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Mandatory DEI statements are becoming the norm in academic hiring

economist.com

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Re: Mandatory DEI statements are becoming the norm in academic hiring

#161

Post by wonderwonder »

SketchySeaBeast wrote: post #151
wonderwonder wrote: post #124

Earlier quoted context omitted.

When forced to choose between the effects of Gerrymandering vs my kids being penalized for the rest of their lives for being white then I am forced to choose Gerrymandering every time and I hate that this is the choice I'm presented with. I'm not a fan of Desantis at all but I am even less of a fan of this woke (I hate using the term, it sounds like a caricature) movement. My kids happen to be white, heterosexual mal…

> My kids happen to be white, heterosexual males, they should not be vilified for it and that's the route I see so many pushing for. This statement seems incredibly hyperbolic. Do you believe that DEI statements are simply "how intersectionally oppressed are you"? Have you had to answer any of these yourself? What were the exact questions?

Friend my current jobs mandatory training stated that if I try to help a person that happens to be a minority and they yell at me and berate me for assisting them that I must not argue back and should "sit there in my shame".

That's really all I need to know. While I have much deeper opinions on the topic, I'm fine just stopping there, I don't want my kids to live in a world where that sort of instruction is the norm.

Re: Mandatory DEI statements are becoming the norm in academic hiring

#162

Post by hgielatan »

Manuel_D wrote: post #153
hgielatan wrote: post #152

Earlier quoted context omitted.

[flagged]

Your link to McKinsey still fails. As does the one to UC Denver. And other than your 2nd link, the papers are paywalled. > And your company misimplementing DEI is not a reflection of DEI itself, just a reflection of how difficult it is to get these kinds of things right. Exactly the point I was making all along. The criteria for "diversity" used in research does not match what's almost always used in company DEI disc…

[flagged]

Re: Mandatory DEI statements are becoming the norm in academic hiring

#163

Post by onetimeusename »

cmh89 wrote: post #107
edgyquant wrote: post #43

Earlier quoted context omitted.

>worry about my kids if this keeps escalating. I dislike Desantis for many reasons but ended up voting for him specifically for this reason and a couple of other cultural issues Yep. There’s likely going to be a huge blowback to all of this and the supporters will write it off as the country being full of racists. At this point I no longer care. This is draconian stuff.

[flagged]

> Banning books

Everyone bans books. I am surprised this is such a meme because you probably won't find many supposed free speech activists also being in favor of putting Mein Kampf in the student library for the children or teachers teaching Creationist perspectives on science. I think there needs to be a question of merit about what is taught, no?

Re: Mandatory DEI statements are becoming the norm in academic hiring

#165

Post by SketchySeaBeast »

wonderwonder wrote: post #161
SketchySeaBeast wrote: post #151

Earlier quoted context omitted.

> My kids happen to be white, heterosexual males, they should not be vilified for it and that's the route I see so many pushing for. This statement seems incredibly hyperbolic. Do you believe that DEI statements are simply "how intersectionally oppressed are you"? Have you had to answer any of these yourself? What were the exact questions?

Friend my current jobs mandatory training stated that if I try to help a person that happens to be a minority and they yell at me and berate me for assisting them that I must not argue back and should "sit there in my shame". That's really all I need to know. While I have much deeper opinions on the topic, I'm fine just stopping there, I don't want my kids to live in a world where that sort of instruction is the norm…

Well friend, you appear to be working in an aggressively progressive company because I currently work in government and have friends who work in academia and have never heard of anything even close to the likes of that. I think it's possible you're (intentionally or not) misunderstanding their message.

Re: Mandatory DEI statements are becoming the norm in academic hiring

#166

Post by l33t233372 »

HerbMcM wrote: post #40
FormerBandmate wrote: post #16

Earlier quoted context omitted.

> It's only a matter of time till it starts bubbling out of academia to industry Hard disagree. This is the type of thing only colleges do, it’s the equivalent of an essay and also displays how different academia is from the professional world. No one cares about publications in industry, and people buy into this stuff much less sincerely than in academia

We're nearing a decade of academia spilling over to the real world, rocketing political polarisation at every level. "Industry" doesn't have any particulars that would render it immune.

Did you attend college?

I’ve been in and around various colleges for years and I’ve yet to see anything worth getting upset about; let alone worth people outside of this space getting upset about.

Re: Mandatory DEI statements are becoming the norm in academic hiring

#167

Post by jrm4 »

onetimeusename wrote: post #163
cmh89 wrote: post #107

Earlier quoted context omitted.

[flagged]

> Banning books Everyone bans books. I am surprised this is such a meme because you probably won't find many supposed free speech activists also being in favor of putting Mein Kampf in the student library for the children or teachers teaching Creationist perspectives on science. I think there needs to be a question of merit about what is taught, no?

Stop. There is a universe of difference between curating selections for children's and/or adult libraries, and a government official stepping in to control and/or ban books. The former is part of the job, the latter is overreach.

Re: Mandatory DEI statements are becoming the norm in academic hiring

#168

Post by Manuel_D »

hgielatan wrote: post #162
Manuel_D wrote: post #153

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Your link to McKinsey still fails. As does the one to UC Denver. And other than your 2nd link, the papers are paywalled. > And your company misimplementing DEI is not a reflection of DEI itself, just a reflection of how difficult it is to get these kinds of things right. Exactly the point I was making all along. The criteria for "diversity" used in research does not match what's almost always used in company DEI disc…

[flagged]

You cut off your link in the first comment. It read: "www(dot)mckinsey(dot)com/featured-insights/diversity-and-inc"

I also removed "https://" in addition to substituting (dot) to trick HN formatting.

This one works because it points to the full link: "www(dot)mckinsey(dot)com/featured-insights/diversity-and-inclusion/diversity-wins-how-inclusion-matters"

You can't just drag-select links on HN, since it truncates links. Do right-click, copy link address.

Anyway, the McKinsey study just examined the representation of "ethnic minorities" which would include Asians:

> Similarly, the representation of ethnic-minorities on UK and US executive teams stood at only 13 percent in 2019, up from just 7 percent in 2014. For our global data set, this proportion was 14 percent in 2019, up from 12 percent in 2017 (Exhibit 2).

Re: Mandatory DEI statements are becoming the norm in academic hiring

#169

Post by l33t233372 »

eat wrote: post #160

I wonder how much the appearance of these daily anti-DEI stories on the front page of HN has to do with this recession and workers' propensity to look for convenient scapegoats in the face of recent massive layoffs. Certainly looks to me that there's a lot of fear and anxiety out there that's being pointed in some... interesting directions. Don't direct that fear and anxiety upward in the org chart though, wouldn't w…

I can’t believe getting upset about something as trivial as having to write a small essay atop of the regular rigorous rigmarole associated with entering a university (as a student or faculty member).

This doesn’t make sense to me; let alone being upset on behalf of others!

Re: Mandatory DEI statements are becoming the norm in academic hiring

#170

Post by tyre »

edgyquant wrote: post #43
wonderwonder wrote: post #30

This is the sort of thing that confounds me. It proports to be anti racist but it's the opposite, it treats minorities as a special lesser class that require protection from everyone else. It's the civil rights movement in reverse. It's already started bleeding into the workspace with mandatory training and verbiage that essentially says anything you do in your interactions with a minority if they accuse you of anyth…

>worry about my kids if this keeps escalating. I dislike Desantis for many reasons but ended up voting for him specifically for this reason and a couple of other cultural issues Yep. There’s likely going to be a huge blowback to all of this and the supporters will write it off as the country being full of racists. At this point I no longer care. This is draconian stuff.

Genuinely curious, do Desantis voters think this ends without suppression of speech?

Desantis is banning books. Yes, these culture wars are bad. Stupid. But it feels like there is drift into both-sidesism.

That side of the right is most certainly not for free speech any more than Elon Musk is when taking over Twitter.

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