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Longevity of Recordable CDs, DVDs and Blu-Rays (2020)

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Re: Longevity of Recordable CDs, DVDs and Blu-Rays (2020)

#161

Post by Test0129 »

TedDoesntTalk wrote: post #34
Test0129 wrote: post #32

After quite a bit of research into this about a year back I decided to archive everything on archive-grade CD-Rs. 20-50 years is more than enough and realistically in the correct climate (a safe or something that humidity would have trouble getting into along with dessicants, etc) could last much longer. I evaluated magnetic tape, HDDs, and a few other options are CD-Rs are as good as magnetic tape (in longevity) and…

> Taiyo Yuden I have not been able to buy these in the last few years. Also, when I was able to buy them, one had to be careful of counterfeits. Do you have a source for them?

I don't unfortunately. I use CMC Pro now which is highly regarded. They're "powered by TY technology" which I took to mean essentially white labeled TY, made in Taiwan, so I also assumed that CMC Pro was the actual producer of TY and now that TY is defunct CMC Pro took over selling stuff.

Re: Longevity of Recordable CDs, DVDs and Blu-Rays (2020)

#162

Post by squarefoot »

bitL wrote: post #122
squarefoot wrote: post #6

I've stopped using burned CDs and DVDs like 15 years ago, long before they were considered obsolete, after losing a huge amount of data, including multiple backups of projects. All of them were kept in their own case on a wall CD/DVD holder, no weights, no humidity, no excessive heat or any sun exposition. After only about 5 years like 30% of them were unreadable at all and others developed errors, so as soon as I re…

100GB M-DISCs are still pretty decent archival means. All photos/videos I've ever generated are roughly 1.2TB so that's 12 of those M-Discs.

This is really good news! I thought M-Discs were no longer available after their manufacturer went bankrupt years ago.

Re: Longevity of Recordable CDs, DVDs and Blu-Rays (2020)

#163

Post by squarefoot »

369548684892826 wrote: post #107
squarefoot wrote: post #61

Earlier quoted context omitted.

This is also true. Having also lost data on two hard drives kept in a drawer for just over a couple years I can totally confirm that, however it was a isolated incident probably also due to some physical issues in the drives, although they weren't old and SMART would report them as 100% healthy. After those two years both drives were completely dead, not just unreadable; ultimately I could bring one to life again aft…

Wondering if you do any checking for bitrot? I mean, if some files on one of your disks became corrupt over time how would you know before it becomes too late to recover it from older backups?

I'm no sysadmin so my knowledge in the field is limited. I'm relying on ZFS mirrors which hopefully should be a bit better than the alternatives at bit rot protection, but admittedly if I was hit by corruption at that level that would catch me unprepared. I'm open to suggestions however.

Re: Longevity of Recordable CDs, DVDs and Blu-Rays (2020)

#164

Post by quesera »

jjkaczor wrote: post #111

Once made a quick $5k, because a former client had started using CD-RW for their "enterprise" backups, 10-years later they had unreadable data and contacted me to see if I still had some source-code. Checked my stack of hard-drives, and... Yes... yes, I did have a working copy. That cemented it in my personal world - NAS with also HD's is the way to go.

Both you and client got lucky there.

Many contract agreements would not allow you to keep the data, and you'd be more likely to be sued than paid!

But I agree that (maintained NAS >> removable media). :)

Re: Longevity of Recordable CDs, DVDs and Blu-Rays (2020)

#165

Post by everdrive »

Does anyone have longevity information on commercially-pressed CDs and DVDs? I know that from my own experience they last longer, but not forever. When they were new, one of CD's major selling points was their longevity. This seems have been wildly over-estimated, however.

Re: Longevity of Recordable CDs, DVDs and Blu-Rays (2020)

#166

Post by vel0city »

magic_hamster wrote: post #152
bitL wrote: post #122

Earlier quoted context omitted.

100GB M-DISCs are still pretty decent archival means. All photos/videos I've ever generated are roughly 1.2TB so that's 12 of those M-Discs.

Those are BD-R. According to the linked research, those will last 5-10 years, or up to 20 years if you're using a gold metal plate. Either way, they're not close to top performers that last 50 to 100 years and more. I'd suggest creating multiple backups, including additional mediums such as hard drives and cloud storage (something like S3 Glacier Deep Archive could be relevant), and refresh the media periodically.

They aren't normal BD-Rs nor are they gold plate. They use a different technology for the reflective and recording layers. These discs weren't included in the linked research.

Re: Longevity of Recordable CDs, DVDs and Blu-Rays (2020)

#167

Post by vel0city »

smarx007 wrote: post #104

Is anyone using M-disks and what's your experience so far? https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/M-DISC https://web.archive.org/web/20130422110903if_/http://www.mdi...

I have some M-DISC DVD's from ~15 years ago that still read fine.

That said I still have a lot of cheap CDs from 20 years ago that still read fine as well.

I've had a 25GB M-DISC BD-R kicking around on my desk without a sleeve or case for a while now to test durability. Sometimes I take it outside and leave it on my patio table for a few days to add some extra wear. I slide it around the desk, pick it up with normal greasy/dirty hands and handle it non-gently, flex it a bit, wash it off in the sink, and wipe it off with a cotton cloth. After four years of this abuse so far it still hasn't lost a single bit of data. I have noticed some of it takes a bit longer to get a good read so I'll probably lose data soon but this has been a hell of a lot of abuse so far.

Re: Longevity of Recordable CDs, DVDs and Blu-Rays (2020)

#168

Post by bitL »

squarefoot wrote: post #162
bitL wrote: post #122

Earlier quoted context omitted.

100GB M-DISCs are still pretty decent archival means. All photos/videos I've ever generated are roughly 1.2TB so that's 12 of those M-Discs.

This is really good news! I thought M-Discs were no longer available after their manufacturer went bankrupt years ago.

Verbatim still sells them, though they are a bit expensive.

Re: Longevity of Recordable CDs, DVDs and Blu-Rays (2020)

#169

Post by 1970-01-01 »

mjhagen wrote: post #157
1970-01-01 wrote: post #153

I have binders full of cheap Staples CD-Rs from the early 2000s that literally flaked and peeled. I also have Sony CD-R discs in the exact same binders from the same time period. The Sony discs are fine.

I have a couple of those flaked/peeled disks, those are gone beyond hope, right?

Undamaged tracks can still be read. Set the drive to the lowest spin speed and go for it.

Re: Longevity of Recordable CDs, DVDs and Blu-Rays (2020)

#170

Post by gruez »

bitL wrote: post #156
magic_hamster wrote: post #152

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Those are BD-R. According to the linked research, those will last 5-10 years, or up to 20 years if you're using a gold metal plate. Either way, they're not close to top performers that last 50 to 100 years and more. I'd suggest creating multiple backups, including additional mediums such as hard drives and cloud storage (something like S3 Glacier Deep Archive could be relevant), and refresh the media periodically.

M-Disc are supposed to last 100-1000 years. They literally engrave data into an inorganic layer with high melting point instead of writing to a dye.

>They literally engrave data into a polycarbonate with high melting point instead of writing to a dye.

Are you sure you're not talking about pressed (ie. mass produced) discs? I find it unlikely that a blu-ray/dvd burner equipped with only a laser can "engrave data into a polycarbonate with high melting point".

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