Live data from Hacker News

"That's Why You Don't Have Any Friends."

joethepeacock.blogspot.co.uk

161–170 of 206 posts

Re: "That's Why You Don't Have Any Friends."

#161

I'm about as asocial and celebratory of diversity as they come, and I love this essay, especially the conversational style. But I'd be careful not to take this argument too far into sophistry. In school people clan and desperately look for some identity to copy. This leads to all the terrible social behavior you see in most secondary and high school in the U.S. Somebody calling you "weird" can really be a badge of ho…

Why does every post on here need someone coming in explaining how it's wrong in some way. It's not only disingenuous, but outright wrong to assume the author was saying "be weird for the sake of being weird." He's saying he is weird, and that's OK, just he won't see a lot of good in it in high school. You're acting like he's advocating becoming a hipster, a straw man you invented.

I barely look at comments now because it's too often about little flaws and rarely about the main idea.

You don't learn by arguing, it's pointless. Someone cannot be told the truth, he has to learn it by himself.

"I can only show you the door, you have to walk through it.", Morpheus.

I'd like to see comments about how to improve the idea and making even better, but I haven't found a single comment that does this yet..

The only valuable comments I found were links to other documents or a joke once.

Re: "That's Why You Don't Have Any Friends."

#162
post #138
post #54

Earlier quoted context omitted.

The by far most important thing you learn in school is being social. That dwarfs everything else. Yes, being bullied sucks but keep in mind that your kids will have to meet other kids as well, and if they are homeschooled they are going to appear weird just because they don't go to school and thus don't behave the same in crowds as everyone else does (trust me, this gets noticed instantly). That alone is basis enough…

What? No. Absolutely not. Being bullied is not because you behave wrongly. You're being bullied because they others are assholes. In the adult realm, there are still people behaving differently. And they're not getting bullied. You know why not? Because there is a state that punishes bullying among adults . We need only one thing: punish bullying among non-adults. Currently they get a free pass. And every generation…

Of course. What I meant was that homeschooling in order to try and avoid bullying might just as well backfire. Didn't mean that it was somehow justified but bullying among kids isn't easy to combat.

Re: "That's Why You Don't Have Any Friends."

#163
My takeaway from this post is that, " You can really make a difference in someones life if you take a moment to empathize with their situation, and share a word or two of support."

I bet that kid will remember this speech for the rest of his life. I know, cuz I have my share of good and not-so-good memories from as young as a little boy to as recent as yesterday about how far a nice sympathetic and understanding word or two can go, and how damaging a cruel and dismissive comment can be.

We should all take a lesson from this. We are all human beings, and we all have commonalities we can empathize with and relate to in some capacity. It's all about perspective, and guess what... Perspective is all we have!

Use it at your discretion.

But remember, when that awkward weird boy changes the world one day, and looks back and says, "I was once in a gym hanging out with some older blokes, and one fellow gave me the confidence to be myself.I owe it all to him."

Re: "That's Why You Don't Have Any Friends."

#164
I went through a similar phase during my high school years where I felt like I was weird and an outsider. When I was about to graduate, I found a gym, started working out and it changed my life. I feel happy for the kid in this story because he was at the gym, interacting with mature adults, and learning the discipline of weight training - great way to build a good foundation for his future.

Re: "That's Why You Don't Have Any Friends."

#166

I like the article, a lot. But I have some reserve with the advice given. In my experience, many people would actually be glad to hangout with someone weird if he gives them some time to get used to it, and take it easy on the weirdness at first. I consider myself weird (my weirdness is that I mostly don't give a shit about conventional thinking and politically correct things. I just love a good argument, to the poin…

>I just love a good argument, to the point where I would provoke people I barely know into arguments about politics, religion, whatever. This right here is the problem with "embrace your weirdness!" posts. You're not being weird or unique, you're just ignoring social cues and deliberately making people uncomfortable. If your weirdness is that you're super into physics or anime or whatever then that's great, but if yo…

Agree. If you've ever seen Curb your Enthusiasm Larry David demonstrates this perfectly. He just always pushes it too far. Being weird is actually totally acceptable if you are confident and respond to basic social cues.

Re: "That's Why You Don't Have Any Friends."

#167

I'm about as asocial and celebratory of diversity as they come, and I love this essay, especially the conversational style. But I'd be careful not to take this argument too far into sophistry. In school people clan and desperately look for some identity to copy. This leads to all the terrible social behavior you see in most secondary and high school in the U.S. Somebody calling you "weird" can really be a badge of ho…

[deleted]

Re: "That's Why You Don't Have Any Friends."

#168
post #118

I'm about as asocial and celebratory of diversity as they come, and I love this essay, especially the conversational style. But I'd be careful not to take this argument too far into sophistry. In school people clan and desperately look for some identity to copy. This leads to all the terrible social behavior you see in most secondary and high school in the U.S. Somebody calling you "weird" can really be a badge of ho…

In school people clan and desperately look for some identity to copy. This struck me. The most intelligent and self-aware of my friends seem to have consciously chosen some person or character to copy in high school or middle school. Perhaps this is a clever way to satisfy the urge while still being self-defined. I emulated the classic mad scientist archetype, for example, and it'd led me to reasonable success. I als…

very good insight. I too have noticed that intelligent people often consciously chose a character or archetype to adopt.

Re: "That's Why You Don't Have Any Friends."

#169

I'm about as asocial and celebratory of diversity as they come, and I love this essay, especially the conversational style. But I'd be careful not to take this argument too far into sophistry. In school people clan and desperately look for some identity to copy. This leads to all the terrible social behavior you see in most secondary and high school in the U.S. Somebody calling you "weird" can really be a badge of ho…

"Being weird? Awesome. Being deliberately different? Not so much." I realize I'm straying further afield of the original article in saying this, but we should keep in mind that being "weird" (or even being "different") isn't always a choice, or at least not a conscious one. I'm not sure if I'd go so far as to suggest that most "different" people have no agency in the matter. But a lot of them don't. Being different i…

Before I say anything else, I'd like to say that Whit Stillman's new movie Damsels in Distress is a wonderful movie with an affectionate but nuanced take on weirdness. Check it out.

By self-analyzing the weirdness, you can break it down into its components and decide which elements are useful, which are harmful, which are productive, which are counterproductive. "Weird" or "different" can be reduced to more elementary traits, rather than seen as broad, blanket terms.

This is wonderfully expressed. I wish somebody with that perspective had been around to help me when I was a kid. I spent a lot of time trying to figure out whether the things I liked about myself and the things I hated about myself were two sides of the same coin. Everyone else assumed they were -- some people (like my parents) assuming my social difficulties were good and nothing to worry about, because a kid as smart and well-read as me couldn't help having social difficulties with normal kids my age, and some people assuming (and saying out loud, behind my back) that I was only smart because there was something wrong with me. All the adults (and other kids) who liked me or cared about me at all were of the opinion that I had no real problems, that I was just fine. So... then I could basically just drop my difficulties start enjoying an awesome and unconstrained life anytime I wanted to? I only tried that a thousand times; maybe the thousand and first would have been the charm. The only people who acknowledged I had problems were people who disliked me and wanted to drag me down. That was the worst part; the only people who saw the problems I was struggling with were the people who wanted to use them against me. I appreciate your advocacy of a nuanced analysis and hope that attitude becomes more widely accepted.

we should keep in mind that being "weird" (or even being "different") isn't always a choice, or at least not a conscious one

Not having a choice about it is a big deal. I liked being weird sometimes and certainly embraced it, sometimes perversely, but I always wished I could turn it on and off so I could take part in some of the normal social relations that other people enjoyed. (I was never an introvert. Just alone.) But you can't turn it on and off. Being weird means no practice at socializing, no confidence, and becoming accustomed to people reacting negatively to you -- an expectation that eventually handicaps your relationships with everyone you meet, even people you should be able to get along with. You can't act normal with someone even by your own standards until you get over the hump of anxiety and negative expectations that have become your default mode for relating to people.

Even if you meet someone who might be a good friend or girlfriend, you have no idea how to relate to somebody who doesn't think you're weird. By the time you've figured it out, the moment has passed. That happens a bunch of times before you've kind of figured out, through imagination and through study of other people's behavior, how to act with someone when you expect the encounter to be mutually pleasant. And later you realize it isn't a bad idea to act that way with most of the people you meet.

It becomes easier and easier, but now that I'm in my thirties and still have to make a little bit of an effort at the best of times, and I can regress ten years under the influence of stress, fatigue, or unfamiliar scenarios, I tend to forget there was ever a time when I enjoyed being weird and enjoyed being able to follow my own path on everything. Now I just take it for granted, and I catch myself assuming that everyone was always as free as I was. But I did benefit from embracing my weirdness.

Re: "That's Why You Don't Have Any Friends."

#170
post #92
post #17

Earlier quoted context omitted.

While I understand your point of view based on this one observation, I think this is a terrible idea if you look at the big picture. Whether they get bullied or not, high school is an extremely important time for kids to gain social skills and learn how to deal with people. Dealing with people is one of the most important skills you can have, period. And that often means dealing with people that are being dicks, and…

The thing is: school is nothing like the real world. It teaches you how to deal with school. School is a very weird, twisted little society where none of the work has any real point, there's no source of purpose other than pure social approval, and everybody is either the same age or an authority figure. The strategies you use for dealing with difficult people in the real world are completely different from what you…

Just because high school is unpleasant for some and it will get better for them afterwards, does not mean none of the work has any real point, or that you learn nothing.
Post reply on HN