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Claude AI built me a React app to compare maps side by side

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Re: Claude AI built me a React app to compare maps side by side

#161
post #129

Earlier quoted context omitted.

I'm curious: what do you do when the LLM starts hallucinating, or gets stuck in a loop of generating non-working code that it can't get out of? What do you do when you need to troubleshoot and fix an issue it introduced, but has no idea how to fix? In my experience of these tools, including the flagship models discussed here, this is a deal-breaking problem. If I have to waste time re-prompting to make progress, and…

These two projects were almost entirely written with LLMs: https://github.com/williamcotton/search-input-query https://github.com/williamcotton/guish Both are non-trivial but certainly within the context window so they're not large projects. However, they are easily extensible due to the architecture I instructed as I was building them! The first contains a recursive descent parser for a search query DSL (and much mo…

I think there’s often a disconnect between what lay-people hear when someone says “I built an app using AI” and the reality.

What it seems like a lot people assume the process is that you give the AI a relatively high level prompt that’s a description of features, and you get a back a fully functioning app that does everything you outlined.

In my experience (and I think what you are describing here), is that the initial feature-based prompt will often give you (some what impressively) a basic functioning app. But as you start iterating on that app, the high level feature-based prompts start not working very well pretty quickly. It then becomes more an exercise in programming by proxy — where you basically tell the AI what code to write/what changes are needed at a technical level in smaller chunks, and it saves you a lot of time by actually writing the proper syntax. The thing you still have know how to program to be able to accomplish this — (arguably, you have to be a fairly decent programmer who can already reasonably break down complicated tasks into small understandable chunks).

Furthermore, if you want to AI write good code with a solid architecture you pretty much have to tell it what to do from a technical level from the start — for example, here I imagine the AI didn’t come up with structuring things to work as the AST level on its own — you knew that would give you a solid architecture to build on, so you told it to do that.

As someone whose already a half decent programmer, I’ve found this process to be a pretty significant boon to my productivity, on the other hand beyond the basic POC app, I have a hard time seeing it living up the marketing hype of “Anyone can build an app using AI!” that’s being constantly spewed.

Re: Claude AI built me a React app to compare maps side by side

#162
post #157

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Look at the replies on my comment This place is far gone. Some of the most close minded, uncurious people in tech I don’t think this place deserves to be called “Hacker” News anymore

We have different definitions of hacker. I played around with LLMs... Found they aren't very useful. Slapping a project together to ship isn't what hacking is about. Hacking is about deeply understanding what is actually happening under the hood by playing around, taking it apart, rebuilding it. When the craze started everyone here were out looking for ways to escape the safeties of the LLMs, or discussing how they a…

So almost every person on here is not a hacker since I’ve met very few people here who are knowledgeable about EE, computer architecture, compiler technology, or heck even how browsers work. Of course there are some, but HN is mostly about slapping together technology to sell your startup.

Re: Claude AI built me a React app to compare maps side by side

#163
post #148
post #136

Earlier quoted context omitted.

> It also reduces the knowledge needed. I don't particularly care about learning how to setup and configure a web extension from scratch. With LLM, I can get 90% of that working in minutes, then focus on the parts that I am interested in. Eh, I would argue that the apparent lower knowledge requirement is an illusion. These tools produce non-working code more often than not (OpenAI's flagship models are not even corre…

All the projects I've been able to start and make progress in in the past year vs the ten years before that are substantive enough proof for me that you're wrong in pretty much all of your arguments. My direct experience proves statements like "the lower knowledge requirement is an illusion" and "it takes much more effort to review code than to write it" wrong. I do code reviews all the time. I write code all the tim…

I understand your frustration. It's like someone trying to convince me that a red car I'm looking at is actually blue. I know what I'm seeing and experiencing. There's nothing theoretical about it and I have the results right in front of me.

Re: Claude AI built me a React app to compare maps side by side

#164
post #148
post #136

Earlier quoted context omitted.

> It also reduces the knowledge needed. I don't particularly care about learning how to setup and configure a web extension from scratch. With LLM, I can get 90% of that working in minutes, then focus on the parts that I am interested in. Eh, I would argue that the apparent lower knowledge requirement is an illusion. These tools produce non-working code more often than not (OpenAI's flagship models are not even corre…

All the projects I've been able to start and make progress in in the past year vs the ten years before that are substantive enough proof for me that you're wrong in pretty much all of your arguments. My direct experience proves statements like "the lower knowledge requirement is an illusion" and "it takes much more effort to review code than to write it" wrong. I do code reviews all the time. I write code all the tim…

It’s baffling to see all the ignorant answers to this thread, OP. My experience has been similar to yours, and I’ve been pushing complex software to production for the past 20 years.

Feels like a bunch o flat earth arguments; they’d rather ignore evidence (or even try out by themselves) to keep the illusion that you need to write it all yourself for it to be “high quality”.

Re: Claude AI built me a React app to compare maps side by side

#165
post #136

Earlier quoted context omitted.

> It also reduces the knowledge needed. I don't particularly care about learning how to setup and configure a web extension from scratch. With LLM, I can get 90% of that working in minutes, then focus on the parts that I am interested in. Eh, I would argue that the apparent lower knowledge requirement is an illusion. These tools produce non-working code more often than not (OpenAI's flagship models are not even corre…

Things have improved considerably over the last 3 months. Claude with cursor.ai is certainly over 50%

I haven't used cursor.ai, but Claude 3.5 Sonnet definitely has the issues I'm talking about. Maybe I'm not great at prompting, but this is far from an exact science. I always ask it specific things I need help with, making sure to provide sufficient detail, and don't ask it to produce mountains of code. I've had it generate code that not only hallucinates APIs, but has trivial bugs like referencing undefined variables. How this can scale beyond a few lines of code to produce an actually working application is beyond me. But apparently I'm in the minority here, since people are actually using these tools successfully for just that, so more power to them.

Re: Claude AI built me a React app to compare maps side by side

#166
post #142

Earlier quoted context omitted.

These are not the things I wanted to create, but its better to ship out something than waste months just building something and never shipping. I did that with MetaHacker which, under the hood, is very capable. But because I spent so much time building it, I never got around to marketing it or monetizing it, so much of it is abandoned and only 1/10th of it is live for end users. So for my future projects, I told myse…

> its better to ship out something than waste months just building something and never shipping. I agree with you there. > There are much bigger, more creative ideas I want to tackle, but before that, I want to get the hang of actually building something from scratch Fair enough. And good on you for doing a career shift and learning new skills. I don't want to tear down your efforts. I just think we disagree on the a…

Well, I've had dozens of signups every day for ThumbnailGenius depsite 0 marketing. Whatever I'm doing, people seem to like it. I had way more data on it about thumbnails (including an index of 100k thumbnails) but had to remove that because YouTube didn't like it.

I can't see why any of these would seem like "scams" because I'm not asking for money for any of them except for ThumbnailGenius. Not sure how a free product can be a scam or a cashgrab?

And I don't know how familiar you are with YouTube, but most serious creators typically take multiple pictures of themselves, then get multiple thumbnail variants created by an editor. A good creator will typically spend hundreds of dollars just testing out variations to see how they "look". AI just makes it easy to create the variations and visualize different ideas.

Most of the users end up visualizing 20-30 ideas, then picking 1-2 and actually creating them in real life. It's a massive time and money saver

Re: Claude AI built me a React app to compare maps side by side

#167
post #148

Earlier quoted context omitted.

All the projects I've been able to start and make progress in in the past year vs the ten years before that are substantive enough proof for me that you're wrong in pretty much all of your arguments. My direct experience proves statements like "the lower knowledge requirement is an illusion" and "it takes much more effort to review code than to write it" wrong. I do code reviews all the time. I write code all the tim…

It’s baffling to see all the ignorant answers to this thread, OP. My experience has been similar to yours, and I’ve been pushing complex software to production for the past 20 years. Feels like a bunch o flat earth arguments; they’d rather ignore evidence (or even try out by themselves) to keep the illusion that you need to write it all yourself for it to be “high quality”.

Or, hey, maybe we've just had different experiences, and are using these tools differently? I even concede that I may not be great at prompting, which could be the cause of my problems.

I'm not arguing that writing everything yourself leads to higher quality. I'm arguing that _in my experience_ a) it takes more time and effort to read, troubleshoot and fix code generated by these tools than it would take me to actually write it myself, and b) that taking the time to read the documentation and understand the technologies I'm working with would actually save me time and effort in the future.

You're free to disagree with all of this, but don't try to tell me my experience is somehow lesser than yours.

Re: Claude AI built me a React app to compare maps side by side

#168
post #49

Earlier quoted context omitted.

What's the point of this question? Everybody ships nasty bugs in production that he himself might find impossible to debug, everybody. Thus he will do the very same thing me, you or anybody else on this planet do, find a second pair of eyes, virtually or not, paying or not.

> Everybody ships nasty bugs in production that he himself might find impossible to debug, everybody. No.

I haven't seen anybody, regardless of org, procedures or whatever to never ship a bug he himself could not debug.

Hell, I don't even see it happening in OS space with dozens of eyes on years-long PRs.

It just happens.

At some point you'll write and ship a bug that you yourself can't debug in an appropriate time frame alone and needs more eyes.

Re: Claude AI built me a React app to compare maps side by side

#169

Earlier quoted context omitted.

exactly right. POCs and demos are easy to build by anyone these days. The last 10% is what separates student projects from real products. any engineer who has spent time in the trenches understands that fixing corner cases in code produced by inexperienced engineers consumes a lot of time. in fact, poor overall design and lack of diligence tanks entire projects.

Sometimes it's not even inexperienced coders -- it's our own dang selves ;-)

Well, in my mind, the SketchySeaBeast of last week is inexperienced compared to the SketchySeaBeast of this one.

Re: Claude AI built me a React app to compare maps side by side

#170
post #57

Earlier quoted context omitted.

If customers do mind then at best it's an opportunity cost (less people will buy). Shipping with bugs > not shipping, simple as.

You better hope no bugs expose you to liabilities like runaway cloud costs or mishandling sensitive data

Yeah SaaS is a different beast. Lots of areas worth hardening. Not really for customers but mainly for yourself. But desktop apps, mobile apps, self-hosted stuff, games, CLIs, libraries - you don't really have to worry about much.
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