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YouTube suspends The Hill for playing clip of Trump denying election results

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Re: YouTube suspends The Hill for playing clip of Trump denying election results

#161

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Meming about and being afraid of WW3 is critical in containing/deescalating it. WW1 happened partly because nobody was afraid of it happenning.

> WW1 happened partly because nobody was afraid of it happenning. That is an interesting take on it. It may not be wrong, but I hadn't heard that before.

I think the point is that WWI was precipitated by a chain of events that could have, in theory, easily been interrupted if the belligerents had been sufficiently fearful of conflict.

Re: YouTube suspends The Hill for playing clip of Trump denying election results

#162

Earlier quoted context omitted.

There's a huge difference: in Bush v. Gore, Gore stepped aside for the good of the country, choosing to respect the institution of the courts even if the decision was dodgy. Trump is willing to burn down the institutions if it gives him an edge. The danger from the Trump narrative is not that die-hards are still grumbling, it's that the candidate doesn't seem to care about anything beyond his own interests.

eh, I think you're being pretty generous to Gore there. It was a long, drawn, fought out battle involving many lawsuits and lots of court coverage. In the end, when Gore had basically lost all of his challenges, he did "step aside" as far as dropping the lawsuits. But he continued to be a presence and he was still pretty bitter about it many years later (and brought it up nearly every time he was on TV). 6 years late…

There's nothing wrong with a long, drawn-out fight through the proper channels. A couple of months is not really a long, drawn-out fight by the standards of the American legal system anyway. Gore owed it to everyone who voted for him to fight for his win to the full extent of the law, which he did. When that was exhausted, he stepped aside and stepped out of the public eye for a long time. He did not push beyond the limits of the law, he did not rally his supporters against the new administration, he did not immediately start running for the 2004 nomination. When he finally did start making news again, it was, as you said, 6 years later. Bush had already been reelected with no interference from Gore. He didn't reopen any wounds, "An Inconvenient Truth" was not a political statement, it was not a diatribe against his political foes, it was not a platform on which to build another run for president. It was a return to the core issues that drove him earlier in his career. Issues that should be non-political in the first place.

To say "Gore is better than Trump on this" is to imply that they are both operating in the same universe, just on different levels. That is a false premise. There can be no comparison here.

Re: YouTube suspends The Hill for playing clip of Trump denying election results

#163

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Yup. Literal verbatim Kremlin narrative and framing. Not sure what's LOL about that. Have you never seen this before?

You may have to reconsider this one, the title looks bad, but it's from a few years back and his opinions don't seem to align with Russia's in the slightest (among other things he has stated Ukraine should have kept their nuclear weapons as a deterrent for Russian invasion, in 1993).

I'm not sure Russia would disagree that the Ukraine should have kept their nuclear weapons if they wanted to maintain sovereignty

Re: YouTube suspends The Hill for playing clip of Trump denying election results

#164
post #136

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Just wait until GPT3 deep-fake audio. Closely followed by Deep-fake video. And algorithms will amplify this content to the echo chambers that "want" to hear it to increase ad revenue a few percentage points. All this will enter society at a time when trust in institutions is already low; you already hear some people predicting that there may not be an election with uncontested results (in the USA) ever again. If we s…

Hate to say it, but deepfake audio and video are already pretty convincing (though post processing is needed)

There was a viral video last week of the "Ghost of Kiev" that looked like real war footage. It ended up being from a 2013 video game!

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Ghost_of_Kyiv#Morale

Re: YouTube suspends The Hill for playing clip of Trump denying election results

#165
post #3

Right on. If you are dumb enough to censor, you can only censor content and the frame you are looking through doesn't make any difference. Imagine in a totalitarian regime, you would like to inform people on system critical thoughts others have been executed for, so people can avoid them.

That's the purpose of newspeak and doublethink. To ultimately communicate by their absence from official channels the list of things that cannot be said. Of course, Russia has has more experience with this than anyone. But as a sibling post says, they've reached the point where plenty just enjoy killing, and the west could too, at some point.

It scares me, that some of us actually enjoy the killing and the carnage.

The problem of newspeak is that most of us don't see it, until it's too late. When we feed the machine with our fears, it will cut us off.

Most of us still like each other.

Re: YouTube suspends The Hill for playing clip of Trump denying election results

#166
post #156
post #115

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Hillary Clinton wasn't making those claims via deranged tweets and speeches from the Oval Office in her position as President of the United States. A private citizen on one hand versus the leader of a country with the power of the press and an angry, violent mob on the other. One person's complaints versus a firehose of misinformation, lies and possibly Russian-backed agitprop being spread by the leader of the countr…

That applies to Trump's response to the 2020 election too. He's a private citizen now, so his tweet equivalents and lawsuits don't matter

Yes. I actually don't agree with Youtube's policy here at all, or with continuing to deplatform Trump (as long as he follows the rules like everyone else.) I did agree with his initial banning, because of the damage he could do in a position of power in a critical moment of political transition. But his views are basically mainstream in the Republican Party now, Jan. 6 was a failure, Biden was elected and the promised rural uprising and reckoning didn't happen, so the damage is probably done.

It's the false equivalence I'm objecting to. It seems clear to me that one side went off the deep end further than the other in this case.

Re: YouTube suspends The Hill for playing clip of Trump denying election results

#167

Earlier quoted context omitted.

WWII happened despite people being afraid of it happening. Could you elaborate on your point?

The factors in World War 2 were much different, public sentiment didn’t matter. Nazis would have taken Poland in 1939 and pursue the Soviet Union sooner, it was inevitably a World War. World War 1 was editable. World War 1 was very much avoidable. Time and time again World War 1 has been called unnecessary because the original dispute that triggered the conflict was limited.

World War Two didn’t happen in isolation and was a direct result of unresolved and newly created issues at the end of the First World War.

Re: YouTube suspends The Hill for playing clip of Trump denying election results

#168

Earlier quoted context omitted.

John Mearsheimer is now "Russian propaganda"? LOL

Yup. Literal verbatim Kremlin narrative and framing. Not sure what's LOL about that. Have you never seen this before?

Isn't the Kremlin's framing that zelensky is a Nazi?

Re: YouTube suspends The Hill for playing clip of Trump denying election results

#169

I’m becoming more convinced that the future I’ve been planning simply won’t be possible in the decades to come. The world is scarcely recognizable. And having experienced nothing but peace and prosperity makes me feel woefully unprepared. The WEIRD world is becoming increasingly more authoritarian. I’m already detached from real conflict and scarcity, knowing nothing but peace and prosperity, and the TikTok generatio…

what were you planning?

Re: YouTube suspends The Hill for playing clip of Trump denying election results

#170

This is what "private companies can do what they like" results in.

"Private companies can do what they like" should only apply to companies that are not monopolies.

Due to network effects there is no legitimate competition to YouTube, so YouTube needs to be regulated as a monopoly (unless maybe TikTok has started hosting longform videos instead of just people doing stupid dances).

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