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Sixteen U.S. states still ban community-owned broadband networks

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Re: Sixteen U.S. states still ban community-owned broadband networks

#161

Post by ethbr1 »

swatcoder wrote: post #121
Brian_K_White wrote: post #58

A hundred years ago on irc someone from Russia was describing their internet connection, which was ethernet, while I had only ever heard of dial up outside of large companies. It was just people had set up their own hubs and switches in their appartment buildings and strung cables between buildings. This blew my mind. They just ran themselves ethernet and everyone got a drop from a switch in their building. It wasn't…

> Unimaginable in the US. Not at all. Even in the US, rural folk have been beaming directional wifi to each other for a couple decades now (at least), and sharing utilities by personally running electrical, coax, telephone, or ethernet throughout a shared building or across houses stretches back for as long as those services have been available. Sharing ("stealing") Cable TV by just running coax around was huge befor…

> Same goes for power in squatted urban units or among trailers/shacks where they would be clustered tightly.

Something I've always been curious about: how much stolen electricity / water can a modern utility detect? And how well can they localize the source?

Asking for friend.

Re: Sixteen U.S. states still ban community-owned broadband networks

#162

Post by shiroiushi »

macspoofing wrote: post #73
wyldfire wrote: post #63

Earlier quoted context omitted.

> Unimaginable in the US With good reason. Building codes in the US prevent disasters like the one that happened at Grenfell Towers in the UK. Run plenum-rated wires through an appropriate space for safety's sake.

> Building codes in the US prevent disasters like the one that happened at Grenfell Towers in the UK US building codes are pretty good and well enforced, just as they are in the UK ... but even with that, you have a Surfside condominium collapse - so not perfect.

Surfside was almost a half-century old, so the building codes were surely different back then.

Also, building codes concern how to design and build a structure; they aren't going to help much with terrible maintenance.

Re: Sixteen U.S. states still ban community-owned broadband networks

#163

Post by int_19h »

Brian_K_White wrote: post #58

A hundred years ago on irc someone from Russia was describing their internet connection, which was ethernet, while I had only ever heard of dial up outside of large companies. It was just people had set up their own hubs and switches in their appartment buildings and strung cables between buildings. This blew my mind. They just ran themselves ethernet and everyone got a drop from a switch in their building. It wasn't…

In mid-00s this was still how much of the country got its Internet, actually, even in Moscow. I wouldn't say those things were "community", exactly; it would usually be a few people with enough knowledge to set it up, running it all as an actual business - officially registered and all - with other residents of those buildings paying for their connectivity.

But even then it was still very anarchic. For example, one common perk of such setups for their customers was that traffic inside the LAN would be free. And they'd run searchable file sharing servers and P2P hubs (Direct Connect, usually) inside the net, which members would use to share their file collections.

Some of those actually evolved into "proper" ISPs eventually.

Re: Sixteen U.S. states still ban community-owned broadband networks

#164

Post by int_19h »

alsetmusic wrote: post #81
Brian_K_White wrote: post #58

A hundred years ago on irc someone from Russia was describing their internet connection, which was ethernet, while I had only ever heard of dial up outside of large companies. It was just people had set up their own hubs and switches in their appartment buildings and strung cables between buildings. This blew my mind. They just ran themselves ethernet and everyone got a drop from a switch in their building. It wasn't…

You're describing the sort of daydreams I had about running a cable between my home and my friend's home when I was 14 years old. We were too far apart. But playing Descent matches would have been awesome. We got by on dialup, but a kid can dream. I also dreamt of ISDN. Looking back, it seems such a paltry offering, but that tells you what an old man I've become.

Direct local PPP dialup (i.e. between two PCs) wasn't too bad for multiplayer for games that era.

Re: Sixteen U.S. states still ban community-owned broadband networks

#165

Post by Dracophoenix »

Brian_K_White wrote: post #58

A hundred years ago on irc someone from Russia was describing their internet connection, which was ethernet, while I had only ever heard of dial up outside of large companies. It was just people had set up their own hubs and switches in their appartment buildings and strung cables between buildings. This blew my mind. They just ran themselves ethernet and everyone got a drop from a switch in their building. It wasn't…

> A hundred years ago on irc someone from Russia was describing their internet connection, which was ethernet, while I had only ever heard of dial up outside of large companies.

He might have been a student at Moscow State

https://scribe.rip/p/moscow-state-university-network-built-b...

Re: Sixteen U.S. states still ban community-owned broadband networks

#166

Post by trogdor »

potato3732842 wrote: post #120
mapt wrote: post #94

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Polyurethane spray foam is pretty damn fiery in most conditions, even if the right number of carcinogenic flame retardants can limit open flame spread on a surface. It's also got the most toxic, thick sort of smoke of the available options, other than the polyiso in Grenfall. There are two inherently fire-safe, inexpensive insulation options, borated cellulose and mineral wool. You can even use them as fire-stops. Ne…

Fire departments generally love foam because while it does burn it fills entire spaces and prevents fire spread and limits exhaust of combustion byproducts (which limits oxygen intake on the other end). What would have been total losses turn into minor repair and smoke damage rehab. I'm still not a fan though.

> What would have been total losses turn into minor repair and smoke damage rehab.

In my (admittedly minimal) experience as a volunteer firefighter, “minor repair and smoke damage rehab” isn’t a thing once a fire is progresses handheld fire extinguishers.

Water causes a massive amount of damage, and you often need to rip apart walls and floors - with water sometimes joining the party - in order to ensure the fire is fully extinguished.

Re: Sixteen U.S. states still ban community-owned broadband networks

#168

Post by Brian_K_White »

int_19h wrote: post #163
Brian_K_White wrote: post #58

A hundred years ago on irc someone from Russia was describing their internet connection, which was ethernet, while I had only ever heard of dial up outside of large companies. It was just people had set up their own hubs and switches in their appartment buildings and strung cables between buildings. This blew my mind. They just ran themselves ethernet and everyone got a drop from a switch in their building. It wasn't…

In mid-00s this was still how much of the country got its Internet, actually, even in Moscow. I wouldn't say those things were "community", exactly; it would usually be a few people with enough knowledge to set it up, running it all as an actual business - officially registered and all - with other residents of those buildings paying for their connectivity. But even then it was still very anarchic. For example, one c…

Oh that's right, I think I remember them talking about local file stores and other local services too.

Initially they had only said something off hand that was normal for them, but the whole room was fascinated and asked them questions and they ended up describing as much as they could.

They didn't actually know that much about how it worked or was set up, they were just a regular user.

Re: Sixteen U.S. states still ban community-owned broadband networks

#169

Post by red-iron-pine »

Propelloni wrote: post #104
bryanlarsen wrote: post #91

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Communities own the roads, trucking companies are commercial.

It's almost like someone read Adam Smith's Wealth of Nations!

something something externalities something
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