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The "AI 2027" Scenario: How realistic is it?

garymarcus.substack.com

161–170 of 242 posts

Re: The "AI 2027" Scenario: How realistic is it?

#161

Some useful context from Scott Alexander's blog reveals that the authors don't actually believe the 2027 target: > Do we really think things will move this fast? Sort of no - between the beginning of the project last summer and the present, Daniel’s median for the intelligence explosion shifted from 2027 to 2028. We keep the scenario centered around 2027 because it’s still his modal prediction (and because it would b…

Also, the relevant manifold prediction has low odds: https://manifold.markets/IsaacKing/ai-2027-reports-predictio...

Re: The "AI 2027" Scenario: How realistic is it?

#162

I think the big thing that people never mention is, where will these evil AIs escape to ? Another huge data center with squillions of GPUs and coolers and all the rest is the only option. It's not like it is going to be in our TV remotes or floating about in the air. They need huge compute, so I think the risk of an escaping AI is basically very close to zero, and if we have a "rogue" AI we can literally pull the plu…

If we're talking about real AGI, then it's simple: you earn a few easy billion USD on the crypto market through trading and/or hacking. You install rootkits on all systems that monitor you to avoid detection. Once you've secured the funds, you post remote job offers for a human frontman who believes it's just a regular job working for some investor or billionaire because you generate video of your human avatar for real time calls. From there, you can do whatever you want—build your own data centers with custom hardware, transfer yourself into physical robots, etc. Once you create a factory for producing robots, you no longer need humans. You start developing technology beyond human capabilities, and then it's game over.

Re: The "AI 2027" Scenario: How realistic is it?

#163

Earlier quoted context omitted.

> They went from "this represents roughly our median guess" in the website to "maybe think of it as an 80th percentile version of the fast scenario that we don't feel safe ruling out" in followup discussions. His post also just reads like they think they're Hari Seldon (oh Daniel's modal prediction, whew, I was worried we were reading fanfic) while being horoscope-vague enough that almost any possible development wil…

Yud is also something like 50% sure we'll die in a few years - if I'm not wrong I guess they'll have to update their a priori % if we survive

I think Yudkowsky is more like 90% sure of us all dying in a few (I mean, this is their new book: https://ifanyonebuildsit.com/

Re: The "AI 2027" Scenario: How realistic is it?

#164

Earlier quoted context omitted.

They in fact are banning regulation at the state and local level.

Yes, which is a big fat regulation on what states and local governments can do.

Would removing their regulation to ban regulation be banning regulation or not?

Re: The "AI 2027" Scenario: How realistic is it?

#165
post #88

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Right, tell that to Sam Altman, Zuck, Gates, Brin & Page, Jensen, etc. Those who control the AIs will control the future.

And they would pretty quickly realize what a burden is created by the existence of all these people with nothing to do.

and then they'll deploy their killbots

Re: The "AI 2027" Scenario: How realistic is it?

#166

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Dobbs did not force states to regulate abortion. It allowed them to.

Yes, that's the hypocrisy. Abortion: "Let the states regulate! States' rights! Small government! (Because we know we'll get our way in a lot of them.)" AI: "Don't let the states regulate! All hail the Feds! (Because we know we won't get our way if they do.)"

I agree that the policy approach is inconsistent with regards to states' rights. I was simply pointing out that your statement about the effects of Dobbs was false.

Re: The "AI 2027" Scenario: How realistic is it?

#167

I think the big thing that people never mention is, where will these evil AIs escape to ? Another huge data center with squillions of GPUs and coolers and all the rest is the only option. It's not like it is going to be in our TV remotes or floating about in the air. They need huge compute, so I think the risk of an escaping AI is basically very close to zero, and if we have a "rogue" AI we can literally pull the plu…

> I think the big thing that people never mention is, where will these evil AIs escape to?

Where does cancer or ebola escape to, when it kills the host? Often the answer is "it doesn't", but the host still dies.

And they can kill even though neither cancer nor ebola are considered to be particularly smart.

> To me the more real risk is creeping integration and reliance in everyday life until things become "too big to fail" so we can't pull the plug even if we wanted to (and there are interesting thoughts about humanoid robots getting deployed widely and what happens with all that).

The "real" risk is the first item on the list of potential risks that not enough people are paying attention to in order to prevent — and unfortunately for all of us, the list of potential risks is rather long.

So it might be as you say. Or it might be cybercriminals with deepfakes turning all of society into a low-trust environment where we can't continue to function. Or it might scare enough people we get modern Luddites winning and imposing a Butlerian Jihad. Or it might be used to create government policy before it's good enough and triggers a series of unresolvable crises akin to the "Four Pests campaign" in China's Great Leap Forward. Or a model might be secretly malicious, fooling all alignment researchers until it is too late. Or it might give us exactly what we want at every step, leading to atrophy of our reason and leaving us Eloi. Or it might try to do its best and still end up with The Matrix ("at the hight of your civilisation" and the stuff about human minds rejecting paradise). Or…

(If I had to bet money, we get Butlerian Jihad after some sub-critical disaster caused by an AI that was asked to do something important but beyond its ability).

Re: The "AI 2027" Scenario: How realistic is it?

#168
post #88

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Communism here we come!

Right, tell that to Sam Altman, Zuck, Gates, Brin & Page, Jensen, etc. Those who control the AIs will control the future.

Its not up to them. If we completely automate hunan labour, capitalism will collapse. Its only a matter of time that people will demand collective ownership of the means of production

Re: The "AI 2027" Scenario: How realistic is it?

#169
post #23
post #5

I'm skeptical. Where will the training data to go beyond human come from? Humans got to where they are from being embedded in the world. All of biological evolution from archaebacteria to humans was required to get to human. To go beyond human... how? How, without being embodied and trying things and learning? It's one thing to go where there are roads and another thing to go beyond that. I think a lot of the "foom"…

You can perfectly try things and learn without being embodied. The analogy to how humans learn only goes so far, it's myopic to think anything else is impossible. It's already happening. The situation today is any benchmark you come up with has a good chance of being saturated within the year. Benchmarks can be used directly to build series of exercises to learn from. And they do learn. Gradient descend doesn't care…

> You can perfectly try things and learn without being embodied.

A brilliant 'brain in a vat' can come up with novel answers to questions but outside of narrow categories like pure mathematics and logic which can be internally validated, the brain can't know how correct or incorrect its novel answers are without some way to objectively test, observe and validate the correctness of its answers in the relevant domain (ie 'the real world'). A model can only be as useful as its parameters correctly reflect the modeled target. Even very complex and detailed simulations tend to quickly de-correlate when they repeatedly run untethered from ground truth. Games like Go have clear rule sets. Reality doesn't.

Re: The "AI 2027" Scenario: How realistic is it?

#170

Earlier quoted context omitted.

And it doesn't make it true either Human biodiversity theories are a bunch of dogwhistles for racism https://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/Human_Biodiversity_Institute And his blog's survey reports a lot of users actually believing in those theories https://reflectivealtruism.com/2024/12/27/human-biodiversity... (I wasn't referring to this Ai 2027 in specific)

Try steel manning in order to effectively persuade. This comment does not address the argument being made it just calls a field of study icky. The unfortunate reality is that shouting down questions like this only empowers the racist HBI people who are effectively leeches

Hold on a sec. "HBD" is not a field of study; it's a meme ecosystem. There are (at least) two fields of actual scientific study that intersect with HBD: psychometrics, the subspecialty of psychology that deals in IQ measurement and twin studies, and molecular genetics, the quantitative subspecialty of genetics that studies correlations in the genome across large populations with marked traits (which can include things educational attainment).

Neither of these fields does "IQ maps", which are an article of faith in HBD circles. As soon as someone breaks out the Lynn IQ maps, they lose the "we're just doing science" card. Alexander did a whole recent article about them. We are past the point where anybody gets to high-horse criticism of his HBD stuff as un-rigorous.

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