TSMC to make 4nm chips in Arizona for Apple, AMD, Nvidia

Post by deburo » Thu, Dec 01, 2022, 12:36 PM UTC

totalZero wrote: post #43

etaioinshrdlu wrote: post #12

Does the CHIPS act have anything to do with making this happen? It's funny to think that the supply chain gurus at Apple & NVIDIA may be doing the work of geopolitics in the service of just defending their bottom line from disruption.

Apple spent something like a half-trillion on share buybacks. They could have averted this crisis a decade ago by thinking strategically. They didn't. Why give them credit where little or no credit is due?

Post by codedokode » Thu, Dec 01, 2022, 12:38 PM UTC

cromka wrote: post #152

codedokode wrote: post #146

Why did TSMC agreed to give away the most important technology to a foreign country? It doesn't look like a choice one would do voluntary. In my opinion, they should better give away some outdated technology like 45 or 65nm. This reminds me of China which forced some Western manufacturers to transfer technology to them.

Give away to a foreign country? You realize that TSMC is a publicly traded company and they have a shareholder responsibility in managing their operational risk?

Post by huijzer » Thu, Dec 01, 2022, 12:39 PM UTC

float4 wrote: post #122

spaniard89277 wrote: post #106

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Yeah, but local fabs in Europe are far, far away from Intel, TSMC and Samsung. Infineon, NXP and STM are wayy behind.

Why do we even want cutting edge fabs in Europe? We have no companies that design cutting edge logic chips here. Literally none. Why invest 20 billion dollars (or what is the price of a cutting edge fab these days?) to create supply without demand? Or do we seriously expect that US companies will generate significant demand even though TSMC and Samsung are already building heavily subsidized fabs in the US ?

Post by phpisthebest » Thu, Dec 01, 2022, 12:41 PM UTC

helsinkiandrew wrote: post #135

phpisthebest wrote: post #103

Earlier quoted context omitted.

>>typically cheaper labour. While a factor, labor costs alone are the primary reason. In reality is more about the wider regulatory burden on a company, including environmental controls That said it does not explain why a Japan Company can make cars profitably in the US but a US Manufacturer can not. If it was only labor why would Toyota not have a factory right next to GM's in Mexico and import cars from Mexico to t…

I guess its that the Japanese Company can make cars profitably anywhere but making cars for the US market in the US means there's no/less import taxes, also because the factories are huge they often get local tax breaks, and the cars may also eligible for EV/hybrid tax credits (I think Toyota have sold over 200K so there cars can no longer get this). I think making cars in Mexico for the US became less worthwhile whe…

Post by mdp2021 » Thu, Dec 01, 2022, 12:45 PM UTC

codedokode wrote: post #163

cromka wrote: post #152

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Give away to a foreign country? You realize that TSMC is a publicly traded company and they have a shareholder responsibility in managing their operational risk?

As I understand: 1) operating a large plant in US is much more expensive than in Taiwan and it will bring less profit. So it it not financially motivated decision. 2) US can restrict export of chips to other countries and TSMC will lose money in this case 3) US can copy the secrets, share them with Intel and AMD, and make chips without paying TSMC So this looks like a risky and not profitable decision to me.