Hacker News Board Hacker News, browsed like a classic message board
Live data from Hacker News

Two undersea cables in Baltic Sea disrupted

cnn.com

Post reply on HN
Print view View original

161–170 of 1001 posts

Re: Two undersea cables in Baltic Sea disrupted

#161

Post by aguaviva »

JumpCrisscross wrote: post #134
PKop wrote: post #125

Earlier quoted context omitted.

So sacrifice more Ukrainian men for the meat grinder? What has that accomplished so far?

> sacrifice more Ukrainian men for the meat grinder? To the extent there's a meat grinder, it's of Russians [1]. > What has that accomplished so far? Russia's disqualifying itself as a conventional military threat for at least a generation. It's not yet there yet, largely because Ukraine has been unable to target its war marchine. But the startling inefficacy of its army and technology has been made clear. Moreover,…

To the extent there's a meat grinder, it's of Russians.

That seems unfair. It's more of a meat grinder for the aggressor, but it's also one for the Ukrainians, by all indications.

Re: Two undersea cables in Baltic Sea disrupted

#162

Post by JumpCrisscross »

stackskipton wrote: post #148
JumpCrisscross wrote: post #103

Earlier quoted context omitted.

> technically you are in international waters and thus cannot be stopped by any Navy except your own unless there is UN Sanctions What? No? How do you think we arraign pirates? > it obviously opens up massive can of worms that could impact worldwide trade No? Why? Worst case it would be considered an act of war. Practically, they'd just be arrested.

>What? No? How do you think we arraign pirates? Because piracy is one of exceptions to "No stopping not your flag ships in international waters." Here is list of exception: (a) the ship is engaged in piracy; (b) the ship is engaged in the slave trade; (c) the ship is engaged in unauthorized broadcasting and the flag State of the warship has jurisdiction under article 109; (d) the ship is without nationality; or (e) t…

> So under which clause would you like to stop Russian ships cutting cables in international waters?

Piracy. Duh. That or you'd break the treaty. (Like China has been [1].)

[1] https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/South_China_Sea_Arbitration

Re: Two undersea cables in Baltic Sea disrupted

#163

Post by dragonwriter »

VagabundoP wrote: post #116
RobotToaster wrote: post #98

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Yugoslavia?

That was not a NATO action.

I’m not sure if you are referring to the NATO intervention in the first part of the wars as Yugoslavia broke up (Bosnia, primarily starting in 1992) or later (the NATO-Yugoslavia war over Kosovo, starting 1999) or layer yet (the NATO involvement in the internal conflict of then-NATO partner North Macedonia in 2001), but all three were official NATO operations (and listed as such on NATO’s website.)

Re: Two undersea cables in Baltic Sea disrupted

#164

Post by PKop »

marssaxman wrote: post #155
PKop wrote: post #125

Earlier quoted context omitted.

So sacrifice more Ukrainian men for the meat grinder? What has that accomplished so far?

What business is that of ours? It's up to the Ukrainians what they are willing to do in defense of their country.

>we could have fight for us

C'mon. Their funding is entirely US dependent. What business is that of ours? We are enabling it. How could you possibly ask the question "what business is that of ours"? Explain yourself, that question is absurd.

Re: Two undersea cables in Baltic Sea disrupted

#165

Post by bdjsiqoocwk »

meiraleal wrote: post #65
tetrisgm wrote: post #60

The constant Russian interference, combined with the regular escalation from the jets patrolling, and the radar jamming, really needs to be dealt with. We're stuck between having to do timid actions and full NATO escalation. This feels like constant creep.

[flagged]

> Maybe if you guys really think you are much better than Russia that it has no rights to fight back then go there and invade it

We don't want to invade Russia. In fact, we don't think about Russia at all.

Re: Two undersea cables in Baltic Sea disrupted

#166

Post by PKop »

JumpCrisscross wrote: post #134
PKop wrote: post #125

Earlier quoted context omitted.

So sacrifice more Ukrainian men for the meat grinder? What has that accomplished so far?

> sacrifice more Ukrainian men for the meat grinder? To the extent there's a meat grinder, it's of Russians [1]. > What has that accomplished so far? Russia's disqualifying itself as a conventional military threat for at least a generation. It's not yet there yet, largely because Ukraine has been unable to target its war marchine. But the startling inefficacy of its army and technology has been made clear. Moreover,…

>To the extent there's a meat grinder, it's of Russians

It's of both. Why deny the fact Ukrainian men are dying in droves? This is disrespectful of those that paid the ultimate sacrifice. Pretending this is not extremely costly to Ukraine in manpower is denying reality. They have been increasing the age of conscripts as they're running out of young men.

Re: Two undersea cables in Baltic Sea disrupted

#167

Post by Hamuko »

thewavelength wrote: post #62
mg wrote: post #50

Hetzner seems unaffected? ping hel1-speed.hetzner.com Gives me 52ms from Germany which should be about normal?

Hetzner says they are affected: https://status.hetzner.com/incident/ec8a2f28-e964-46cb-94fa-...

That is a very terse statement all things considered.

Re: Two undersea cables in Baltic Sea disrupted

#168

Post by zelon88 »

jjeaff wrote: post #127
zelon88 wrote: post #76

It's just practice. Locate the cables, establish a means of damaging them, deploy the means as a test and a show of force. The western economy is almost completely built using off-prem in Cloud PaaS environments. It should be pretty fun when WW3 starts and not a single hospital, school, laboratory, or factory can operate.

while outages definitely cause big problems in hospitals and schools, neither are completely dependent on connectivity in the short term. most hospitals are required to be able to operate critical services in an outage. even a full power outage. Schools will definitely be fine. they just may have a serious backlog of entering grades, absences, and payroll once things get back online.

> once things get back online.

That would be like trying to cold start a power plant without any power.

I think you're missing my point. I'm trying to point out that there are 3 "infrastructure providers" that our economy CANNOT live without. In a world war situation, these 3 organizations are going to be the biggest targets. They are literally our crown jewels.

They will be under continuous attack from all angles. As we know with security, it is a game of time. Even the strongest bank safe has a rating in hours that it can resist direct tampering. Beyond that time rating the safe offers little to no protection. It is the layers of security that keep the safe from being tampered with beyond its rating.

What I'm saying is, no target can be secured with 100% security guarantee. Even the most secure systems will fail if met with a concerted attacker with unlimited resources.

If WW3 starts, we will lose Azure, AWS, and GCP within 5 days and it will be more or less completely destroyed within 30 days. They won't survive concerted attacks from nation state actors during war time.

Even if they can't be hacked, they will be physically destroyed with kinetic weapons. There is no Bitdefender plan that will save them from warheads.

Re: Two undersea cables in Baltic Sea disrupted

#169

Post by JumpCrisscross »

PKop wrote: post #164
marssaxman wrote: post #155

Earlier quoted context omitted.

What business is that of ours? It's up to the Ukrainians what they are willing to do in defense of their country.

>we could have fight for us C'mon. Their funding is entirely US dependent. What business is that of ours? We are enabling it. How could you possibly ask the question "what business is that of ours"? Explain yourself, that question is absurd.

> What business is that of ours? We are enabling it.

They clearly want to fight! This is like arguing giving someone chemo is enabling their cancer.

Re: Two undersea cables in Baltic Sea disrupted

#170

Post by petre »

toss1 wrote: post #5

Substantial Russian activity also near UK, raises concerns that Russia would cut off UK. [0] Russian ships ‘plotting sabotage in the North Sea’ [1] [0] https://www.independent.co.uk/news/uk/home-news/uk-undersea-... [1] https://www.independent.co.uk/news/world/europe/russia-ships...

The Irish just chased away a Russian "research" vessel.

https://www.theguardian.com/world/2024/nov/16/russian-spy-sh...

Post reply on HN