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I now lack the juice to fuel the bluster to conceal that I am a simpleton

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Re: I now lack the juice to fuel the bluster to conceal that I am a simpleton

#161

Post by lanternfish »

Cthulhu_ wrote: post #124
Dudhbbh3343 wrote: post #86

Earlier quoted context omitted.

You and your link make reasonable arguments for capitalizing black, but I don't see any justification (other than to be contrary to supremacist groups) for not doing the same for white, which leaves it inconsistent with the naming of all other racial/ethnic groups.

It's a complicated matter and I'm not the right person to make any statements about it, but on the one side, we have white sub-groups like Irish or Italian. On the other, grouping all Black sub-groups under one moniker seems overly abstract as well. That said, it works for the debate of racism etc in the US, which affects people of color, not so much the various white groups.

It's also due to the unique conditions under which the Black identity was formed - that is forced colocation, separation from history, and systemic coidentification. Anyone who traces their history back to slavery, which many Black Americans can, basically has to stop there creating one pretty large "sub-group".

There's a case to be made - and some theorists do - that black and Black are different identities in America, the second directly corresponding to that shared loss of history.

Re: I now lack the juice to fuel the bluster to conceal that I am a simpleton

#162

Post by blackmesaind »

gadders wrote: post #158
blackmesaind wrote: post #153

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Despite Powell's almost cringe worthy rage against "liberal racism", at least his responses had force of personality behind them. The interviewer's questions show a distinct lack of awareness. An interview only works if you're setting the stage for the interviewee, not for yourself.

>>An interview only works if you're setting the stage for the interviewee, not for yourself. Yeah, unless the interviewer is a big name in their own right (so not in this case), your aim is to let the subject shine and fade into the background. The quality of your questions is only judged by what answers they elicit.

Unless it's investigative in nature, even the best interviewers still don't take the spotlight.

Larry King, on his interview technique, said "The key of interviewing is listening. I hate interviewers who come with a long list of prepared questions, because they're going to depend on going from the fourth question to the fifth question without listening to the answer"

Though I can't say I blame the interviewer. If I spent that much time flipping through a thesaurus crafting my questions, I wouldn't want to divert from them either.

Re: I now lack the juice to fuel the bluster to conceal that I am a simpleton

#163

Post by s1artibartfast »

blackmesaind wrote: post #153
gadders wrote: post #121

Earlier quoted context omitted.

I think they're both trying to show how smart they are - the interviewer in a big-brain intellectual fashion, and the author in an arch way to show what a rebel he is.

Despite Powell's almost cringe worthy rage against "liberal racism", at least his responses had force of personality behind them. The interviewer's questions show a distinct lack of awareness. An interview only works if you're setting the stage for the interviewee, not for yourself.

I think the questions were scripted and intentionally specific. What do you think they were unaware of? It seems like the interviewer had a deep understanding of the works. Nothing wrong with asking a deep and detailed question,to which Powell can engage or glide past.

As an aside, I think a huge number of people think the liberal racism bit is spot on. As translated elsewhere in this thread, "erasing representation to avoid the discomfort of confronting racism" is a real phenomenon.

Re: I now lack the juice to fuel the bluster to conceal that I am a simpleton

#164

Post by gadders »

blackmesaind wrote: post #162
gadders wrote: post #158

Earlier quoted context omitted.

>>An interview only works if you're setting the stage for the interviewee, not for yourself. Yeah, unless the interviewer is a big name in their own right (so not in this case), your aim is to let the subject shine and fade into the background. The quality of your questions is only judged by what answers they elicit.

Unless it's investigative in nature, even the best interviewers still don't take the spotlight. Larry King, on his interview technique, said "The key of interviewing is listening. I hate interviewers who come with a long list of prepared questions, because they're going to depend on going from the fourth question to the fifth question without listening to the answer" Though I can't say I blame the interviewer. If I s…

Yeah, but I assumed that the interview was done via email. I could be wrong.

Re: I now lack the juice to fuel the bluster to conceal that I am a simpleton

#165

Post by s1artibartfast »

someuser2345 wrote: post #146
boplicity wrote: post #79

Earlier quoted context omitted.

It may be bizarre for you, but it is often a reasoned and thoughtful use of the word, meaningful in the context of a complex and consistent consideration of the general meaning and usage of words. I encourage you to consider and understand the perspectives of those who do capitalize the word. This serves as an introduction to some people's thinking: https://www.cjr.org/analysis/capital-b-black-styleguide.php Note, th…

It seems to me that this practice is just another example of putting white people on a pedestal. If all other racial groups have "a shared sense of identity and community", then it implies that being white is the default; that the world is split into white and not-white.

Independent of the stated rationale, I think the primary function is as an ideological test and signal:

Does one hold that all the diverse peoples of Africa can be considered with a shared group identity, which deserves acknowledgement and respect, and do you simultaneously hold that white people of Europe can be grouped together, but that grouping is undeserving of the same validity and respect.

If someone is willing to engage in this Act of cognitive dissonance, they can be considered part of the political in-group or at least sufficiently compliant to be trusted.

It is absolutely an example of the liberal racism that Powell is talking about and straight out of 1984.

Re: I now lack the juice to fuel the bluster to conceal that I am a simpleton

#166

Post by s1artibartfast »

ThrowawayIP wrote: post #155
someuser2345 wrote: post #146

Earlier quoted context omitted.

It seems to me that this practice is just another example of putting white people on a pedestal. If all other racial groups have "a shared sense of identity and community", then it implies that being white is the default; that the world is split into white and not-white.

You should read the CJR link. The "shared sense of identity and community" is being descendants of the victims of the slave trade and not the color of their skin.

Can you explain how that works for each other grouping that is capitalized, but is not also true for white people?

Re: I now lack the juice to fuel the bluster to conceal that I am a simpleton

#167

Post by stronglikedan »

ThrowawayIP wrote: post #155
someuser2345 wrote: post #146

Earlier quoted context omitted.

It seems to me that this practice is just another example of putting white people on a pedestal. If all other racial groups have "a shared sense of identity and community", then it implies that being white is the default; that the world is split into white and not-white.

You should read the CJR link. The "shared sense of identity and community" is being descendants of the victims of the slave trade and not the color of their skin.

> descendants of the victims of the slave trade

The Irish were white.

Re: I now lack the juice to fuel the bluster to conceal that I am a simpleton

#168

Post by prewett »

I took me some reflection and some education from the comments here to see this, but it seems like Powell had the same pique to the interviewer's questions as he did to his colleague's. So he answers the questions, but at the same time he critiques the interviewer:

- "I now lack the juice to fuel the bluster to conceal that I am a simpleton," suggesting that the interviewer still has said juice. This also allows some subtle critiques like "I'm ignorant of 'malapert'", which on the surface is a sort of back-handed compliment to the questioner on their ability to coin a phrase like "malapert urbanity" that a "simpleton" like they are interviewing does not understand. But it also suggests that if the "legend" they are interviewing does not know the word, perhaps this is excessive juice.

- "It emerges with no consideration for anything but the next correct word." Questioner, stop overthinking things.

- Then when the interviewer asks Powell to agree with his assertion-as-a-question that there is no wrong way to read a book, Powell responds with a story about how he wants to focus on making writing better but people like the interviewer that say there are no wrong ways to read a book are actually teaching that there are wrong ways to say things. Furthermore, people like the interviewer eviscerated a recent book in the style that people like the interviewer celebrated, on the grounds of racism, despite the fact that the content of his books is from actual black people who said those things. So the implied answer the question is that no, a book does not get unmoored from its time period, because he cannot actually publish those books today, and that there may or may not be a wrong way to read a book, but there certainly is a wrong way to write one, namely his (celebrated) way.

But then it all goes completely over the interviewer's head (no doubt as expected). I wasn't impressed with Powell on the first read, but wow, that is some finesse!

Re: I now lack the juice to fuel the bluster to conceal that I am a simpleton

#169

Post by rpmisms »

lanternfish wrote: post #159
rpmisms wrote: post #105

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Black isn't an ethnic group either. There are black people from Africa, Pacific islands, Australia, South America, and India. It's a descriptor, not an immutable category that defines you, and it's uniquely used here in America.

In America, captital-B Black is usually used to refer to people who were forcefully disconnected from their ancestry by the imposition of slavery. In many theoretical frameworks, it is an entirely new ethnic group by virtue of their original ethnicity being severed and the forced co-reculturalization through slavery and the subsequent (and continuing) power structures that forcefully and implicitly group them togethe…

Except that it also contains recent Ugandan immigrants who moved here by choice and work as surgeons. Just like white, it's a big umbrella and rough category.

Re: I now lack the juice to fuel the bluster to conceal that I am a simpleton

#170

Post by basil-rash »

Amezarak wrote: post #154
basil-rash wrote: post #148

Earlier quoted context omitted.

"which berthed them" makes perfect sense, and fits just as well as any other past participle would in that context. Just because a usage of a word is rare does not mean an experienced author cannot choose to invoke it. In fact, the opposite. Again though, I think the author knew damn well what they were doing and intended for it to be a pun (which would still be arguably berthed-forward ).

To be clear, the usage you're describing is so rare as to be practically nonexistent. You would never use it this way if you were familiar with the word and its usage, only if you knew the word from dictionaries. Look at the rarity even for saying something like "the crew berthed the ship." You just don't say it like that. Yes, someone "could" do it and we'd understand what they meant. But there's no reason to believ…

I really don't care to discuss this further, but all your points are addressed somewhere in this thread: https://news.ycombinator.com/item?id=40150716

Good day.

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