-side checks. As soon as something like UT sh…

As long as games are running on user hardware/OS, you'll always deal with cheating. Server-side checks and computation can only go so far. For example: in competitive shooters (where cheaters are most prevalent) you can't have things appearing out of thin air. The client needs to know about things ahead of time to play sounds and to give other environmental hints.

Surely the server can tell the client what sounds to play and what other environmental hints to do, just as well as the server can choose to tell the client where the other players are when they are in sight.

Re: Games run faster on SteamOS than Windows 11, Ars testing finds

#162

Post by Sammi »

homarp wrote: post #3
PaulHoule wrote: post #2

Might be unfair to call Proton a "translation layer" because the Win32 API is not defined in terms of system calls but rather a set of functions exported from a DLL. Proton supplies a DLL that implements the Win32 API using Linux syscalls. Windows supplies a DLL that implements that Win32 API using Windows syscalls that you're not really supposed to use directly.

https://www.winehq.org/ calls it a compatibility layer that translates calls on the fly. so 'translation layer' is not that unfair.

Clearly they don't want to come out and say that Wine is an "implementation of windows apis", because that would invite legal issues. But clearly this is what Wine really is for a large part. Some stuff are just shallow shims to Linux apis, while other stuff they need to make more of their own implementation of.

Re: Games run faster on SteamOS than Windows 11, Ars testing finds

#163

Post by easyThrowaway »

dottjt wrote: post #155
easyThrowaway wrote: post #149

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Can't say that Windows 11 compatibility on this regard is any way better. Anything pre Dx-9 is somewhat broken one way or another. I've recently found about Dreamm[1] by AAron Giles (a well known emulator developer) which is basically a very lightweight os-indipendent reimplementation of some windows and directx calls specifically for some Lucasarts games written during that time period, It would be nice to see a sim…

I would have to disagree. Those same games that didn't work on SteamOS worked flawlessly on Windows 11.

It's definitely game-dependent. In a few cases I've found it was easier to rebuy a game on GOG, like Dino Crisis or '98 Resident Evil 2 (whose re-releases indeed run on win11 flawlessly while they're quite problematic on Proton) rather than messing with their original cd/dvds.

On the other hand the Sega arcade ports from the same time period (Sega Rally 1&2, Daytona USA Deluxe, Manx TT Superbike Virtua Striker, etc.) are definitely less problematic on Wine/Proton rather than Win11.

Re: Games run faster on SteamOS than Windows 11, Ars testing finds

#164

Post by chmod775 »

Sammi wrote: post #160
armada651 wrote: post #140

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Direct Memory Access cheats will always perform better as they can reveal the location of an opponent before they're even visible on the screen.

Why are players who aren't on screen even in the client memory? The server shouldn't be sharing sensitive information.

You can minimize that to some degree (Valorant does this), but due to movement prediction/network latency you do have to overshare a little bit.

I imagine that most game devs just look at the incredible amount of work this takes to implement and complexity it adds, and decide to not bother. Valorant can do it because the game itself is low complexity, the developer has deep pockets, and also the added competitive integrity is valuable.

Re: Games run faster on SteamOS than Windows 11, Ars testing finds

#165

Post by AbuAssar »

userbinator wrote: post #78
runako wrote: post #38

Back in the Windows XP days, I discovered that running Windows in a VMWare VM, hosted on Linux, was faster than running the same version of Windows bare on the same machine. I never came up with a good explanation for that.

Cache. Disk cache, to be precise.

please elaborate

Re: Games run faster on SteamOS than Windows 11, Ars testing finds

#166

Post by Fluorescence »

ncr100 wrote: post #120

Is this testing the same graphics performance / i.e. screenshot-accurate comparison vs Windows?

Shame you have been downvoted. That's a reasonable question no matter where you stand. Motion is important too, not just static screen-shots.

I am 100% team Linux but cross-platform benchmarking is rife with problems. Differences are often from not testing the exactly same thing or different defaults that trade-off safety/quality/perf and can in theory be changed. No point measuring only one side of a triangle whose ratios are a matter of taste.

A responsible benchmark would try and prove fidelity.

Re: Games run faster on SteamOS than Windows 11, Ars testing finds

#167

Post by tmtvl »

mrcsharp wrote: post #31

On the one hand I hope with the proliferation of such articles and sentiment that Microsoft would start paying more positive attention to Windows as an Operating System instead of an AI and Advertisement Machine. But then I remember that it's Nutella at the helm over there and he'll gladly give up ground to focus more on hype and share price. What a waste.

> But then I remember that it's Nutella at the helm over there and he'll gladly give up ground to focus more on hype and share price.

While I agree with the basic sentiment, racism really doesn't deserve a place here, please don't do this.

Re: Games run faster on SteamOS than Windows 11, Ars testing finds

#168

Post by hypeatei »

Sammi wrote: post #161
hypeatei wrote: post #44

Earlier quoted context omitted.

As long as games are running on user hardware/OS, you'll always deal with cheating. Server-side checks and computation can only go so far. For example: in competitive shooters (where cheaters are most prevalent) you can't have things appearing out of thin air. The client needs to know about things ahead of time to play sounds and to give other environmental hints.

Surely the server can tell the client what sounds to play and what other environmental hints to do, just as well as the server can choose to tell the client where the other players are when they are in sight.

Maybe, but I think that would've been done already if it was feasible.

Re: Games run faster on SteamOS than Windows 11, Ars testing finds

#169

Post by mrcsharp »

tmtvl wrote: post #167
mrcsharp wrote: post #31

On the one hand I hope with the proliferation of such articles and sentiment that Microsoft would start paying more positive attention to Windows as an Operating System instead of an AI and Advertisement Machine. But then I remember that it's Nutella at the helm over there and he'll gladly give up ground to focus more on hype and share price. What a waste.

> But then I remember that it's Nutella at the helm over there and he'll gladly give up ground to focus more on hype and share price. While I agree with the basic sentiment, racism really doesn't deserve a place here, please don't do this.

That's not racism. That's a play on his last name. Just because actual Nutella has a dark color doesn't make my comment racist.

Grow up and stop finding racism in everything.

Re: Games run faster on SteamOS than Windows 11, Ars testing finds

#170

Post by Fluorescence »

PaulHoule wrote: post #2

Might be unfair to call Proton a "translation layer" because the Win32 API is not defined in terms of system calls but rather a set of functions exported from a DLL. Proton supplies a DLL that implements the Win32 API using Linux syscalls. Windows supplies a DLL that implements that Win32 API using Windows syscalls that you're not really supposed to use directly.

I really have to respect Wine's persistence (with Proton's help).

For so long it was one of those "and now you have two problems" technologies and now it looks like it's the slow blade that could actually kill Windows.

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