Live data from Hacker News

What happens when an astronaut in orbit says he's not coming back?

arstechnica.com

161–170 of 230 posts

Re: What happens when an astronaut in orbit says he's not coming back?

#161

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Journalism is a branch of literature. Some articles may be very short and straight-to-the-point, others longer to explain the context, with sometimes some subjectivity - see for instance "gonzo journalism". Here, the author explains that while we broadly know what happens, there is no precise-written record about it. And the incident had long-lasting consequences. I enjoyed the article very much personally.

> the author explains that while we broadly know what happens, there is no precise-written record about it The author implies that, but doesn’t say it outright. I for one can’t believe NASA doesn’t have reports and communications and debriefs saved in triplicate. Did they even try to FOIA for infomation, or just phoned around failed to get callbacks and shrugged?

>I for one can’t believe NASA doesn’t have reports and communications and debriefs saved in triplicate.

You know we are missing a significant amount of moon footage right? NASA doesn't archive 100% of everything because it barely has the budget to do it's actual mission.

Re: What happens when an astronaut in orbit says he's not coming back?

#162

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Nowadays there is so much fluff added (as an "SEO hack" to increase reading time) to what could be otherwise short posts, that long-form was bound to suffer by association. Of course, some never liked long form. I prefer it, but not it's SEO'd brethren

The worst is when they make a large eye-catching quote that is just text from two paragraphs down. I hate spoilers.

For bonus points, they combine that with a screenshot of the Tweet they're quoting, so that you read the same quote three times.

Re: What happens when an astronaut in orbit says he's not coming back?

#163
post #140

Earlier quoted context omitted.

"Studies of 19th-century news stories in American newspapers, however, suggest that the form spread several decades later than the telegraph, possibly because the reform era's social and educational forces encouraged factual reporting rather than more interpretive narrative styles.[2]"

>encouraged factual reporting rather than more interpretive narrative styles The 19th century literally coined the term Yellow Journalism! What kind of dumb revisionism is this? A narrative being conveyed in only a couple bullet points instead of a story is not "factual reporting", it's soundbite optimized reporting.

Nothing in this thread requires "narratives being conveyed in only a couple bullet points" and that also isn't what the inverse pyramid is about. The inverse pyramid is about the ordering of information, not the level of detail or quantity.

Re: What happens when an astronaut in orbit says he's not coming back?

#164

Earlier quoted context omitted.

The personal biography of Wang, for starters. I do not give a shit when he was born or where he went to school. I'm only mildly interested in what he worked on. The issue is the headline. It posits a question, then jerks you around until you've spent long enough on the page to satisfy some engagement metric. It's writing for television, where any yes/no question always happens to take exactly 30 minutes (and multiple…

> The personal biography of Wang, for starters. I do not give a shit when he was born or where he went to school. I'm only mildly interested in what he worked on. It is highly relevant to the story. I was asking myself "So why was he even on this space mission?" You may not have had this question, but the main reason Wang gives for his state of mind around the incident is directly linked to his biography. He immigrat…

None of that is relevant to what I want to get out of an article titled "What happens when an astronaut in orbit says he’s not coming back?" If I wanted a bunch of random facts or life stories I'd use the random option on Wikipedia.

Re: What happens when an astronaut in orbit says he's not coming back?

#165
post #71

> On the second day of the mission, Wang floated over to his experiment and sought to activate the Drop Dynamics Module. But it didn't work. He asked the NASA flight controllers on the ground if he could take some time to try to troubleshoot the problem and maybe fix the experiment. But on any Shuttle mission, time is precious. Every crew member has a detailed timeline, with a long list of tasks during waking hours.…

> The only justification for human spaceflight at all is that humans can fix things that a robot can't yet.

What is the point of space exploration if humans can't go? A robot can say a lot about radiation, wind speed, soil composition, and so on, but it can't tell you how it feels to look down into the Great Red Spot and picture a dozen Earths inside it. Or the sound regolith makes when you walk on the Moon. There are things we can measure, but a lot of the things that make life worth living are the ones we can only experience.

> Sounds like the whole approach to the misison profile was flawed

That was not the only experiment on board. If one experiment doesn't work, it makes sense to drop it and continue working on other experiments. If you can make the time to work on the flaw and fix it, great, but you need to keep priorities straight.

> Meanwhile the robots just quietly go about their work collecting almost all the data we have from space and celestial bodies.

They spend a lot more time in space than humans can, at least for now. They also fail for silly things a human could easily repair (example that comes to mind is Galileo's high-gain antenna that failed to open, reducing the amount of data that could be transmitted back to Earth).

Re: What happens when an astronaut in orbit says he's not coming back?

#166

Earlier quoted context omitted.

> If you hate the format of these kinds of article You mean long-form articles? https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Long-form_journalism I don't think the problem is with the format, but with your expectations. Somehow you were expecting a straight answer to the question in the title; instead, it's a detailed look into the incident and the context around it.

No, this is not simply "long-form", this is "in medias res" where the story starts at a heightened moment of tension, then abruptly stops and rewinds to go back to fill in details of how they got to this exciting moment. https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/In_medias_res Sometimes it's done to great effect, like in Fight Club (film starts with him at the climax with a gun in his mouth, then rewinds and tells the story). How…

>"I see this a lot on Youtube. The Youtuber will start with a compelling question and story, like "There he was... tied to the wall as he watched the firing squad load their weapons with gun powder.... But before we continue our story, what is gun powder? Well, it's composed of potassium nitrate, blah, blah, blah...."

It gets even worse. Looking for answer to particular question and hits the video that claims to have it. Let's say concise answer is 5 words. The video is 30 minutes long with those 5 words spaced evenly throughout.

Re: What happens when an astronaut in orbit says he's not coming back?

#167
post #110

NASA seems to have a long standing tradition of sweeping problems under the rug. No skylab mutiny, no depressed payload specialists, all fine here gentleman, nothing to see here. I always wondered why this is written that way. To protect the organisation? But the human part of us all is part of that organization, to disacknowledge that is literally inhumane. Because they are funded by taxpayer dollars and should scre…

> So why is it not okay to write about this? Is this a remnant of the "epic hero" with a rocket from the early scifi days? I would argue that it's by NASA design, to produce better outcomes in spaceflight by lessening useless pressure on astronauts. Premise: Human incidents happen Premise: Press is personally bad for the individuals involved Consequently, if astronauts know they're going to be thrown under the bus in…

> So, in order to create an environment in which astronauts can be fully transparent, NASA protects them from negative media coverage.

I think this theory is plausible.

There's a different but related idea in aviation safety, to encourage reporting of safety observations, in which the reporter is protected from some kinds of retaliation.

For example, a cabin crew member on an airline, who uses a particular FAA process to report a safety issue they noticed, generally can't punished by the airline for that. (Even if a hypothetical reckless business person would really prefer that the FAA didn't learn of the problem.)

This is paired with FAA taking each report seriously.

Re: What happens when an astronaut in orbit says he's not coming back?

#168
post #134

Earlier quoted context omitted.

> The only justification for human spaceflight at all is that humans can fix things that a robot can't yet. That is a justification, but surely not the only one. For example, humans will eventually want to colonize the moon and other planets.

I'm interested in science so am only interested in robots which are demonstrably far more appropriate for the work: the evidence is pretty clear from Voyager to Webb to Ingenuity and so on. If we want to colonize far away planets, much less other solar systems and ultimately galaxies, why send a human when a robot is far more appropriate to the problem? Most of the science humans do in orbit is about keeping humans a…

[deleted]

Re: What happens when an astronaut in orbit says he's not coming back?

#169

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Do you think important information was withhold here? Which information was not important? It was a investigative article, about an incident that happened long ago, with most participants already dead by today. If something is worth a long article - then this is.

The personal biography of Wang, for starters. I do not give a shit when he was born or where he went to school. I'm only mildly interested in what he worked on. The issue is the headline. It posits a question, then jerks you around until you've spent long enough on the page to satisfy some engagement metric. It's writing for television, where any yes/no question always happens to take exactly 30 minutes (and multiple…

"The issue is the headline. It posits a question, then jerks you around until you've spent long enough on the page to satisfy some engagement metric."

But there was and is just no definite answer, except for drama. I found every bit interesting and relevant to be able to picture the situation.

"The title "The First Man to Refuse to Return from Space" would be more appropriate for an investigative article. "

And no, because it was way more severe than this: he said he won't come home and he said figurativly "oh, I can just open this airlock and then we all would die?" (where "unless you give in to my demands" was maybe intentionally implied - maybe not, he was not mentally stable)

So an actual clickbaity sounding headline, that would have actually be quite close to the truth, would be:

"First man in space, who threatened to kill everyone on board"

But Ars did not do this. Partly because they are not (so much) into the clickbait game, but partly because the facts are (intentionally by NASA) not that clear here. And the Author tried to gather as much facts as he could. So giving us, where he was born and went to school was no real answer to the title question - but it helped me getting a picture of the person in question, which is still alive, but who refused to comment. Because people have reasons for why they act like they do:

"When I turned on my own instrument, it didn't work," Wang said. "You can imagine my panic. I had spent five years preparing for this one experiment. Not only that, I was the first person of Chinese descent to fly on the Shuttle, and the Chinese community had taken a great deal of interest. You have to understand the Asian culture. You don't just represent yourself; you represent your family. The first thing you learn as a kid is to bring no shame to the family. So when I realized that my experiment had failed, I could imagine my father telling me, 'What's the matter with you? Can't you even do an experiment right?' I was really in a very desperate situation"

Re: What happens when an astronaut in orbit says he's not coming back?

#170
post #105
post #38

Earlier quoted context omitted.

It's a pro and con. What happens in the event the commander in incapacitated and the crews needs to open the hatch? They probably aren't ever going to do that in space, but I'm sure there are scenarios that might require it? Maybe fire? Centralizing control also centralizes a failure point. Sometimes that's a good thing, sometimes not. I thought the discussion of undertrained / -bonded payload specialists was a good…

> I'm sure there are scenarios that might require it? Maybe fire? Not in orbit. In orbit there is no scenario where you want to open that hatch. And the lock was only installed in orbit.

Uncontrolled fire inside the shuttle?

I'm not sure if there are enough suits / sealable spaces to make that a viable scenario.

Post reply on HN