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First planned small nuclear reactor plant in the US has been canceled

arstechnica.com

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Re: First planned small nuclear reactor plant in the US has been canceled

#161

Post by kragen »

Retric wrote: post #105
kragen wrote: post #99

Earlier quoted context omitted.

i just noticed that you're linking a page about panel prices two problems one, pv modules are typically about a third of the cost of a utility-scale solar farm; things like installation labor and power electronics are also part of the cost. so roughly we should expect solar projects to cost about 80 cents per peak watt based on that number two, that page ends in 02021, but pv module prices have fallen by about a thir…

German solar policies are insane. Nation wide capacity factor was 11.6% in 2018. The numbers are so low because they keep building solar in the northern parts of the country which are absolutely terrible for solar. Brandenburg has a stupidly large amount of solar compared to a terrible amount of sunlight. https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Solar_power_in_Germany#/media/... Meanwhile the best location in Germany the south…

i've often wondered why germany's pv capacity factor is so terrible, thanks

prc's pv capacity factor is also around 10% last i checked, which is also absurdly low and suggests that they maybe aren't as capitalist as they seem in important respects (i'd be interested in updates)

by 'may' do you mean 'many'

it was easier to justify solar tracking (and concentrating solar, and nuclear) fifteen years ago when solar panels are expensive. but now you have to trade off twenty dollars in mechanical parts for tracking against 180 more peak watts of solar panels. with maintenance costs it's easy for the balance to come out in favor of a simpler system without tracking

Re: First planned small nuclear reactor plant in the US has been canceled

#162

Post by kragen »

monero-xmr wrote: post #100
kragen wrote: post #90

Earlier quoted context omitted.

you're confusing the northeast of brazil, which is what cesar was talking about, with the northeast of the usa these are not just in different countries but in vastly different climates in different hemispheres the exact page you linked in your comment literally answers your question: 'due to problems with supply chains, higher interest rates and a failure to obtain the amount of tax credits the company wanted. ... H…

It’s strange because wind is supposedly overwhelmingly cheaper and better, yet even with tons of government subsidies and political will behind it, it still can’t be built. Wouldn’t something truly more cost effective be easy to build because it’s cheaper? Clearly something doesn’t add up.

obviously enough, numerous projects that are profitable when you can finance them at 1% become unprofitable when you have to finance them at 6%, particularly when you're competing with incumbent assets financed at 1%

https://fred.stlouisfed.org/series/FEDFUNDS

feb 02022, 0.08% interest. since august, 5.33%

nothing is easy to build in the usa; it's halfway to being zimbabwe

Re: First planned small nuclear reactor plant in the US has been canceled

#164

Post by anvil-on-my-toe »

pradn wrote: post #131

It looks like the biggest problem with nuclear is not the safety or whatnot, it's just that as a civilization, we just can't build them without cost overruns and massive delays. And this is a loss, because we need non-variable energy sources to augment wind/solar/tidal. Perhaps the other way to solve the energy transition is to lean heavily into mass storage of variable energy sources. If you have enough energy stora…

I wonder why the Navy or Core of Engineers can't make civilian nuclear systems. It arguably would have made us safer as a country to have energy independence by investing dollars in reactors for domestic use instead of for warheads and nuclear submarines.

Re: First planned small nuclear reactor plant in the US has been canceled

#165

Post by ViewTrick1002 »

anvil-on-my-toe wrote: post #164
pradn wrote: post #131

It looks like the biggest problem with nuclear is not the safety or whatnot, it's just that as a civilization, we just can't build them without cost overruns and massive delays. And this is a loss, because we need non-variable energy sources to augment wind/solar/tidal. Perhaps the other way to solve the energy transition is to lean heavily into mass storage of variable energy sources. If you have enough energy stora…

I wonder why the Navy or Core of Engineers can't make civilian nuclear systems. It arguably would have made us safer as a country to have energy independence by investing dollars in reactors for domestic use instead of for warheads and nuclear submarines.

Because their customer, the US navy, is the world's least price sensitive customer. That does not translate into competitive products on cutthroat markets.

Re: First planned small nuclear reactor plant in the US has been canceled

#166

Post by codersfocus »

bitter_old_man_ wrote: post #123

I'm so glad I left the nuclear industry thirteen years ago! I worked in nuclear power for about eight years. I felt like I was taking crazy pills. There's a strong vein of cognitive dissonance running through the industry relating to its economic viability. Nuclear power has always been the most expensive available energy production method. So every time I hear talking heads say "nuclear power is the only power produ…

Why do areas with nuclear power around the world have cheaper than average electricity costs, then?

Re: First planned small nuclear reactor plant in the US has been canceled

#167

Post by Retric »

kragen wrote: post #161
Retric wrote: post #105

Earlier quoted context omitted.

German solar policies are insane. Nation wide capacity factor was 11.6% in 2018. The numbers are so low because they keep building solar in the northern parts of the country which are absolutely terrible for solar. Brandenburg has a stupidly large amount of solar compared to a terrible amount of sunlight. https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Solar_power_in_Germany#/media/... Meanwhile the best location in Germany the south…

i've often wondered why germany's pv capacity factor is so terrible, thanks prc's pv capacity factor is also around 10% last i checked, which is also absurdly low and suggests that they maybe aren't as capitalist as they seem in important respects (i'd be interested in updates) by 'may' do you mean 'many' it was easier to justify solar tracking (and concentrating solar, and nuclear) fifteen years ago when solar panel…

Grid scale tracking systems keep getting cheaper but neither always wins.

Solar tracking makes more sense when you look at wholesale rates over a day. Peak demand prices start right as static solar production falls off so you would need batteries not just more solar panels to sell at those rates. On top of this costs like land, inverters, and wiring gets amaorterised across more hours of production.

Wholesale prices get influenced by the deployed solar power including rooftop solar. Which adds yet another dimension to these models.

Re: First planned small nuclear reactor plant in the US has been canceled

#168

Post by [deleted] »

theultdev wrote: post #120
vinay427 wrote: post #117

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Not the parent commenter, but I read their comment perhaps more charitably as describing a general societal attitude rather than their personal beliefs that they would instill on their children. No idea if I’m correct, but it’s maybe worth offering them the benefit of the doubt here.

The general societal attitude is what influences their personal belief, and vice versa at scale. But their point remains the same, "let someone else do it" (the quiet part: "it's below us"). It's a very negative and elitist attitude that's prevalent in bubbles where people don't have to work normal jobs.

[deleted]

Re: First planned small nuclear reactor plant in the US has been canceled

#169

Post by ViewTrick1002 »

codersfocus wrote: post #166
bitter_old_man_ wrote: post #123

I'm so glad I left the nuclear industry thirteen years ago! I worked in nuclear power for about eight years. I felt like I was taking crazy pills. There's a strong vein of cognitive dissonance running through the industry relating to its economic viability. Nuclear power has always been the most expensive available energy production method. So every time I hear talking heads say "nuclear power is the only power produ…

Why do areas with nuclear power around the world have cheaper than average electricity costs, then?

Because they were built using subsidies. Nuclear has a competitive OPEX cost when the plant has been paid off.

We are 50 years from that point for any potential new builds.

Re: First planned small nuclear reactor plant in the US has been canceled

#170

Post by treypitt »

pradn wrote: post #131

It looks like the biggest problem with nuclear is not the safety or whatnot, it's just that as a civilization, we just can't build them without cost overruns and massive delays. And this is a loss, because we need non-variable energy sources to augment wind/solar/tidal. Perhaps the other way to solve the energy transition is to lean heavily into mass storage of variable energy sources. If you have enough energy stora…

that's just America, and its not just nuclear, it's civil engineering & construction projects of all kind that have ballooned in complexity and cost due to myriad political and regulatory causes. France can build reactors cheaply and easily due to standardized reactor designs; I'm not sure the US has ever replicated a reactor build (ie, every reactor is built in a different & unique way)
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