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My boundaries as an open source developer

joeldenning.com

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Re: My boundaries as an open source developer

#161

Post by smashah »

morgante wrote: post #152
jurassic wrote: post #142

A few years back I was in a role where it was my job to maintain a small but non-trivial open source project (~1500 github stars, 5 core contributors). I burned out after about two years in that role. People repeatedly demanding help in the github issues without even providing repro steps. Hate mail to the project email list from users angry we didn't implement the feature they want in the latest release. We had peop…

> People repeatedly demanding help in the github issues without even providing repro steps. This is the biggest annoyance for me. There's a very clear issue template on my repos. It provides concrete, reasonable requirements (for example, post the actual config that broke!) yet people frequently expect support without filling it out. Even worse, they will make drive-by comments/demands on random PRs instead of openin…

I literally print out a mostly pre-filled github link with most repro context, all they have to do is fill the rest of it in. They still don't do it.

Nowadays a non-templated bug issue is autoclosed.

Re: My boundaries as an open source developer

#162

Post by smashah »

mwattsun wrote: post #127
yblu wrote: post #124

I used to maintain several popular open-source projects and contribute to even more popular ones. It was always fun at the beginning, especially because I built them for my own needs. But I kept getting asked to fix bugs or improve things even long after my needs had expired. I tried the donation route for a little while but it didn't go anywhere - I received maybe a few hours worth of money (versus hundreds if not t…

The reality is: most companies are taking economic advantage of the generous spirit of open source developers. That needs to stop. SPONSORING OPEN SOURCE DEVELOPERS Rich Hickey - December 15, 2020 https://cognitect.com/blog/2020/12/15/sponsoring-open-source... HN Thread here: https://news.ycombinator.com/item?id=25436335

Sponsorship is not a panacea unfortunately as corporate use of a project is not proportional to the maintainership burden. Hopefully the industry can fix this one day.

Re: My boundaries as an open source developer

#164

Post by jamie-vesoft »

smashah wrote: post #161
morgante wrote: post #152

Earlier quoted context omitted.

> People repeatedly demanding help in the github issues without even providing repro steps. This is the biggest annoyance for me. There's a very clear issue template on my repos. It provides concrete, reasonable requirements (for example, post the actual config that broke!) yet people frequently expect support without filling it out. Even worse, they will make drive-by comments/demands on random PRs instead of openin…

I literally print out a mostly pre-filled github link with most repro context, all they have to do is fill the rest of it in. They still don't do it. Nowadays a non-templated bug issue is autoclosed.

Autoclosing is a good take.

Re: My boundaries as an open source developer

#165

Post by yawaramin »

enraged_camel wrote: post #143
wildmanx wrote: post #108

So much this. I'm glad he put this out there. I'll start linking to it too. There seems to be a common misconception about open source. When I release software as open source, it does not mean I work for you for free, need to provide you with anything, even need to be nice to you. I may. Or I may not. When I release software under an open source license, then we have a very specific deal. You are entitled to do certa…

I will preface this by saying I have immense respect for anyone who open-sources their work. I think the web as we know it today would not exist without such kind and hard-working individuals. In my opinion, I think most of these issues outlined in the article are caused by lack of communication combined with unclear expectations, to be honest. The only thing I ask of open-source library authors/maintainers is this:…

The OP is an article doing literally exactly what you want. And he's going above and beyond what's required–he didn't even need to communicate all this redundantly. It's already all in the open source license–willingness to work, level of commitment, etc. Just read the license. It's included in every open source project.

Re: My boundaries as an open source developer

#166

Post by yawaramin »

saagarjha wrote: post #125
blittle wrote: post #119

Earlier quoted context omitted.

That's a poor analogy. An ice cream parlor offers free icecream purely to market thier product and drive business. An OSS dev gets nothing.

Nothing? Not at all: an open source developer gets the marketing/publicity benefit just like an ice cream parlor does. Why do you think companies open source their things? And as a solo developer, I get tons of high-quality inbound leads for job opportunities, get to interact with lots of smart people (many whom I end up forming long-lasting friendships with), and get other people to help improve and support my proje…

Would you do your current job for free for, say, six months to earn 'exposure' and 'warm fuzzy feelings'?

Re: My boundaries as an open source developer

#167

Post by yawaramin »

ricardobeat wrote: post #118
wildmanx wrote: post #112

Earlier quoted context omitted.

> I totally get where they are coming from but it does make it sound like unsupported software. All software is "unsupported software" unless explicitly stated otherwise. Just because some software has its software published under an open source license does not make it magically "supported". Not more than any proprietary software. If you want support, pay for it. You can already be glad that somebody published the s…

By “unsupported software” I don’t think he means any kind of support for his particular use of the software, but simply the pace of development - keeping up with system API evolution, dependencies, fixing bugs in the original code. Software rots, and you generally don’t want to adopt a project that is not having basic maintenance being done.

It boils down to the same thing. Support can be specific for a business need or for just general maintenance and bitrot prevention.

Re: My boundaries as an open source developer

#168

Post by travisgriggs »

Is this kind of burnout perhaps in part due to the level of mechanization provided by the defacto platform for open source projects now: GitHub?

It seems like it’s more frequent, but maybe that’s just me.

It’s great that GitHub exists and lowers the barrier for anyone to develop and share open source efforts. But you also become a slave to its various very well automated processes. As a creative altruistic agent, that can actually take a lot of the fun out of it. And make one feel trapped by the process machine.

It seems in old days, when things were less standardized, maintainers had more creative control over not only the code, but the process/community around it.

I’m not advocating for a demise of GitHub. Just kind of wondering if this is the price we pay.

Re: My boundaries as an open source developer

#169

Post by nullc »

brunoborges wrote: post #120

Open Source licenses are not about entitlement to contributions, engagement with the maintainers, or even community building. Open Source license is exclusively about the software. But the "Open Source Movement" is blending over, and that's what is burning out so many people on both sides: maintainers and contributors. GitHub's Pull Request feature creates an expectation that the maintainers will read a contributor's…

It would be super nice if new issues (and PRs) could be made hidden from non-repo-members by default until they're triaged by a repo member (or until some timeout passes without the issue being closed/deleted).

There is a lot of performative abuse on github, where someone opens an ill-tempered or outright misleading issue, and hurls insults and then takes to twitter or reddit to try to get people to pile on, or they complain that their wall of invective was just summarily closed. And when you do ban people on github it has all kinds of weird side effects like blocking them from commenting on other project's issues where you're active.

In general, GH makes it really hard to ghost people. There have always been people who through personality or situation were unable to participate productively. Under older models of communication it was easy to simply ignore these unproductive actions without initiating any visible response that would trigger retaliation or fixation.

Re: My boundaries as an open source developer

#170

Post by saagarjha »

yawaramin wrote: post #166
saagarjha wrote: post #125

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Nothing? Not at all: an open source developer gets the marketing/publicity benefit just like an ice cream parlor does. Why do you think companies open source their things? And as a solo developer, I get tons of high-quality inbound leads for job opportunities, get to interact with lots of smart people (many whom I end up forming long-lasting friendships with), and get other people to help improve and support my proje…

Would you do your current job for free for, say, six months to earn 'exposure' and 'warm fuzzy feelings'?

That’s a false dichotomy, because an ice cream parlor doesn’t stop selling ice cream when they give out free samples, any more than most open source developers quit their jobs (or stop searching for one) to work on their personal projects. Plus, you’re kind of asking the wrong person anyways, because I think I actually do significantly more work for free than I do for what I get paid for, just for those warm fuzzy feelings (exposure being a nice bonus). Plus, I happen to be financially stable enough to probably do this for longer than six months if required even without a full-time job. I basically did this last year when switching jobs (actually around five months, while interviewing around at a leisurely pace) and it was incredibly enjoyable. Felt like I had retired early and could just pursue whatever I wanted to learn or make: if you can afford to do it, I’d strongly suggest giving it a try.
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