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Artist banned, told to “find a different style”- AI-made art

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Re: Artist banned, told to “find a different style”- AI-made art

#161

Post by jknoepfler »

vikingerik wrote: post #128
richbell wrote: post #14

Earlier quoted context omitted.

"Power" moderators, that is people who moderate a large number of subreddits, are untenable. It is not possible to effectively or fairly moderate dozens of communities, even if you were to spend all your waking moments doing so. This is, in part, why it's so common for popular submissions to be locked or deleted because "y'all can't behave". The people that do so are largely doing it for their own self-gain (e.g., se…

Why do Reddit moderators do their work? They are paid in power. They get to decide what viewpoints are seen or not by others. That is a very compelling wage. And of course they all think they're doing a service by advancing their ideology because of course their ideology is the right one.

That's an extremely reductive claim. Can you really not think of more mundane reasons someone might find themselves moderating reddit?

It's hard to imagine "ideology" being relevant to the vast majority of reddit... Do you really think the moderators of ELI5 or PeopleFuckingDying or some obscure porn reddit or whatever are primarily concerned with "ideology"?

I used to help moderate a poker forum. I was a professional poker player, and an extremely active user of the forums. I don't recall pushing an ideology beyond "keep discussions constructive and topical."

The person you just replied to was a mod. Are you implying that their work was somehow about pushing an ideology?

Re: Artist banned, told to “find a different style”- AI-made art

#162

Post by ok123456 »

spacemadness wrote: post #61
benjaminbachman wrote: post #2

The only real news here is that Reddit mods are power mad tyrants, which is nothing new at all. AI generated art has just given them newer, funnier ways to be in the wrong.

Reddit mods are ineffective or harmful a lot of the time, but so is Reddit itself in how it incentivizes thankless moderation and oversized and noisy communities for the purpose of ads and their upcoming IPO. Most non-niche subreddits could be replaced by ChatGPT at this point.

> Most non-niche subreddits could be replaced by ChatGPT at this point.

According to the "dead internet theory" they already are. I'm inclined to believe that a lot of the political discourse on there is bot driven.

Re: Artist banned, told to “find a different style”- AI-made art

#163

Post by danaris »

DethNinja wrote: post #23
geraldwhen wrote: post #4

The hilarious irony is that the AI is quite possibly copying the authors older work if it was published on an image sharing site like Reddit or deviant art. Lawsuits need to destroy these models stolen from the public.

This is a common misconception. AI is not copying anything. It is studying the images in a similar way that humans do. Entire size of the stable diffusion model is around 6gb, with pruning it goes down to 3gb. Training set is in terabytes. So it is common sense that no copying is done. I think artists need to be fair about AI, is there any artist that created their style without ever studying other artists? That is h…

The current ML approaches are not "studying", and have no thought process whatsoever, let alone "in a similar way that humans do". They build models that allow them to reproduce existing works in whole or in part—usually in many parts, put together to form a new work formed wholly out of those elements.

Humans learn actual techniques; they understand what the elements in their art actually mean; when they copy, they do so with intention (whether malicious or not). ML approaches to content creation are incapable of intention, because intention is the product of a conscious mind, and regardless of how similar some of the data structures involved in them are to certain models of the human brain, not one of the existing ML projects even remotely approaches anything we could term consciousness. (Nor is that even their purpose.)

Re: Artist banned, told to “find a different style”- AI-made art

#164

Post by squarefoot »

generalizations wrote: post #44
benjaminbachman wrote: post #2

The only real news here is that Reddit mods are power mad tyrants, which is nothing new at all. AI generated art has just given them newer, funnier ways to be in the wrong.

I wonder if the simple solution is to prevent mod accounts from interacting on the subreddits they moderate.

Not sure if that would not create more problems, but there should be some accountability when they behave like a-holes. The mod in question could have asked for proof (draw live on webcam? - not an expert, just wondering) or peer analysis instead of just silencing the artist. Then another user contacted the mod to complain, and got this reply: https://nitter.bird.froth.zone/MeaririForever/status/1607826...

That mod has become toxic and imho should either apologize or be removed asap.

Re: Artist banned, told to “find a different style”- AI-made art

#165

Post by im3w1l »

tazjin wrote: post #3

Reddit's weird setup where essentially random people who were first "own" entire categories (= subreddits) of discussion is totally absurd.

If someone founds a company they get to own it. Why shouldn't someone get to own a community they found?

Re: Artist banned, told to “find a different style”- AI-made art

#166

Post by 13of40 »

ilyt wrote: post #135
richbell wrote: post #14

Earlier quoted context omitted.

"Power" moderators, that is people who moderate a large number of subreddits, are untenable. It is not possible to effectively or fairly moderate dozens of communities, even if you were to spend all your waking moments doing so. This is, in part, why it's so common for popular submissions to be locked or deleted because "y'all can't behave". The people that do so are largely doing it for their own self-gain (e.g., se…

> This is, in part, why it's so common for popular submissions to be locked or deleted because "y'all can't behave". But they have no problem digging into downvoted comments and deleting them, even if the system already did the job for them (put the downvoted stuff at bottom and hidden).

Maybe this is already well-known, but I saw another behavior recently on some subrreddits where a lot of new posts are seemingly getting a single downvote to a score of zero. I suspected there was some troll doing it, so I went down the line and gave about 20 or 30 of them a single up vote back to one, refreshed the page, and most of them had immediately gone back to zero. I think the mods must have a button for squashing a post without actually deleting it, and on some subs they use it for a huge number of the posts.

Re: Artist banned, told to “find a different style”- AI-made art

#167

Post by MrNeon »

danogentili wrote: post #147
CuriouslyC wrote: post #7

Earlier quoted context omitted.

While we're at it we should publicly flog anyone who's ever done any art in the style of anyone else before them, because they also stole ideas from the public.

This stupid argument gets thrown around so much it's become really annoying, what really matters in art is the process, not the result; intent, not content. A model randomly remixing human works to reach an approximated result that matches a few words inserted by a human cannot be put on the same plane as a human expressing a concept or inner feelings using knowledge he acquired by looking at other works. When I look…

> what really matters in art is the process

You don't get to define what is art. Art can and does move people who have absolutely no idea of what the process to create it was.

You have your way to experience art, it isn't the only way. In fact you have a limited ability to learn about the process, how much of it are you making up in your head?

Re: Artist banned, told to “find a different style”- AI-made art

#168

Post by ok123456 »

purpleblue wrote: post #157
flumpcakes wrote: post #141

Speaking on the topic of Reddit and mods and it's power structure: In the UK Reddit has pushed a new subreddit called "HeyUK". It has turned up in the subscription feeds for some (all?) UK users automatically without the user asking for it or adding it. If you remove it from your list of subreddits the posts will still show up in your feed as "sponsored". As far as I can see this new subreddit is seeded with just cro…

The beauty of reddit is that you can create your own subreddit with your own mods and have the discourse that you want. You're not held to just sticking with the subreddits that are given to you.

It can be 'sponsored' as the parent noted. (By whom? Why?)

Re: Artist banned, told to “find a different style”- AI-made art

#169

Post by counttheforks »

richbell wrote: post #14
benjaminbachman wrote: post #2

The only real news here is that Reddit mods are power mad tyrants, which is nothing new at all. AI generated art has just given them newer, funnier ways to be in the wrong.

"Power" moderators, that is people who moderate a large number of subreddits, are untenable. It is not possible to effectively or fairly moderate dozens of communities, even if you were to spend all your waking moments doing so. This is, in part, why it's so common for popular submissions to be locked or deleted because "y'all can't behave". The people that do so are largely doing it for their own self-gain (e.g., se…

Reddit allowing moderators to lock threads was a mistake. It just enables lazy mods to be even lazier.

Re: Artist banned, told to “find a different style”- AI-made art

#170

Post by yesco »

krapp wrote: post #107
yjftsjthsd-h wrote: post #92

Earlier quoted context omitted.

I think the big difference is that artists seem to freak out about AI because it will supposedly replace them, while programmers freak out because it's allegedly violating their copyrights. Obviously this is a generalization and not true in all cases, but those really are different concerns.

Artists are freaking out out of fear that AI will replace them (it has already begun doing so) and because their copyrights are being violated, and with a general disgust at the quality of the content. Programmers are only freaking out about copyright because they naively believe AI can never automate them out of a job, whereas everyone else (artists included) deserves what's coming to them. It's the same concern in…

> Programmers are only freaking out about copyright because they naively believe AI can never automate them out of a job

That's the crazy thing, programmers have already automated their job away but no one has realized yet! Behind our backs they just input a description of what they want into their "compilers" and the friggin thing spits out a ready to go program that does exactly what they asked! The prompt usually needs a bit of fiddling to make it work correctly, but anyone could do that right?

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