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Upcoming Windows 11 builds cannot install without internet and Microsoft Account

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Re: Upcoming Windows 11 builds cannot install without internet and Microsoft Account

#161

Post by hulitu »

0xmarcin wrote: post #123
samiv wrote: post #45

I'm also 100% convinced Microsoft will introduce mandatory code signing at some point and make it so that you can only ever install software from Windows Store. They are envious of the Google and Apple walled gardens/cashcows and are now determined to turn Windows into one. Windows is no longer a product for users, the users of Windows are the product for Microsoft to be shoved into the Azure sales funnel.

I highly doubt it, Windows is known for its stellar backward compatibility. Code signing means a lot of older software, that is still in use, would not be able to install or run. This is not going to happen (at least in the enterprise).

> Windows is known for its stellar backward compatibility.

was

Re: Upcoming Windows 11 builds cannot install without internet and Microsoft Account

#162

Post by throwaway48476 »

herbst wrote: post #159
tmikaeld wrote: post #116

Earlier quoted context omitted.

I second that, everything "just works" as you'd expect it to. If StreamOS can get widespread and they start to introduce desktop apps to the store, I think they can take some market share.

Imo just works is an understatement. Many games work better than ever.

On low power hardware many games run better because they not strangled by windows bloat.

Re: Upcoming Windows 11 builds cannot install without internet and Microsoft Account

#163

Post by herbst »

Ylpertnodi wrote: post #103
atemerev wrote: post #89

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Windows is a launcher for games, there is no other use for this system (correction: it still runs some specialized professional software that is too expensive to port). And now, even most of the games work on Linux too.

I have lots of windows (mainly music) software that I need, let alone outright purchased, and isn't available on Linux.

I got into music production again recently. To my surprise most recommended new software is either Linux native or properly ported. See reaper for example.

Many years ago music on Linux was hard, and years behind. Software was limited and the audio driver situation was a mess. But now you get professional software directly in the package manager and choose between several very reliable sound systems and even use the far majority of VST Plugins.

Re: Upcoming Windows 11 builds cannot install without internet and Microsoft Account

#164

Post by throwaway48476 »

samiv wrote: post #59
donnachangstein wrote: post #55

Earlier quoted context omitted.

> I'm also 100% convinced Microsoft will introduce mandatory code signing at some point and make it so that you can only ever install software from Windows Store 2017 called. It wants Windows S Mode back. Needless to say it still isn't very popular. But this has been around for 8 years now

Yep, the technology is already there. Just a question of time before they flip the switch for good and force it down everyone's throat and call it "enhanced security and user experience".

Windows S failed hard so they have a new strategy. Every new CPU ships with M$'s Pluton root of trust. For 'security' everything will have to be signed. They consider the user to be the threat actor. Eventually they will charge a percsnt fee for using their signing service.

Re: Upcoming Windows 11 builds cannot install without internet and Microsoft Account

#165

Post by zahllos »

Cyphase wrote: post #139
Kab1r wrote: post #47

Is there a good reason (other than licensing and Linux as an alternative) I shouldn't use Windows Server 202X as a Desktop OS?

I've heard tell that some software out there will refuse to operate on Windows Server because of licensing, like perhaps they want you to get a business license. I have no evidence at hand, but something to look into.

I worked at a software vendor where we would check the type of product and yes you needed our server product to run on their server product, whether or not you used the server as a server.

Not all software does this but I also don't recall it being unusual.

Re: Upcoming Windows 11 builds cannot install without internet and Microsoft Account

#166

Post by throwaway48476 »

0xmarcin wrote: post #123
samiv wrote: post #45

I'm also 100% convinced Microsoft will introduce mandatory code signing at some point and make it so that you can only ever install software from Windows Store. They are envious of the Google and Apple walled gardens/cashcows and are now determined to turn Windows into one. Windows is no longer a product for users, the users of Windows are the product for Microsoft to be shoved into the Azure sales funnel.

I highly doubt it, Windows is known for its stellar backward compatibility. Code signing means a lot of older software, that is still in use, would not be able to install or run. This is not going to happen (at least in the enterprise).

Users value backwards compatability. Users aren't the customers anymore and don't drive KPIs.

Re: Upcoming Windows 11 builds cannot install without internet and Microsoft Account

#167

Post by herbst »

atemerev wrote: post #144
sagolikasoppor wrote: post #143

Earlier quoted context omitted.

The only issue with that is when you switch to Linux, alternatives to Azure is much more compelling. I would never use Azure services unless I'm on Windows.

Well, I do. I still like Outlook, and it works good enough as a web app. Same for OneNote. Azure as the development platform is crazy, of course. But I also have a friend who I respect much, and who is probably a better engineer than me, who likes Azure and completely unproductive with AWS, so _maybe_ that's a matter of taste. Just like tabs and spaces. I prefer spaces, but whatever.

I prefer managing my own hardware and find both Azure and AWS very unproductive for anything else than huge, big traffic, projects. Not sure if that has to do anything with my OS choice.

Re: Upcoming Windows 11 builds cannot install without internet and Microsoft Account

#168

Post by throwaway48476 »

grishka wrote: post #145
samiv wrote: post #45

I'm also 100% convinced Microsoft will introduce mandatory code signing at some point and make it so that you can only ever install software from Windows Store. They are envious of the Google and Apple walled gardens/cashcows and are now determined to turn Windows into one. Windows is no longer a product for users, the users of Windows are the product for Microsoft to be shoved into the Azure sales funnel.

Mandatory code signing is meaningless without secure boot though, which can't be made mandatory on x86 systems.

MS's pluton is in every new CPU.

Re: Upcoming Windows 11 builds cannot install without internet and Microsoft Account

#169

Post by MYEUHD »

grishka wrote: post #148
bsdetector wrote: post #10

In October when Windows 10 support ends it'll finally be the year of desktop linux.

I'd like to remind you that there are still millions of people around the world using Windows 7 daily. The fact that some software is no longer supported by its developer doesn't mean it stops working somehow, or becomes radioactive.

It becomes easier to exploit, as it no longer gets security updates; and vulnerabilities are publicly disclosed.

Re: Upcoming Windows 11 builds cannot install without internet and Microsoft Account

#170

Post by hnlmorg »

khaledh wrote: post #119

Microsoft knew they were losing the client device market to iPhone and Android (after their Windows Phone flopped). So they essentially gave up on improving Windows, and decided to turn it into a thin client for Microsoft cloud services. For this model to work well, they need to force users to have a stable identification, aka Microsoft account, in order to login to the thin client. Windows is over. I moved to Apple…

I remember an interview with Bill Gates around 2000 (maybe even late 90s) where Gates said that the future of software was online subscription.

He even stated back then that he’s have Office run over the internet if he could.

Another example of this is how Xbox Live has been a thing since the original Xbox. Long before iOS and Android. And more recently, Xbox Live has become more than just a subscription service but a full on streaming platform.

Let’s also not forget that traditionally enterprise licenses for Windows would be billed annually. By this, I don’t mean someone purchasing Windows Server for their home lab, but actual data centre use. (I’m pretty sure this was the case, been a long long time since I’ve gone through a Microsoft audit, let alone been purchasing data center licenses, some someone do correct me if I’m misremembering here).

So I don’t think any of this is a knee jerk reaction to Apple and Google eating their market. I think it’s always been their long term strategy but it’s just taken this long for the wider industry to align.

Now with the gaming market being increasingly subscription based, other software vendors switching pricing format (eg Adobe) and the internet being far more accessible than ever, MS are in the best place they’ve ever been to press home the final missing piece: Windows Home.

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