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Magnus Carlsen to give up World Championship title

chess24.com

161–170 of 461 posts

Re: Magnus Carlsen to give up World Championship title

#161

It might be worth mentioning a famous abdication which caused a lot of consternation, albeit in another game. I love this story but may have gotten some details wrong. Marion Tinsley was world checkers champion from 1955-1958, then took a break, then again from 1975-1991, when he resigned in protest (at age 64 ). He was utterly dominant; indeed it is hard to think of a competitor in all of history more dominant over…

It turns out Checkers was solved, for perfect play, in 2007 if anyone was wondering.

https://webdocs.cs.ualberta.ca/~chinook/publications/solving...

Re: Magnus Carlsen to give up World Championship title

#162

Time to change the format. It's understandable you don't want to spend your whole career preparing for these long matches all the time. For the challenger it's 6 months of preparing, but for Carlsen it would've been his 6th time of preparing for this in a few years. They have also become less entertaining. 12 matches is long (edit, 14 now), but no one dares to take any risks. Caruana was just defensive and all games…

12 games - or even 14, since the last WC (games, not "matches", excuse the nitpick) isn't long, it's short. There's never been a shorter format for chess WC. And this is precisely WHY players don't take any risks - because dropping even a single point means there won't be many chances left for equalising the score again.

Re: Magnus Carlsen to give up World Championship title

#163
post #88

My read on the situation is that Magnus had two goals: 1) remain world champion 2) get to 2900 elo #1 got in the way of #2 because all the elite grandmasters constantly focus throughout the year on preparing for Magnus, which creates a headwind in the non-world champion tournaments where he must perform well to reach 2900. My guess is he will focus on 2900. Then, come back as world champion. Then, retire after 7 cham…

> #1 got in the way of #2 because all the elite grandmasters... ... also focus on grabbing draws. Draws against lower rated players (that is, everyone for Magnus) drop your elo. Winning the world championship may very well drop Mangus' elo score if it involves only a handful of wins and lots of draws.

Carlsen was 2853 rated in November 2016, December 2016 it was 2840 after playing the WC match against Karjakin in November.

Winning against Anand in 2013 gave him 2 points. I think he got 1 point for beating Nepo in 2021.

With that, reaching 2900 seems almost impossible. He was at 2882 two times, but when you need almost perfect score to achieve it it's hard.

Re: Magnus Carlsen to give up World Championship title

#164
post #10

Time to change the format. It's understandable you don't want to spend your whole career preparing for these long matches all the time. For the challenger it's 6 months of preparing, but for Carlsen it would've been his 6th time of preparing for this in a few years. They have also become less entertaining. 12 matches is long (edit, 14 now), but no one dares to take any risks. Caruana was just defensive and all games…

I know next to nothing about competitive chess, other than watching the Magnus documentary about a younger Magnus. What kinds of things are chess players doing to prepare for a match for 6 Months? Is there something they're memorizing, studying video (what would they be looking fro)? I'd have always just thought they were good to play at any time. This sounds super stressful.

I remember Caruana mentioning how he wasn't prepared for how much Carlsen "understood" him (not exact words from the video, but something to that effect).

It sounded sort of like a side mind game that Carlsen plays on his opponents. It made it clear that Carlsen really studies his opponents and not just their past games.

Re: Magnus Carlsen to give up World Championship title

#165
post #82

Honest question: Would somebody at this "level" be better than good at something like StarCraft ? Noted that SC takes more than "just strategy" i.e micro comes to mind. Like I would pay good money to see Serral Vs Magnus, maybe after some coaching sessions with Harstem ? :D ? EDIT: Just out of curiosity will there be anything else that someone at this level is "exceptional" good at besides chess ?

"Good" as in, maybe reach GM? Quite likely, although being in GM already makes you a statistical outlier (200 slots per region in a player base of hundreds of thousands). Good enough to challenge a pro? You're seriously underestimating how much hard work the pros are putting in to play at their level - on top of the insane mechanical skill, game knowledge, and experience. Part of the skillset is obviously transferrab…

Yeah. The live element brings something else to the table. It's not only knowing what to do, but being able to execute.

I've played Starcraft off and on, mostly through the Brood War days, and never super competitively. My friends and I had a standing Friday night game we'd play. We were ok.

My brother-in-law came to stay with us for a while and he had never played Starcraft before but wanted to try it out. So I said, sure, we can 2v2 the computer so you can get a handle on things. We'll play Terran since it's the most like Warcraft. He told me he's played Age of Empires, he knows what RTSs are like. He'll be fine, he wanted to 1v1. I asked him if he was sure because Starcraft was a much faster game than AoE. He said he was sure, it would be fine.

So we played. I played a pretty standard build order, sent out my 10th/11th worker as a scout, found his base, saw he was still on his initial set of workers and building a barracks with one of them. So I built my second base on his expansion spot, got it up to speed, built a couple of barracks, and a couple of machine shops, cranked out some marines, medics, and siege tanks, and to top it off, I build a starport and some drop ships. Loaded up the squad and dropped them behind his mineral line, obliterated his economy, then rolled through his base.

Re: Magnus Carlsen to give up World Championship title

#167
post #47

Earlier quoted context omitted.

I've found them entertaining to watch. But Norwegians are master of slow-TV, so I guess that's why. They have good experts that manage to explain it to normal people. Interesting guests in the studio between moves. Interact with audience through questions from chat etc. > Chess, in theory, with absolutely perfect play, is a draw. I don't think that's solved, actually.

> I've found them entertaining to watch. But Norwegians are master of slow-TV, so I guess that's why. They have good experts that manage to explain it to normal people. Interesting guests in the studio between moves. Interact with audience through questions from chat etc. I usually don't follow chess, but I still end up watching the WC matches on Norwegian TV. They manage to make it interesting and exciting.

I love the idea of being somewhere that (a) what the world chess champion does is big news and (2) there are resources dedicated like this to the broadcast of chess matches. American culture is just so ostentatiously mauvais ton in comparison with so many other countries (my other point of comparison was being in England in ’93 and watching a game show where it was clearly a competition of intellectual skills and the winner’s prize was a dictionary—I just cannot imagine that being on American television).

Re: Magnus Carlsen to give up World Championship title

#168

It might be worth mentioning a famous abdication which caused a lot of consternation, albeit in another game. I love this story but may have gotten some details wrong. Marion Tinsley was world checkers champion from 1955-1958, then took a break, then again from 1975-1991, when he resigned in protest (at age 64 ). He was utterly dominant; indeed it is hard to think of a competitor in all of history more dominant over…

Chinook was obviously playing the long con. Knowing Tinsley's weakness was his humanity, so it continued to draw until his frail human body succumbed to the forces of nature, thus winning once and for all.

If you have a few hours to kill, here is a game the situation reminds me of:

https://www.decisionproblem.com/paperclips/

Re: Magnus Carlsen to give up World Championship title

#169
post #46
post #29

Earlier quoted context omitted.

No idea their reasoning, but if I were a top football, swimmer, or other athlete and knew that a computer could outperform me even at my highest level would be pretty disconcerting.

That's already true of most sports, though. There's plenty of mechanical constructs that can move faster than the fastest human. The challenge is to be the fastest human using nothing but a human body, not to outrun a car or a boat (or even a humanoid running robot, which I assume we could build at this point, if anyone was interested in putting enough money behind it.)

Of course a human can't outrun a car. This isn't some unprecedented idea, people have retired for this reason before:

https://www.bbc.com/news/technology-50573071

Re: Magnus Carlsen to give up World Championship title

#170
post #21

Obviously this raised the issue of Bobby Fischer. The article mentions this but doesn't really go into the details. Fischer beat Spassky in Rejkyavik in 1972 for the World Championship. This took almost 3 months (July to September) and there was controversy, disagreement and negotiation about where and how it would take place. This had the backdrop of being a Cold War proxy too of course. Interestingly, Fischer didn'…

The quote by Paul Morphy, one of the great old chess masters, seems relevant here - "The ability to play chess is the sign of a gentleman. The ability to play chess well is the sign of a wasted life."

I hope it doesn't apply to coding too.
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