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Buddhism has found a new institutional home in the West: the corporation

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Re: Buddhism has found a new institutional home in the West: the corporation

#161

Post by HKH2 »

prox wrote: post #143
javajosh wrote: post #139

>It feels anti human. Because it is. The zeitgeist on the left (so, academia) is consumed by personal shame, guilt, and self-loathing, and a great deal of intellectual work has been done to post hoc rationalize these feelings and package them in catchy phrases. Terms like "cultural appropriation" and "privilege" or "systematic racism" or "toxic masculinity", may have some technically useful meanings to anthropologist…

While I find some parts of your sympathetic, conflating the left with academia is not really a valid approach. That some (on the left) have picked up on academic usage of some words or models is perhaps more accurate, and the misuse of words and terms. Which is far more prevalent in my experience. There was an interesting article about some social inequalities where when we talk about something more -is actually maki…

> While I find some parts of your sympathetic, conflating the left with academia is not really a valid approach.

The parts of academia that are relevant to this discussion (humanities and social sciences) are certainly dominated by the left.

Re: Buddhism has found a new institutional home in the West: the corporation

#162

Post by blitz_skull »

TheOtherHobbes wrote: post #156
javajosh wrote: post #139

>It feels anti human. Because it is. The zeitgeist on the left (so, academia) is consumed by personal shame, guilt, and self-loathing, and a great deal of intellectual work has been done to post hoc rationalize these feelings and package them in catchy phrases. Terms like "cultural appropriation" and "privilege" or "systematic racism" or "toxic masculinity", may have some technically useful meanings to anthropologist…

Only narcissists and not very aware people are able to "enjoy the world as it is, in all its messiness." Because that's what it takes to ignore abusive levels of inequality and systemic threats to the continued survival of the species. The point is not about what happened in the past, it's about what is still happening now - and how the narratives from the past continue to be used to justify it. Ignoring this is neit…

If it requires being “not very aware” to enjoy life without frothing at the mouth in anger at all the messiness of the world, I consider myself a proud narcissist / “not very aware” person.

I think you’ve missed the commenters main point which is that all this hand-wringing about how terrible things are—isn’t actively solving any problems we have today, or any problems we had yesterday. I would even dare to guess it won’t solve the problems we’ll have tomorrow.

Re: Buddhism has found a new institutional home in the West: the corporation

#163

Post by throwawayacc2 »

TheOtherHobbes wrote: post #156
javajosh wrote: post #139

>It feels anti human. Because it is. The zeitgeist on the left (so, academia) is consumed by personal shame, guilt, and self-loathing, and a great deal of intellectual work has been done to post hoc rationalize these feelings and package them in catchy phrases. Terms like "cultural appropriation" and "privilege" or "systematic racism" or "toxic masculinity", may have some technically useful meanings to anthropologist…

Only narcissists and not very aware people are able to "enjoy the world as it is, in all its messiness." Because that's what it takes to ignore abusive levels of inequality and systemic threats to the continued survival of the species. The point is not about what happened in the past, it's about what is still happening now - and how the narratives from the past continue to be used to justify it. Ignoring this is neit…

> Only narcissists and not very aware people are able to "enjoy the world as it is, in all its messiness."

I do not believe myself to be a narcissist and I think I am at least somewhat aware of the world and it’s problems.

Yet, despite this, I do “ enjoy the world as it is, in all its messiness”.

I think what is preventing you from doing the same is ideology and close mindedness. From the comment, you come across like a fundamentalist christian refusing to enjoy life because “the world is sinful”.

Enjoy life man. Since we’re on the article, take a page from the Buddhist philosophy and let go, for a moment at least :)

Re: Buddhism has found a new institutional home in the West: the corporation

#164

Post by TheOtherHobbes »

throwawayacc2 wrote: post #115
md_ wrote: post #99

Earlier quoted context omitted.

I think the key point is that it becomes "appropriation"--vs cultural mixing or exchange--when the ideas are removed of their source context and used in a way that is contrary or even disrespectful of their original intent. I'm far from an expert, but it seems like a reasonable argument to advance that the linkage of Buddhist practices with corporate and material advancement--and the removal of spiritual or ethical c…

The exact same thing can be said about anything. Judaism appropriated pre existing ideas and disrespected them by insisting on a single god. Christianity appropriated judaism and disrespected it by removing covenant practices such as circumcision and adding new ideas such as the kingdom of heaven being available to anyone not just “the chosen people”. Islam appropriated christianity and disrespected it by demoting Je…

The original communist ideology wasn't original at all. The roots go back at least to the time of the Gracchi in Rome.

It's clear hardly anyone commenting here has any idea what appropriation really is. It's not just disrespecting existing cultures.

It's destroying them by removing the meaning from them. And then repackaging the symbols - usually with a vague implication of profundity and exoticism - as a marketable commodity.

The purpose isn't to spread the original culture but to use the trappings to promote the usual Western corporate neoliberal value system.

Corporate Buddhism is a perfect example. It's clearly a lot more corporate than Buddhist. The goal isn't enlightenment, detachment, or compassion, it's cultural conformity with the aim of increased productivity and a higher share price.

This shouldn't be controversial. All you need to do is look at how people behave to see what motivates them.

Re: Buddhism has found a new institutional home in the West: the corporation

#165

Post by eurasiantiger »

Lutzb wrote: post #57
eurasiantiger wrote: post #41

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Buddhism explicitly denies the existence of gods.

False. Even with a cursory understanding of buddhist tradition you should know that the many schools accept the existence of god-like beings, but differ on their influence of the buddhist practitioner. You could start to increase your understanding by reading https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Buddhist_deities or https://www.learnreligions.com/atheism-and-devotion-in-buddh...

Let’s not start an ecumenical debate that has been settled for decades.

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Basic_points_unifying_Theravād...

Some traditions do not agree, of course.

Re: Buddhism has found a new institutional home in the West: the corporation

#166

Post by Existenceblinks »

solardev wrote: post #2

Oops, looks like your mindfulness has expired! Would you like to renew it for $4.99?

Ironically, it's expired and renew in every point in time. Even Arahants couldn't stand still in provocative environments. "Mindfulness" is weird english word that doesn't translate well into what it actually is. I would describe the state of mind like "nothingness of soul". At the end of the day, as I understand, Buddhism is about observing things from distance (even mind detached from everything, eventually until there is no mind/soul at all), like "it is what it is". Anger, love, stress whatever comes and go. Urhggg oh my .. buddhist, the more I describe the more it becomes inaccurate.

Re: Buddhism has found a new institutional home in the West: the corporation

#167

Post by robinsoh »

unmole wrote: post #59
robinsoh wrote: post #23

Earlier quoted context omitted.

> All the core teachings lie in Hindu scriptures What does "scripture" mean in this context? Scripture normally means messages 'directly' from the 'Abrahamic God' received by certain 'special individuals' (prophets, etc), such as the Bible, Quran, Torah. I thought Hinduism did not have any belief in any messages being sent from "God" to humans. So could you give some examples on what would be Hindu scripture and othe…

> What does "scripture" mean in this context? Scripture normally means messages 'directly' from the 'Abrahamic God' Oxford disagrees: https://www.oxfordlearnersdictionaries.com/definition/englis... And Hindu scriptures is the example the lexicographers chose. Besides, the Old and New Testaments are traditionally attributed to specific authors. Only the Quran qualifies as scripture by your definition, not even the Had…

> The Vedas are considered revelation from the ultimate reality.

As far as I can tell from googling, they are just considered to be stories from Aryans that entered India. "The Vedas are considered the earliest literary record of Indo-Aryan civilization"

Re: Buddhism has found a new institutional home in the West: the corporation

#168

Post by rayiner »

prox wrote: post #143
javajosh wrote: post #139

>It feels anti human. Because it is. The zeitgeist on the left (so, academia) is consumed by personal shame, guilt, and self-loathing, and a great deal of intellectual work has been done to post hoc rationalize these feelings and package them in catchy phrases. Terms like "cultural appropriation" and "privilege" or "systematic racism" or "toxic masculinity", may have some technically useful meanings to anthropologist…

While I find some parts of your sympathetic, conflating the left with academia is not really a valid approach. That some (on the left) have picked up on academic usage of some words or models is perhaps more accurate, and the misuse of words and terms. Which is far more prevalent in my experience. There was an interesting article about some social inequalities where when we talk about something more -is actually maki…

Your criticism is fair, but I’m not sure there is a better framing. Between corporations, political elites, and the media, the most influential and highly visible folks that identify as being “on the left” are much more influenced by Judith Butler than by any socialist thinker.

Re: Buddhism has found a new institutional home in the West: the corporation

#169

Post by lolinder »

TheOtherHobbes wrote: post #156
javajosh wrote: post #139

>It feels anti human. Because it is. The zeitgeist on the left (so, academia) is consumed by personal shame, guilt, and self-loathing, and a great deal of intellectual work has been done to post hoc rationalize these feelings and package them in catchy phrases. Terms like "cultural appropriation" and "privilege" or "systematic racism" or "toxic masculinity", may have some technically useful meanings to anthropologist…

Only narcissists and not very aware people are able to "enjoy the world as it is, in all its messiness." Because that's what it takes to ignore abusive levels of inequality and systemic threats to the continued survival of the species. The point is not about what happened in the past, it's about what is still happening now - and how the narratives from the past continue to be used to justify it. Ignoring this is neit…

> Only narcissists and not very aware people are able to "enjoy the world as it is, in all its messiness."

I don't know if you meant to come off as harshly as you did, but this is needlessly reductive, which is especially ironic in a discussion about Buddhism.

What you propose is that there are two extremes: enjoyment of the world while ignoring suffering and self mortification while trying to solve it. These are, in essence, the two extremes which the Buddha argued against in favor of the Middle Path[0]:

> There is an addiction to indulgence of sense-pleasures, which is low, coarse, the way of ordinary people, unworthy, and unprofitable; and there is an addiction to self-mortification, which is painful, unworthy, and unprofitable. Avoiding both these extremes, the Perfect One has realized the Middle Path; it gives vision, gives knowledge, and leads to calm, to insight, to enlightenment and to Nibbana.

I don't think that OP is saying we should ignore suffering and not try to address it, but they are saying that self-flagellation is unhelpful and toxic, and we should approach suffering with a forward eye not a backward one.

[0] https://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/Middle_Way

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