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Apple Never Designed the iPad - They Undesigned it

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Re: Apple Never Designed the iPad - They Undesigned it

#161
post #71

Earlier quoted context omitted.

But it fulfills most of the things apple is claiming that Samsung infringed upon except the color black.

No, it also looks like the border is slightly raised more like the Kindle. This is the form factor that I would have thought of naturally, before seeing the iPad, since it's similar to the designs that existed for computers at the time. Compare it to previous tablets/slates, laptops, Palm pilots, Newton. Most of them have some kind of raised plastic border (and often not black but some shade of gray).

Problem is, the iPad was designed for finger input. Raises bezels would mean you can't touch a segment of the edge of the screen without pressing hard enough to force your finger into that triangle. Any designer working with finger input would recognize that and design a screen flush with the bezel.

With previous devices, they were generally designed with a stylus in mind (Palm, Newton, slates, etc). A flush bezel, while not required, is a no-brainer when you think about it.

Re: Apple Never Designed the iPad - They Undesigned it

#162
post #81

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Black bezel, marginal silver border, years before the iPad, made by Samsung: http://www.blogcdn.com/www.engadget.com/media/2006/1/SAMS.jp...

Samsung's picture frame is no iPad: http://www.roughlydrafted.com/2011/08/23/samsungs-digital-pi...

Design patents cover design, not function. As this article points out, minimalist designs are highly constrained. They wouldn't be minimalist if there were lots of other ways to do it.

Re: Apple Never Designed the iPad - They Undesigned it

#163
post #144

I want these people who are running around saying there's no other way to design Samsung's stuff to explain to me one thing. Why, of all the devices on earth, does Samsung's tablet exactly mimic Apple's USB connector? I've got a Galaxy Tab sitting right next to me, here. The design isn't just similar, the dimensions are nearly identical. Explain it to me. Please. If you can offer a compelling case for why Samsung isn…

The cable is a PDMI cable, an industry standard developed by ANSI/CEA ( http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/ANSI and http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Consumer_Electronics_Associatio... ), my Dell Streak comes with an identical one too, as do certain Android media players (Slacker G2). Info on PDMI: http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/PDMI Image of Dell Streak PDMI: http://www.images.technologyking.co.uk/25032011/hgggg.jpg

Indeed, that does address the pin configuration. What about the connector housing and strain relief, though? Hell, Apple's strain relief sucks – you need a pack of Sugru to rescue older dock connector cables. You don't copy that for practical reasons, right? The specimens you linked look very different from Samsung's dubiously unique interpretation.

Re: Apple Never Designed the iPad - They Undesigned it

#164
post #144

I want these people who are running around saying there's no other way to design Samsung's stuff to explain to me one thing. Why, of all the devices on earth, does Samsung's tablet exactly mimic Apple's USB connector? I've got a Galaxy Tab sitting right next to me, here. The design isn't just similar, the dimensions are nearly identical. Explain it to me. Please. If you can offer a compelling case for why Samsung isn…

The cable is a PDMI cable, an industry standard developed by ANSI/CEA ( http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/ANSI and http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Consumer_Electronics_Associatio... ), my Dell Streak comes with an identical one too, as do certain Android media players (Slacker G2). Info on PDMI: http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/PDMI Image of Dell Streak PDMI: http://www.images.technologyking.co.uk/25032011/hgggg.jpg

[deleted]

Re: Apple Never Designed the iPad - They Undesigned it

#165
post #128

Earlier quoted context omitted.

I know at least one Android tablet that has an extra power connector because apparently it's USB micro connector can not provide sufficient power. Maybe the Apple USB connector is not even protected design and Samsung was allowed to use it? Is it actually compatible to the Apple connector. Once you go for a wider connector, perhaps again there are not that many options if you want to be thin. It has to be some kind o…

> Anyway, do you feel offended by a slot in a tablet? Does it really matter that much? I'm offended that anyone can look at the situation and argue that Samsung arrived at their designs independently.

No one arrives at any design independently. Design decisions are always informed by what's been proven successful, whether be the current designer or their competitors.

Apple has of course influenced the market. The question is whether Apple has the right to be only company in the market to sell certain things, like rectangular touchscreen tablet devices. I don't think they have that right.

Re: Apple Never Designed the iPad - They Undesigned it

#166
post #144

I want these people who are running around saying there's no other way to design Samsung's stuff to explain to me one thing. Why, of all the devices on earth, does Samsung's tablet exactly mimic Apple's USB connector? I've got a Galaxy Tab sitting right next to me, here. The design isn't just similar, the dimensions are nearly identical. Explain it to me. Please. If you can offer a compelling case for why Samsung isn…

The cable is a PDMI cable, an industry standard developed by ANSI/CEA ( http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/ANSI and http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Consumer_Electronics_Associatio... ), my Dell Streak comes with an identical one too, as do certain Android media players (Slacker G2). Info on PDMI: http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/PDMI Image of Dell Streak PDMI: http://www.images.technologyking.co.uk/25032011/hgggg.jpg

From the first paragraph of the wiki page:

"It is designed as an alternative to the iPod interface which was used exclusively by Apple Inc."

The connector looks like an attempt to confuse people with the iPod peripherals and visual branding. Why that exact shape?

Re: Apple Never Designed the iPad - They Undesigned it

#167
post #18

Well argued rebuttal of Apple's claim about Samsung copying its tablet design. Although I disagree on color. Before the iPhone, and after, electronic devices have been all sorts of color. For example, the Kindle debuted in off white. Moto Razrs came in pink. Black is not the only logical solution. As the Nokia Lumia 800 has shown, there is still a lot of room for design in smartphones that don't resemble the iPhone a…

There is probably a reason why most TVs come in black - it makes the colors and the picture to stand out more. Go and take a look at the flat-screen TV section of any electronics store. All of them look pretty much alike, and actually also very much like iPad. The main difference is size, and iPad's rounded corners which are nicer to have in a device that you hold in your hands. You can even compare Nokia's circa 200…

The article goes even further and makes the claim that "every TV has a black frame", implying that Samsung had no choice for their tablets, and shows a mock-up of a tablet with a red frame for comparison.

In fact, Samsung makes TVs with red frames, which they brag is a feature:

http://ars.samsung.com/customer/usa/jsp/faqs/faqs_view_us.js... http://www.pause.com/wp-content/gallery/08-07-23-samsung/08-...

So designers at Samsung are perfectly aware you can make the bezel other colors.

Re: Apple Never Designed the iPad - They Undesigned it

#168
post #81

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Black bezel, marginal silver border, years before the iPad, made by Samsung: http://www.blogcdn.com/www.engadget.com/media/2006/1/SAMS.jp...

Damn. Probably would have been a good idea to patent that, eh?

Maybe a picture frame designer should have patented it 100 years ago.

Re: Apple Never Designed the iPad - They Undesigned it

#169

I want these people who are running around saying there's no other way to design Samsung's stuff to explain to me one thing. Why, of all the devices on earth, does Samsung's tablet exactly mimic Apple's USB connector? I've got a Galaxy Tab sitting right next to me, here. The design isn't just similar, the dimensions are nearly identical. Explain it to me. Please. If you can offer a compelling case for why Samsung isn…

Facts that form a good starting point for understanding that Samsung's defense is not open and shut:

(1) Some copying is legal.

(2) Some copying is illegal.

(3) The line between (1) and (2) is not clearly drawn.

(4) Many companies copy Apple -- some legally and some illegally.

(5) Samsung copies Apple a lot closer then most other mainstream (read: non-pirate) companies do.

...

The problem with Samsung is why (5)?

To say "that's the only way to design something" flies in the face of (4). Why can't Samsung differentiate their tablet as well as (say) the HTC Flyer?

They appear to be interested in looking as identical to Apple's products as possible -- to the point where Samsung lawyers can't even quickly say which is which when a judge holds both products over their head. When the copying is this blatant and close, accusations of piracy are unavoidable.

I'm not saying Samsung's guilty of crossing the line between legal and illegal - that's what experts and lawyers and judges are paid to do. But I'm saying they are knowingly closer to the line then most companies are comfortable being and that it's silly to casually dismiss the idea that Samsung could have infringed Apple's IP (as people here frequently do).

Re: Apple Never Designed the iPad - They Undesigned it

#170
post #43
post #35

Earlier quoted context omitted.

And they all run Windows with a stylus. No capacitive touch screen, no custom app-based OS. It's a qualitative difference.

Incorrect. Once capacitive screens that could detect a finger were invented, they were immediately incorporated into tablet PCs. Many tablets incorporated an active digitizer underneath a resistive one, allowing both fingers and styli. As for a custom app-based OS, look no further than any tablet running Windows Mobile, like the HTC Shift X9500. http://pastebin.com/6NKYY3Bf

Mis-pasted wrong link?
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