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Tailwind CSS v4.0

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Re: Tailwind CSS v4.0

#161

Post by agos »

dbbk wrote: post #157
nakovet wrote: post #15

I love tailwind, used in 3 projects in the past 4 years, it’s intuitive, well documented, simple. I don’t miss the days of emotion and styled components where I would have to think of a name for every styled div in the project, with tailwind a container is just a div and a few classes nothing else. Less bike shedding discussion, less brain cycles spent naming things, less time wasted in reviews.

> I don’t miss the days of emotion and styled components where I would have to think of a name for every styled div in the project I see people mention this issue fairly frequently, and it puzzles me a little. I have never once spent probably more than 1 second thinking about what to name something. Is it actually a blocker for some people? Are you really paralysed by this?

especially since with any decent CSS solution (any css in js, or CSS modules) you can reuse names

Re: Tailwind CSS v4.0

#162

Post by gr__or »

Tailwind is a testament to the greatness of inline styles (styling a thing without naming it), the universality of strings and also the limits of strings.

I am excited for what comes after it, until then I'll use Tailwind (reluctantly)

Re: Tailwind CSS v4.0

#163

Post by yoz-y »

jitl wrote: post #92
tipiirai wrote: post #91

Earlier quoted context omitted.

True — they just need to be more engineers than designers.

I don’t think putting html in one file and css in another file makes you more or less of a designer than putting both html and css into a single file.

I think the approach is different. Component style applications have to thing about all component presentation separately, web apps ressemble apps more than documents (d’uh) so it makes sense that they are designed as such.

Documents are designed holistically, you don’t care that much about how a thing (say, an image that is an aside) would look on the next page because on the next page there would be something completely different.

I think much of the debate and contention comes from the fact that many developers only worked on either web apps, or documents (e.g.: static blog, cms) and each try to convince the other group that their approach is the best.

Re: Tailwind CSS v4.0

#164

Post by agos »

throwup238 wrote: post #97
homarp wrote: post #71

Earlier quoted context omitted.

ia that really easier than learning css directly? since you have to understand 'paddding'and 'px' ? see https://developer.mozilla.org/en-US/docs/Web/CSS/padding vs https://tailwindcss.com/docs/padding

One of the reasons Tailwind became so popular - even more so than preceding frameworks like Bootstrap - is that a lot of people who normally liked working with CSS directly fell in love with it. It removes the extra step of editing a separate CSS file without straying far from a 1:1 mapping and eliminates most of the cascading rules that have plagued frontend for decades (`group:` and friends notwithstanding). The la…

sorry, but this is just not true. The cascading issue is still there, and it gets even worse because if you have an element with class "p-1 p-0" you cannot know in advance which will take precedence.

Of course you shouldn't do that, but it happens to be the case that Phoenix does exactly that

Re: Tailwind CSS v4.0

#165

Post by topicseed »

asimpletune wrote: post #144

I used tailwind for my site and ended up liking it a lot, but maybe for reasons that are not often mentioned? The real value of tailwind is being able to read all the styles that affect a an element in one place. Sure the classnames can get long, but it’s still a lot faster to read that long line, than open the browser tools each time or scroll up and down one (or many) stylesheets. Then when you come back to that co…

I kind of agree but the same problem exists. If you add text-xl to a div and have nested divs and spans, they'll all be inheriting text-xl so for these nested elements, you also have to look up the element's lineage to find what's causing the text-xl.

But overall it's a bit easier yes.

Re: Tailwind CSS v4.0

#166

Post by ahofmann »

agos wrote: post #164
throwup238 wrote: post #97

Earlier quoted context omitted.

One of the reasons Tailwind became so popular - even more so than preceding frameworks like Bootstrap - is that a lot of people who normally liked working with CSS directly fell in love with it. It removes the extra step of editing a separate CSS file without straying far from a 1:1 mapping and eliminates most of the cascading rules that have plagued frontend for decades (`group:` and friends notwithstanding). The la…

sorry, but this is just not true. The cascading issue is still there, and it gets even worse because if you have an element with class "p-1 p-0" you cannot know in advance which will take precedence. Of course you shouldn't do that, but it happens to be the case that Phoenix does exactly that

This is not a cascading issue. This is a "You're holding it wrong" issue. And when Phoenix does write 'p-0 p-1', Phoenix and Tailwind are not a good match.

Re: Tailwind CSS v4.0

#167

Post by Fred27 »

Tailwind suits the kind of developers who hack things together and build up technical debt and spaghetti code rather thinking about things first and designing things properly.

Re: Tailwind CSS v4.0

#168

Post by _heimdall »

nakovet wrote: post #15

I love tailwind, used in 3 projects in the past 4 years, it’s intuitive, well documented, simple. I don’t miss the days of emotion and styled components where I would have to think of a name for every styled div in the project, with tailwind a container is just a div and a few classes nothing else. Less bike shedding discussion, less brain cycles spent naming things, less time wasted in reviews.

This is actually one of the main reasons I avoid react when I have the option. Styling in react is terrible, I'll use tailwind with it but only as the least bad option.

If I am using a frontend framework and a build step, svelte and astro are nice depending on the use case. I can style with plain old CSS and rarely have to reach for class names, if you keep components small you can get away with element selectors and let the framework scope styles at build time.

Re: Tailwind CSS v4.0

#169

Post by khana »

bern4444 wrote: post #79

My initial reaction to Tailwind was: what a pain. I already know CSS, now I have to learn CSS again... I imagine its how parents might feel when they go to help their children with math homework only to find the math is now totally different from when they were in school and their methods (while still valid) for solving problems are no longer accepted by the school and their child is annoyed by having to reconcile th…

[dead]

Re: Tailwind CSS v4.0

#170

Post by whstl »

Fred27 wrote: post #167

Tailwind suits the kind of developers who hack things together and build up technical debt and spaghetti code rather thinking about things first and designing things properly.

I don't know. In 20+ years I have seen way more abominations and spaghetti CSS using other every CSS technique.

With Tailwind at least I know what to expect, and the code in practice rarely deviates from what it's supposed to look like.

I'm all for "not building up technical debt" and "thinking about things first" but in my personal experience the anti-Tailwind crowd doesn't have much to show here in this regard. Sure: it's theoretically possible to build a perfect CSS ivory tower, I just haven't seen even a passable one in a non-trivial project, it always devolves into a mess for various reasons... often breaking the rules of the paradigms like BEM and OOCSS, often because of cutting corners here and there.

Addendum: I'm all for criticising techniques, but it's interesting that the anti-Tailwind crowd always resorts to attacking the character of the developers that use it.

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