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QwQ-32B: Embracing the Power of Reinforcement Learning

qwenlm.github.io

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Re: QwQ-32B: Embracing the Power of Reinforcement Learning

#161

Post by aurareturn »

bugglebeetle wrote: post #18
gagan2020 wrote: post #5

Chinese strategy is open-source software part and earn on robotics part. And, They are already ahead of everyone in that game. These things are pretty interesting as they are developing. What US will do to retain its power? BTW I am Indian and we are not even in the race as country. :(

Unitree just open-sourced their robot designs: https://sc.mp/sr30f China’s strategy is to prevent any one bloc from achieving dominance and cutting off the others, while being the sole locus for the killer combination of industrial capacity + advanced research.

  China’s strategy is to prevent any one bloc from achieving dominance and cutting off the others, while being the sole locus for the killer combination of industrial capacity + advanced research.
You're acting like these startups are controlled by the Chinese government. In reality, they're just like any other American startup. They make decisions on how to make the most money - not what the Chinese government wants.

Re: QwQ-32B: Embracing the Power of Reinforcement Learning

#162

Post by esalman »

aurareturn wrote: post #161
bugglebeetle wrote: post #18

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Unitree just open-sourced their robot designs: https://sc.mp/sr30f China’s strategy is to prevent any one bloc from achieving dominance and cutting off the others, while being the sole locus for the killer combination of industrial capacity + advanced research.

China’s strategy is to prevent any one bloc from achieving dominance and cutting off the others, while being the sole locus for the killer combination of industrial capacity + advanced research. You're acting like these startups are controlled by the Chinese government. In reality, they're just like any other American startup. They make decisions on how to make the most money - not what the Chinese government wants.

What if aligning with Chinese interest becomes the best way to make money? What stopping the Chinese government from providing better incentives to businesses and academics?

Re: QwQ-32B: Embracing the Power of Reinforcement Learning

#163

Post by esalman »

dcreater wrote: post #122
gagan2020 wrote: post #5

Chinese strategy is open-source software part and earn on robotics part. And, They are already ahead of everyone in that game. These things are pretty interesting as they are developing. What US will do to retain its power? BTW I am Indian and we are not even in the race as country. :(

India is absolutely embarrassing. Could have been an extremely important 3rd party that obviates the moronic US vs China, us or them, fReEdOm vs communism narrative with all the talent it has.

Turns out conservatism and far right demagoguery is not great for progress.

Re: QwQ-32B: Embracing the Power of Reinforcement Learning

#164

Post by whatshisface »

h0l0cube wrote: post #151
whatshisface wrote: post #115

Earlier quoted context omitted.

That's an assumption, I'm trying to challenge it. Taxes usually take money out of the economy and lead to less activity. Why should a (very high) tax on transportation be different? These are not the sorts of things we can afford to just do without making sure they will work.

> Taxes usually take money out of the economy This is an oversimplification, they can change incentives, and sometimes increase investment. > lead to less activity I do agree money will be divested from the US as they become more and more expensive to deal with (leading to "less activity"), and like I said this will rechannel the economy between the rest of the world. The trade-off is that the US becomes a manufactur…

I don't think getting booed off the stage is a good way to end the discussion. The US is already a major exporter, of the goods we have an advantage at producing: simple foods, refined oil, advanced machines. Forcing farmers to plant avocados in potato fields isn't really going to help anybody, and neither is transferring oil refinery engineers to working on optimizing garmet factories. This will all take place against a backdrop of a poorer world with fewer dollars to spend on our goods, so it won't help our export sales either. Europe and China need to earn the dollars they buy our wheat with somehow - and without buying from them, I don't see how they'll do it.

Re: QwQ-32B: Embracing the Power of Reinforcement Learning

#165

Post by pzo »

freehorse wrote: post #153

How does it compare to qwen32b-r1-distill? Which is probably the most directly comparable model.

I'm wondering as well. Here in open llm leaderboard there is only preview. Better than deepseek-ai/DeepSeek-R1-Distill-Qwen-32B but surprisingly worse than deepseek-ai/DeepSeek-R1-Distill-Qwen-14B

in Open LLM leaderboard overall this model is ranked quite low at 660: https://huggingface.co/spaces/open-llm-leaderboard/open_llm_...

Re: QwQ-32B: Embracing the Power of Reinforcement Learning

#167

Post by aurareturn »

esalman wrote: post #162
aurareturn wrote: post #161

Earlier quoted context omitted.

China’s strategy is to prevent any one bloc from achieving dominance and cutting off the others, while being the sole locus for the killer combination of industrial capacity + advanced research. You're acting like these startups are controlled by the Chinese government. In reality, they're just like any other American startup. They make decisions on how to make the most money - not what the Chinese government wants.

What if aligning with Chinese interest becomes the best way to make money? What stopping the Chinese government from providing better incentives to businesses and academics?

You mean like what Trump has been doing? And most governments around the world?

Re: QwQ-32B: Embracing the Power of Reinforcement Learning

#168

Post by pzo »

fsndz wrote: post #29
Leary wrote: post #7

To test: https://chat.qwen.ai/ and select Qwen2.5-plus, then toggle QWQ.

super impressive. we won't need that many GPUs in the future if we can have the performance of DeepSeek R1 with even less parameters. NVIDIA is in trouble. We are moving towards a world of very cheap compute: https://medium.com/thoughts-on-machine-learning/a-future-of-...

Surprisingly those open models might be savour for Apple and gift for Qualcomm too. They can finetune them to their liking and catch up to competition and also sell more of their devices in the future. Longterm even better models for Vision will have problem to compete with latency of smaller models that are good enough but have very low latency. This will be important in robotics - reason Figure AI dumped OpenAI and started using their own AI models based on Open Source (founder mentioned recently in one interview).

Re: QwQ-32B: Embracing the Power of Reinforcement Learning

#169

Post by h0l0cube »

whatshisface wrote: post #164
h0l0cube wrote: post #151

Earlier quoted context omitted.

> Taxes usually take money out of the economy This is an oversimplification, they can change incentives, and sometimes increase investment. > lead to less activity I do agree money will be divested from the US as they become more and more expensive to deal with (leading to "less activity"), and like I said this will rechannel the economy between the rest of the world. The trade-off is that the US becomes a manufactur…

I don't think getting booed off the stage is a good way to end the discussion. The US is already a major exporter, of the goods we have an advantage at producing: simple foods, refined oil, advanced machines. Forcing farmers to plant avocados in potato fields isn't really going to help anybody, and neither is transferring oil refinery engineers to working on optimizing garmet factories. This will all take place again…

It seems like an almost impossible task, especially if compromises aren't made on tariffs (I expect they will be). The US does have military leverage as the sole supplier of advanced weaponry to many countries, but I think the USD would need to massively downgrade for America to become an net-export market once again.

Once again, I'm well out of my depth to be able to speculate here. But ostensibly globalization hasn't worked for the working class of America, and that has led to the current state of affairs.

Re: QwQ-32B: Embracing the Power of Reinforcement Learning

#170

Post by Ey7NFZ3P0nzAe »

dr_dshiv wrote: post #44

I love that emphasizing math learning and coding leads to general reasoning skills. Probably works the same in humans, too. 20x smaller than Deep Seek! How small can these go? What kind of hardware can run this?

A mathematician once told me that this might be because math teaches you to have different representations for a same thing, you then have to manipulate those abstractions and wander through their hierarchy until you find an objective answer.
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