Hacker News Board Hacker News, browsed like a classic message board
Live data from Hacker News

Italy demands Google poison DNS under strict Piracy Shield law

arstechnica.com

Post reply on HN
Print view View original

161–170 of 181 posts

Re: Italy demands Google poison DNS under strict Piracy Shield law

#161

Post by immibis »

Etheryte wrote: post #155
observationist wrote: post #104

Earlier quoted context omitted.

They need to say "fuck off, then, enjoy EuropeNet" and ignore their demands. There should be zero ambiguity and zero compliance. The internet doesn't work if arbitrary restrictions on speech get imposed. You cannot give a single goddamn inch or they will claw miles away, insidiously inserting their ever growing list of forbidden things.

The internet most definitely does work with some restrictions on speech, pretty much everywhere worldwide has rules that limit freedom of speech to some extent. In some countries it's defamation, in others it's hate speech, etc, and it's no different in the US. Freedom of speech means you're protected from government censorship, not that you can freely say anything without consequence. For example, you can't publicly…

As evidenced by the fact that the Internet still works with Cloudflare on it.

Seriously, they're one of the biggest restrictors of speech.

Re: Italy demands Google poison DNS under strict Piracy Shield law

#162

Post by immibis »

AdrianB1 wrote: post #22
bakugo wrote: post #15

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Unfortunately, even if we ignore the fact that Cloudflare probably has many Italian customers, there are other ways they can interfere with Cloudflare's services, such as by blocking their IP addresses in the country. It wouldn't be the first time this has been done by European ISPs, sadly.

Is that a problem for Cloudflare or with Italy? In the end, can Italy break Internet or can Internet cut off Italy? It is a theoretical question, I wonder how much control countries can have over a non-country level concept as Internet. The jurisdiction question is very much the point, does Cloudflare or Google provide a paid DNS service to Italian clients and the contract is regulated by Italian laws or it is a univ…

Italy already blocked Cloudflare once. The Mafia (seriously, it's thought to run a lot of these legal sports things) is a more powerful force in Italy than working internet.

Re: Italy demands Google poison DNS under strict Piracy Shield law

#163

Post by immibis »

realusername wrote: post #117
mikrotikker wrote: post #114

Earlier quoted context omitted.

And what do you think tik tok is? It's a similar service exerting propaganda on the populace at china's algorithmic control.

For now the Russian media and Twitter have worse influence on democracy than Tiktok ever did.

You're not thinking like a politician - you're thinking like the point is to maintain democracy etc. Russia Today will never tell people there's a genocide in Gaza, while TikTok does tell them that, so the latter is much more dangerous to politicians.

I don't know why politicians have this weird attitude towards Gaza, but they do.

Also, the propaganda on Russia Today supports strong governments, so your job as a politician will be safe even if they swing the next election. The propaganda on TikTok does not.

Re: Italy demands Google poison DNS under strict Piracy Shield law

#164

Post by EasyMark »

antirez wrote: post #76

Is all that folks "Why is Europe like that" from US? In that case, remember that TikTok is going to be banned because it is destroying US social networks business. On the contrary, this is an official order after the proof of copyright infringement, and targets the specific devices that are attached by people here in Italy on their TVs to stoke content (pezzotto). It's not single people that go watch some streaming,…

The TikTok ban is about Chinese Communist Party brainwashing our teenagers, spreading propaganda, and stealing Americans' personal data. It was never about protoecting facebook or twitter.

Re: Italy demands Google poison DNS under strict Piracy Shield law

#165

Post by EasyMark »

realusername wrote: post #117
mikrotikker wrote: post #114

Earlier quoted context omitted.

And what do you think tik tok is? It's a similar service exerting propaganda on the populace at china's algorithmic control.

For now the Russian media and Twitter have worse influence on democracy than Tiktok ever did.

Those can be next. It's one baby step at a time.

Re: Italy demands Google poison DNS under strict Piracy Shield law

#166

Post by sneak »

mikrotikker wrote: post #116
sneak wrote: post #94

Earlier quoted context omitted.

So is Facebook and Instagram. We’re only talking about banning the foreign one. Also, by that logic, all publishing is potentially a “national security concern”.

Banning /foreign/ influence and propaganda? Why would a country want to do that I wonder? We should bring back RT while we're at it then eh?

Yes. Human rights to free expression don’t end at the border, and are not contingent on citizenship.

If you only believe in human rights for passport holders, you don’t believe in human rights.

Furthermore, if you think your enemies having the right to publish whatever they like is a national security threat, you don’t believe in the nation or its founding principles as outlined in the US constitution.

State censorship is much more of a national security threat than foreign propaganda.

Re: Italy demands Google poison DNS under strict Piracy Shield law

#167

Post by golergka »

immibis wrote: post #163
realusername wrote: post #117

Earlier quoted context omitted.

For now the Russian media and Twitter have worse influence on democracy than Tiktok ever did.

You're not thinking like a politician - you're thinking like the point is to maintain democracy etc. Russia Today will never tell people there's a genocide in Gaza, while TikTok does tell them that, so the latter is much more dangerous to politicians. I don't know why politicians have this weird attitude towards Gaza, but they do. Also, the propaganda on Russia Today supports strong governments, so your job as a poli…

> Russia Today will never tell people there's a genocide in Gaza, while TikTok does tell them that

Well if RT was banned for other instances of disinformation, then Tiktok should absolutely be banned for this one.

Re: Italy demands Google poison DNS under strict Piracy Shield law

#168

Post by EasyMark »

realusername wrote: post #87
LeroyRaz wrote: post #78

Earlier quoted context omitted.

TikTok is a legitimate national security concern.

In the EU, I'd rank it a lower national security threat than Twitter or Facebook, by far. And seeing what's going on in the US now, I'd maybe have the same analysis for the US.

China doesn't consider EU it's primary advesary/competitor either though. They have a lot more incentive to use it against the USA.

Re: Italy demands Google poison DNS under strict Piracy Shield law

#169

Post by EasyMark »

mikrotikker wrote: post #116
sneak wrote: post #94

Earlier quoted context omitted.

So is Facebook and Instagram. We’re only talking about banning the foreign one. Also, by that logic, all publishing is potentially a “national security concern”.

Banning /foreign/ influence and propaganda? Why would a country want to do that I wonder? We should bring back RT while we're at it then eh?

I think a lot of people don't consider the implications of foreign powers acting against their nation, not a corporation in that country but the actual government using it's vast resources to undermine other countries.

Re: Italy demands Google poison DNS under strict Piracy Shield law

#170

Post by rstuart4133 »

Mindwipe wrote: post #143
bakugo wrote: post #23

Earlier quoted context omitted.

> How is this greedy? It's clearly illegal behavior, both from illegal re-broadcasters and from users. Most of those re-broadcast services aren't even free either, they're directly making money from the broadcasts they're replicating. Because piracy is a service problem. Pirate streaming sites attract users because they provide a better, more convenient service than the paid options. We've recently seen this happen i…

This is bollocks. Netflix gained popularity because they sold their service artificially cheap at a loss for many years to build market share and Kill off their competition, and that's it.

Can you point to the year Netflix made a loss for me? I don't see one in the last 12 years.

https://www.macrotrends.net/stocks/charts/NFLX/netflix/gross...

Post reply on HN