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I like the RP2040

dgroshev.com

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Re: I like the RP2040

#161

Post by peteforde »

crote wrote: post #157
peteforde wrote: post #120

I also like the RP2040, but I'd like to explain why I migrated away from it for my current project. First, the drama with PlatformIO really rubbed me the wrong way. I'm taking the side of the developers who are hurt by confusion in tooling. Second, the top of the line ESP32-S3 comes in a module format that can be dropped on a PCB with basically nothing but a few decoupling capacitors. The RP2040 requires careful plac…

> The RP2040 requires careful placement of about a dozen components, including a crystal. To be fair, the chip is designed to make these really easy to place. There's pretty much one single layout which makes sense, and it provides easy access to all the pins you could possibly want. Combine that with the excellent documentation they have provided, and it's essentially just a multi-part drop-in design you don't ever…

You're kind of making my point for me; when every engineer has to place a dozen components, a non-zero number of them are going to make facepalm mistakes.

Even if you create a sub-module layout that you include in every project you work on... that's still n slightly different permutations of the same thing, even if they are all perfect. (They aren't.)

Re: I like the RP2040

#162

Post by peteforde »

olabyne wrote: post #159
peteforde wrote: post #120

I also like the RP2040, but I'd like to explain why I migrated away from it for my current project. First, the drama with PlatformIO really rubbed me the wrong way. I'm taking the side of the developers who are hurt by confusion in tooling. Second, the top of the line ESP32-S3 comes in a module format that can be dropped on a PCB with basically nothing but a few decoupling capacitors. The RP2040 requires careful plac…

what is the drama with platformIO ?

https://github.com/platformio/platform-raspberrypi/pull/36

Re: I like the RP2040

#163

Post by crote »

uncletaco wrote: post #148

RP2040 has single handedly reinvigorated a really niche market: custom controllers. Due to the wonderful work done on gp2040[1] which is open source game pad firmware, people can buy cheap, quality, fightsticks and leverless controllers for a lot cheaper than they can from vendors like Victrix or Razer. Not only that but because its open sourced the hobbyist side of the controller community are building RP2040 pcbs t…

I do wonder how much of that can be accounted directly to the RP2040. Projects like QMK[0] have been using a technically quite similar codebase for making DIY keyboards for quite a while now.

At first glance I'm not really seeing anything in GP2040 which couldn't have been done with any other somewhat-modern MCU. The RP2040 has undoubtedly been the catalyst leading to GP2040's widespread adoption, but it seems the same could've happened with a Pro Micro instead.

[0]: https://github.com/qmk/qmk_firmware

Re: I like the RP2040

#164

Post by AtillaBosma »

I want to shout out the fighting game community with: https://gp2040-ce.info/

It has been using the RP2040 to create cheap and easy to make controllers for fighting games while providing the lowest possible input delay.

The RP2040 does a great job acting as a chip for the base of a gamepad, so it doesn't even have to be for a fighting game controller, but any controller you want to create.

Re: I like the RP2040

#165

Post by SAI_Peregrinus »

peteforde wrote: post #120

I also like the RP2040, but I'd like to explain why I migrated away from it for my current project. First, the drama with PlatformIO really rubbed me the wrong way. I'm taking the side of the developers who are hurt by confusion in tooling. Second, the top of the line ESP32-S3 comes in a module format that can be dropped on a PCB with basically nothing but a few decoupling capacitors. The RP2040 requires careful plac…

I did manual capacitive touch on an ATMega328. Peripheral support is easier and more reliable, but not strictly necessary. You "just" need a GPIO with analog input and a timer.

Re: I like the RP2040

#166

Post by dragontamer »

IshKebab wrote: post #36

TL;DR: he likes it because there's only one version available, whereas most microcontrollers have many more than one variant. This seems like a very weak argument. IMO (just based on the specs; haven't actually used it), the main reason to use this is for the PIO stuff. That's a very niche use case though.

> IMO (just based on the specs; haven't actually used it), the main reason to use this is for the PIO stuff. That's a very niche use case though.

PIO is interesting but I'm not fully convinced they're better than a suite of dedicated timers, especially in the realm of power-efficiency.

The _real_ wtf?!?!? spec here is 264kB of SRAM. At this price point / power-consumption, that's a _LOT_ of SRAM. Any application that needs a ton of SRAM (ex: 300 x 200 pixel 8-bit LCD screen) will find good use in the RP2040.

A lot of the other parts of the RP2040 are quite lackluster. PIO is "interesting" but seem somewhat overhyped to me.

Re: I like the RP2040

#167

Post by crote »

MegaDeKay wrote: post #17

The PIO's really are the star of the RP2040 show, giving it a capability that competing chips like the ESP32 can't match. They are appearing all over the place in the console hacking space for this reason. Lower power consumption in steep modes for battery-backed applications would be a welcome addition in any V2 version though.

The most annoying part about the PIO is that there are only two of them (though with 4 sub-units each), they only have space for 32 instructions, and they don't have an external clock input.

They are great for implementing very basic peripherals, but more than once I've started to implement something more complex just to realize it would be unacceptably slow and run out of space. If they were to beef them up just a little, they could easily replace the more trivial FPGA applications.

Re: I like the RP2040

#168

Post by floxy »

dragontamer wrote: post #137
floxy wrote: post #107

Earlier quoted context omitted.

You would probably be surprised what you can do with a $65 hot plate [0], no-refrigeration-required solder paste[1] and the matching laser-cut solder stencil[2]. [0] -- https://www.amazon.com/Soiiw-Microcomputer-Soldering-Preheat... [1] -- https://www.chipquik.com/store/index.php?cPath=470&osCsid=8t... [2] -- https://www.pololu.com/product/446/

Pololu's stencils leave much to be desired. They do work but I feel like https://www.oshstencils.com/ makes a higher quality stencil instead at similar prices. ----- Note that BGA chips mostly come pre-soldered / solder balls. You also design PCBs so that there is a "well" for the balls to melt into and settle into place, and molten-solder has a significant amount of surface tension, so you can magically watch the so…

Funny, I had the exact opposite experience. For OSH Stencils, they had a scaling issue with their setup that I pointed out to them, and they just shrugged and said that was the nature of the beast essentially and they couldn't do anything about it. They might have said something about Kapton shrinkage or some such. (I don't currently have the exact numbers, but it was off a couple of percent linearly, which doesn't matter for a tiny board, but for a 4" board, the difference adds up, so that if you align the apertures on one end of the board, they don't on the other side of the board. Like the aperture was off by a whole 0603 pad or more). I went back to Pololu for that same board, and everything was spot on. And I have had zero complaints with them since. If I had to complain about something, I might slightly ding them slightly on the super-tiny aperture shapes and the kerf width of their laser. But everything has always worked. Apparently YMMV.

Re: I like the RP2040

#169

Post by dragontamer »

floxy wrote: post #168
dragontamer wrote: post #137

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Pololu's stencils leave much to be desired. They do work but I feel like https://www.oshstencils.com/ makes a higher quality stencil instead at similar prices. ----- Note that BGA chips mostly come pre-soldered / solder balls. You also design PCBs so that there is a "well" for the balls to melt into and settle into place, and molten-solder has a significant amount of surface tension, so you can magically watch the so…

Funny, I had the exact opposite experience. For OSH Stencils, they had a scaling issue with their setup that I pointed out to them, and they just shrugged and said that was the nature of the beast essentially and they couldn't do anything about it. They might have said something about Kapton shrinkage or some such. (I don't currently have the exact numbers, but it was off a couple of percent linearly, which doesn't m…

Hmmm, maybe my designs have been small enough that it hasn't been an issue.

I'll keep your experience in mind then. Thanks for sharing your experience.

Re: I like the RP2040

#170

Post by HyulianGrader »

milesvp wrote: post #160
HyulianGrader wrote: post #83

Earlier quoted context omitted.

It's safe to assume he's talking about the chip in both cases. You can connect either of them to a battery charger, camera, or nuclear reactor but all of those 'peripherals' are completely irrelevant to this comparison.

FYI. In the embedded space, peripherals refer to the chip's built in capabilities. Typically there is a peripheral that handles SPI, a peripheral that handles I2C, a peripheral that handles USART. There might be a peripheral that handles USB, or I2S, or any number of different abilities. It's either transistors or microcode on more sophisticated MCUs that allows these peripherals, and not every pin is connected to ev…

FYI the RP2040 has peripherals too, a lot of the same ones.

It's very clear that GP has an odd misconception that an ESP32 is some kind of development board complete with "connectors" and possibly a battery charger, while an RP2040 is just the SoC itself.

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