YouTube's Ad Blocker Crackdown Spurs Record Uninstalls • Hacker News Board

Re: YouTube's Ad Blocker Crackdown Spurs Record Uninstalls

#161

Post by spystath » Fri, Nov 03, 2023, 5:02 PM UTC

jauntywundrkind wrote: post #155

beej71 wrote: post #91

Earlier quoted context omitted.

> YouTube is imo one of the best sites on the internet. This is true. > I am 100% happy to pay for YouTube. Just remember that you're giving money to the company that backs things like FLoC, Manifest v3, and WEI (recently in the news), things that threaten interoperability on the Internet. It's not friendly. If you pay them, do it with your eyes open.

They also built an incredible browser full of amazing capabilities that I do love. And have an enormous commitment to standards and standards processes, that they have supported & helped tirelessly. https://www.chromium.org/blink/launching-features/

I think that's a relatively simplistic way of viewing this. Although I don't disagree with the core argument, Google will always implement and ship "standards" that fit their business model or their vision of the web. A Chrome API becomes a defacto standard regardless of the state of consensus between engine vendors. Chrome can bulldoze through the standards process because of the massive amount of Chrome installations (and derivatives).

There are standards that have never been fully accepted by Mozilla [0] or WebKit (famously webusb for instance, because of security implications) but they are still in Chrome and now Firefox or Safari are effectively a "worse" browser because they don't support "standard" X that never reached consensus but Chrome implemented anyway. It always starts as an "experimental" feature under a config flag while the supposed discussion is taking place "just to see how it works, promise" before Google decides to remove the experimental flag and ship it. WEI started to play out exactly in the same way but given the massive outrage they decided it was too damaging to keep pursuing it (they still sneakily implemented it in Android WebViews).

So although I don't disagree that, yes Google has certainly improved on some things when it comes to standard processes they have abused their powerful position and continue to do so to push forward whatever they think it benefits them.

[0] https://mozilla.github.io/standards-positions/

Re: YouTube's Ad Blocker Crackdown Spurs Record Uninstalls

#162

Post by stetrain » Fri, Nov 03, 2023, 5:23 PM UTC

zeroCalories wrote: post #154

stetrain wrote: post #140

Earlier quoted context omitted.

I have not said that any of these expansions outside of Youtube are a replacement or alternative for Youtube, especially for content discovery. Nor am I necessarily supporting adblockers, except in sympathizing that Youtube's ad experience has continued to get more annoying. I personally solve this by paying for Premium. My point was only that if you have a core audience of subscribers, who provide value via direct s…

I feel like we're looping now, but here I go: Niche channels suffering contains so many conditionals that it needs to be demonstrated before being considered a serious issue. Most channels would die if they lost YouTube, so it's not a hedge.

But I'm not hypothesizing losing YouTube. I feel like you've imagined an argument that I haven't made."not so beholden to YouTube" does not mean leaving YouTube or replacing or killing it.

From an individual standpoint, you want to try to preserve your ability to access your audience and make money from them. Whether or not other channels live or die or flourish under future Youtube algorithm and monetization changes doesn't matter to you nearly as much.

Re: YouTube's Ad Blocker Crackdown Spurs Record Uninstalls

#163

Post by RajT88 » Fri, Nov 03, 2023, 5:32 PM UTC

hermitdev wrote: post #152

RajT88 wrote: post #62

Earlier quoted context omitted.

I had the same experience. I will say this: at least I have not seen malvertising campagins slip through (that I have seen). That is the biggest and perennially relevant reason to have an adblocker installed.

Malware is the reason I continue to run an ad blocker. The ad purveyors won't accept responsibility for the shit they shovel (and good luck attributing to which ad network something slipped through after the fact), so they don't need to run shit on my computer. I have been bit my ad delivered malware before while at work. Not a pleasant experience, and of course everyone assumes that you _most_ have been doing someth…

Heh. You talk about unpleasant experiences at work. I had a colleague pull me into a side call, because his Chrome browser started randomly popping up porn sites.

Turns out - one of his extensions he had installed had gotten purchased by someone shady, and it started doing crazy shit. Once he removed the extension, it was fine again. But the extension was made by someone reputable, and well-reviewed in the chrome web store. Yes, the maker may have gotten hacked, but it's also apparently common for extension makers to not ask too many questions when someone shows up with a check for 10-20k.

Re: YouTube's Ad Blocker Crackdown Spurs Record Uninstalls

#164

Post by Gud » Fri, Nov 03, 2023, 5:33 PM UTC

thunky wrote: post #148

jszymborski wrote: post #52

Earlier quoted context omitted.

See, I like a lot of content creators on YouTube. I also think that Alphabet has such an immensely negative impact on society. Deeply and thoroughly. I just cannot bring myself to give a red cent. Not by viewing ads, and much less by giving them my credit card.

> I also think that Alphabet has such an immensely negative impact on society. Care to elaborate? Good news is that none of this matters to you since you avoid Google products.

There is no way to avoid "Google products". Google are everywhere via Google Analytics.

Re: YouTube's Ad Blocker Crackdown Spurs Record Uninstalls

#165

Post by paulryanrogers » Fri, Nov 03, 2023, 5:40 PM UTC

charles_f wrote: post #48

paulryanrogers wrote: post #14

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Boycott YouTube in favor of other video services? Pay for YT Premium? Why spend so much energy bypassing compensation for an otherwise free service? It just pushes more ads in front of less sophisticated users or encourages producers to lock all content behind paywalls.

Have you seen YouTube with ads? They slap 2-3 15s ads in a 5m video. It's unwatchable.

Yes, and that has not been my experience. Perhaps the creators you enjoy are more aggressive about monetization?

Re: YouTube's Ad Blocker Crackdown Spurs Record Uninstalls

#166

Post by paulryanrogers » Fri, Nov 03, 2023, 5:40 PM UTC

LispSporks22 wrote: post #132

paulryanrogers wrote: post #14

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Boycott YouTube in favor of other video services? Pay for YT Premium? Why spend so much energy bypassing compensation for an otherwise free service? It just pushes more ads in front of less sophisticated users or encourages producers to lock all content behind paywalls.

I don’t want to be logged in. I don’t want them invading my privacy.

Sounds like a boycott is the only real solution for you.

Re: YouTube's Ad Blocker Crackdown Spurs Record Uninstalls

#167

Post by soraminazuki » Fri, Nov 03, 2023, 5:45 PM UTC

thunky wrote: post #148

jszymborski wrote: post #52

Earlier quoted context omitted.

See, I like a lot of content creators on YouTube. I also think that Alphabet has such an immensely negative impact on society. Deeply and thoroughly. I just cannot bring myself to give a red cent. Not by viewing ads, and much less by giving them my credit card.

> I also think that Alphabet has such an immensely negative impact on society. Care to elaborate? Good news is that none of this matters to you since you avoid Google products.

You seem to have completely forgotten about their sole money-making product: the ads and spyware they inject everywhere across the web. Or is the web officially a Google Product now?

Re: YouTube's Ad Blocker Crackdown Spurs Record Uninstalls

#168

Post by Scoundreller » Fri, Nov 03, 2023, 5:48 PM UTC

Workaccount2 wrote: post #107

beej71 wrote: post #91

Earlier quoted context omitted.

> YouTube is imo one of the best sites on the internet. This is true. > I am 100% happy to pay for YouTube. Just remember that you're giving money to the company that backs things like FLoC, Manifest v3, and WEI (recently in the news), things that threaten interoperability on the Internet. It's not friendly. If you pay them, do it with your eyes open.

Ironically, the reason Google has so much Orwellian power is because people are so much more willing to view ads than pay a subscription. Youtube itself would be a far better product if it was subscription only. It would mean that the users, not the advertisers, are the customer to be catered too.

> Youtube itself would be a far better product if it was subscription only.

Isn’t that what a lot of big names kinda move to? “Get more videos by signing up on patrebula”

Re: YouTube's Ad Blocker Crackdown Spurs Record Uninstalls

#169

Post by rchaud » Fri, Nov 03, 2023, 6:01 PM UTC

sigmar wrote: post #124

rchaud wrote: post #82

Earlier quoted context omitted.

The biggest video site in the world, with the 3rd biggest cloud is admitting they can't make money with adblocking on. Most of the world is not even using adblockers, as they're on mobile apps where it's harder. Why would anyone want to enter this market?

>The biggest video site in the world, with the 3rd biggest cloud is admitting they can't make money with adblocking on. When did they admit this? They've definitely been very profitable. https://www.theverge.com/2020/2/3/21121207/youtube-google-al...

That article only mentions Youtube's revenue, it doesn't say that it was profitable.

Re: YouTube's Ad Blocker Crackdown Spurs Record Uninstalls

#170

Post by qntmfred » Fri, Nov 03, 2023, 6:43 PM UTC

malka wrote: post #145

qntmfred wrote: post #36

I've been a paying YouTube user since 2016 when it was YouTube Red. YouTube is imo one of the best sites on the internet. Both in terms of content that I personally enjoy and improves my life, as well as its role on the internet overall, where they provide a FREE service that allows EVERYONE to upload as much video as they want, and see what kind of response it gets from a global audience, and even to get paid for th…

This does read soooo much like an ad. Uncanny. not telling it is really one though.

is it that hard to fathom that other people might have generally positive experiences with products and companies that you may consider warrant criticism?

whatever valid criticism or discussion may exist regarding ad blocking policies, it doesn't change the fact that there are clear benefits to this service existing, even if those benefits comes with tradeoffs like watching ads or directly paying for the service. can't get everything for free, ya know!