Hacker News Board Hacker News, browsed like a classic message board
Live data from Hacker News

The average American has the same life expectancy as the worst part of England

twitter.com

Post reply on HN
Print view View original

161–170 of 399 posts

Re: The average American has the same life expectancy as the worst part of England

#161

Post by HEmanZ »

drdec wrote: post #154
sammalloy wrote: post #26

Earlier quoted context omitted.

> Cars are getting so big that people can’t drive them. While controversial because car companies in the US intentionally chose to market large SUVs to the public, there is some evidence that smaller vehicles are safer and that auto manufacturers have doubled down on unsafe vehicles. Why this is the case, isn’t exactly known, but one of the theories is that bad drivers will get behind bigger cars and take more risks.…

> car companies in the US intentionally chose to market large SUVs to the public, This didn't happen in a vacuum. Poorly written fuel efficiency regulations incentivized automakers to do this.

My unscientific pet theory is that poorly built/zoned neighborhoods and cities, designed as if every human needs to drive a giant car at all times, are to blame more

Re: The average American has the same life expectancy as the worst part of England

#162

Post by s1artibartfast »

TheOtherHobbes wrote: post #143
s1artibartfast wrote: post #39

Earlier quoted context omitted.

I don't think you understand the comment. If the life expectancy drops, there are fewer elderly to care for. If people don't make it to 70, you don't have to care for 70+ year Olds. It is a fair thought experiment to explore. Depending on what your priorities are, it could be optimal for everyone to die before retirement age.

If you're going to be utilitarian - if people don't get to 70 they're losing years/decades of productive life. Those who die young don't contribute much. Which is also a fair thought experiment to explore. And that's not getting into equally fair thoughts about morality and humanity.

Sure, but that is basically the question the OP was raising.

>I wonder if a lower life expectancy isn't the worst thing in the world....Maybe we shouldn't be trying as hard as we are to drag on life into the late 80s and beyond.

I think it is a reasonable and interesting question. If we could extend life to 200, but with the quality and cost of someone in their 80's, would that be socially desirable? Personally desirable?

What if you have to work 10X harder or more hours between 20 and 65 to support an elderly population 10X larger.

Re: The average American has the same life expectancy as the worst part of England

#163

Post by Gigachad »

dudul wrote: post #73
legitster wrote: post #4

"1 in 25 Americans being born will not make it to their 40th birthday." Wow. Actually impressed with the analysis backing this up. If you read the entire thread, he actually covers nearly every correlating factor I could think of. And it's pretty clearly drugs, guns, suicide, and cars. (The cardio health one doesn't seem as strong). The one that is crazy to me is the uptick in driving fatalities. Cars are an order of…

Re: car fatalities, one word: phones.

Phones exist everywhere. Why would Americans be more affected?

Re: The average American has the same life expectancy as the worst part of England

#164

Post by nradov »

sammalloy wrote: post #26
Swenrekcah wrote: post #17

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Cars are getting so big that people can’t drive them. An indescribably sad statistic: In the US, a parent drives over and kills their kid in the driveway every other day [1]. All the guns also cause -a bunch of— some small kids to kill their siblings every year. [1] https://www.nbcnews.com/news/amp/rcna52109

> Cars are getting so big that people can’t drive them. While controversial because car companies in the US intentionally chose to market large SUVs to the public, there is some evidence that smaller vehicles are safer and that auto manufacturers have doubled down on unsafe vehicles. Why this is the case, isn’t exactly known, but one of the theories is that bad drivers will get behind bigger cars and take more risks.…

Americans spend a lot of time in their vehicles. Big vehicles are simply more comfortable and practical on a daily basis, at least outside of a few dense cities. If you're going to be stuck in traffic then might as well have some space to stretch out instead of being squeezed into a compact car. Safety is less of a concern for most buyers.

You can argue that this is irrational based on handling or fuel economy or whatever. But for better or worse buyers prefer size and comfort.

Re: The average American has the same life expectancy as the worst part of England

#165

Post by bitL »

hn_throwaway_99 wrote: post #70

Sure there will be lots of hypotheses for why this is the case. In my experience, though, you can almost ignore longevity and just look at these sociological differences that make the quality of life better for the English: 1. You could easily argue that frequenting a pub shortens your lifespan, but I just loved "pub culture" when I visited colleagues in England. It's a great antidote to loneliness. 2. You can argue…

Ad 2. - freelancers/contractors have the same problem as regular employees in the US, no? E.g. one gets long covid, can't work for 12 months, runs out of money, then loses any medical insurance due to inability to pay anyway?

Re: The average American has the same life expectancy as the worst part of England

#166

Post by tmnvix »

legitster wrote: post #4

"1 in 25 Americans being born will not make it to their 40th birthday." Wow. Actually impressed with the analysis backing this up. If you read the entire thread, he actually covers nearly every correlating factor I could think of. And it's pretty clearly drugs, guns, suicide, and cars. (The cardio health one doesn't seem as strong). The one that is crazy to me is the uptick in driving fatalities. Cars are an order of…

> An entire generation has to be that much more reckless than before to make that kind of a dent

Or maybe they are driving more dangerous vehicles (e.g. bigger and heavier)?

Re: The average American has the same life expectancy as the worst part of England

#167

Post by Jedd »

bilbo0s wrote: post #119
whakim wrote: post #97

The original article points out that the primary difference between the US and the UK (as well as other peer countries) is that you're much more likely to die young in the US. A 5-year-old in the United States has a 4% chance of dying before age 40, whereas a 5-year-old in Australia, Austria, Canada, England and Wales, France, Germany, the Netherlands, Sweden, or Switzerland has ~1% chance of dying before age 40 (val…

Woah! Deaths by billion vehicle miles in UK - 5.2. In US - 12.5. (both have tens of thousands of KSI, but the US has over twice as many per cap. In fact, way, more KSI from car accidents than even gun related homicide in the US. I hadn't realized that!) Deaths by gun related homicide in UK - 200. In US - 20000. (Both numbers pale in comparison to motor vehicle deaths, but there are a lot more in the US. Probably to b…

For anyone else not hip with the lingo, KSI seemingly refers to 'Killed or Serious Injury'

Re: The average American has the same life expectancy as the worst part of England

#168

Post by tmnvix »

nukeman wrote: post #160
sammalloy wrote: post #26

Earlier quoted context omitted.

> Cars are getting so big that people can’t drive them. While controversial because car companies in the US intentionally chose to market large SUVs to the public, there is some evidence that smaller vehicles are safer and that auto manufacturers have doubled down on unsafe vehicles. Why this is the case, isn’t exactly known, but one of the theories is that bad drivers will get behind bigger cars and take more risks.…

Bigger vehicles by volume are safer, as there is more space for crumple zones. Bigger vehicles by mass are more dangerous, as there is more momentum and kinetic energy involved in a collision.

I think bigger vehicles often have the disadvantage of having a more rigid chassis.

Re: The average American has the same life expectancy as the worst part of England

#169

Post by Gigachad »

hparadiz wrote: post #87

America is a much larger country with a much larger difference in outcome between different people. A person in South Carolina will have a different life from someone in say Santa Barbara, California.

The US life expectancy has taken a nose dive in the last couple of years which other countries have not experienced.

Re: The average American has the same life expectancy as the worst part of England

#170

Post by wolverine876 »

roenxi wrote: post #112
hn_throwaway_99 wrote: post #70

Sure there will be lots of hypotheses for why this is the case. In my experience, though, you can almost ignore longevity and just look at these sociological differences that make the quality of life better for the English: 1. You could easily argue that frequenting a pub shortens your lifespan, but I just loved "pub culture" when I visited colleagues in England. It's a great antidote to loneliness. 2. You can argue…

It seems pretty likely that the US healthcare decisions at the federal level are to blame. This data suggests it isn't the access to healthcare that is to blame as much as the governance of the entire system is forcing bad outcomes. The effect here is too widespread to be "pub culture". I could see city planning being a contributor. But the effect is so extreme the place to start is deliberate policy. It would be har…

> It seems pretty likely that the US healthcare decisions at the federal level are to blame. This data suggests it isn't the access to healthcare that is to blame as much as the governance of the entire system is forcing bad outcomes.

What is your basis for that? Does it vary by state - I'm pretty sure states that invest less in health get much worse outcomes. And how can people without health insurance somehow get sufficient healthcare?

I've been in communities where many people lack health insurance (and note the bubble HN is in, where those people are seldom here to speak for themselves - for most people, it's like I visited a foreign country). I remember one person, after a car accident with many broken bones, spending 13 hours in an ER, in extreme pain, waiting to be seen. One older parent described to me removing maggots they found on their diabetic adult child's legs.

> I could see city planning being a contributor

Based on what? A dislike of city planning?

Obviously the US does not provide healthcare to its citizens, unlike every other wealthy country. You don't need much creative, insightful thinking to find the problem here. Citizens want it, the Democrats want it, almost every other major political party in the developed world supports it afaik. Like climate change, gun control and safety, and more, only the GOP opposes it; that's the problem.

Post reply on HN