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More than 1M fewer students are in college, the lowest numbers in 50 years

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Re: More than 1M fewer students are in college, the lowest numbers in 50 years

#161

Post by jrsj »

ChicagoDave wrote: post #28

I have 3 college-aged kids and one nearly there. Their universal concern is the cost. It has become prohibitive. Colleges assumed the trend of charging $25k to $50k per year would be sustainable. They were dead wrong, especially given the horrendously predatory loans backed by the government and barred from bankruptcy. If we fix the college financial system, enrollment would likely skyrocket.

I honestly think keeping people in debt so they have to work more & for longer is considered a feature of the system by a majority of the people running it

Re: More than 1M fewer students are in college, the lowest numbers in 50 years

#162

Post by xhkkffbf »

ChicagoDave wrote: post #28

I have 3 college-aged kids and one nearly there. Their universal concern is the cost. It has become prohibitive. Colleges assumed the trend of charging $25k to $50k per year would be sustainable. They were dead wrong, especially given the horrendously predatory loans backed by the government and barred from bankruptcy. If we fix the college financial system, enrollment would likely skyrocket.

Absolutely true. And many of the degrees don't lead anywhere. The smart kids are the ones that aren't in college.

When I hire now, I always look for kids who are willing to teach themselves and learn from all of the good sources on the Internet. Places like Coursera, Udemy or even YouTube. They're reasonably priced.

Re: More than 1M fewer students are in college, the lowest numbers in 50 years

#163

Post by jonnycomputer »

_fat_santa wrote: post #95
ChicagoDave wrote: post #28

I have 3 college-aged kids and one nearly there. Their universal concern is the cost. It has become prohibitive. Colleges assumed the trend of charging $25k to $50k per year would be sustainable. They were dead wrong, especially given the horrendously predatory loans backed by the government and barred from bankruptcy. If we fix the college financial system, enrollment would likely skyrocket.

Thought it's not as glamorous as a 4 year college experience, I highly suggest going to a Community College for the first two years and then transferring to a state school. I did this and through I resented it at the time, I existed college with around $30k in student debt versus my friends that all has something in range of ($40k to $80k). IMO 30k in student debt is very manageable, currently have the thing paid dow…

I did community college, got a guaranteed transfer agreement to UC Davis, but was admitted to UCLA and so went there instead.

The quality of teaching at the community college often exceeded that at UCLA. Researchers are not necessarily the best teachers.

In my department there were a number of community college transfer students. They were almost always the most ambitious, and ended up going the furthest. YMMV.

Re: More than 1M fewer students are in college, the lowest numbers in 50 years

#164

Post by ryanmarsh »

My oldest daughter is in pre-nursing and is applying to nursing school at her university for next year. I know of no other way to get into nursing but though a typical university. Thankfully the state of Texas is paying for her education due to the Hazelwood Act.

My middle daughter wants to study art (she is an artist and sees a future in it for herself). My benefits will expire by the time she applies to college. So she’s not likely to end up at a four year university.

I have a hunch my youngest daughter may want to study computer science. Unless the cost of school changes I may put together a program for her myself mixed with online schools and traditional CS resources.

Re: More than 1M fewer students are in college, the lowest numbers in 50 years

#165

Post by endisneigh »

noasaservice wrote: post #125

1. School loans are not dismissable in bankruptcy. This is only shared with criminal monetary punishments. 2. Interest is charged, which is abhorrent at any rate. Especially the 8%. 3. PPP "loans" to the tune of almost 1t$.. which were forgiven. Just run a few sham job ads for software engineers at 10$/hr and NobOdy wAnTS tO wOrk! 4. University doesn't really provide job skills. They allude to, but then say they dont…

I love how the solution is always to do tech. What about the other things?

Re: More than 1M fewer students are in college, the lowest numbers in 50 years

#166

Post by VampireWillow »

bagacrap wrote: post #71
ChicagoDave wrote: post #28

I have 3 college-aged kids and one nearly there. Their universal concern is the cost. It has become prohibitive. Colleges assumed the trend of charging $25k to $50k per year would be sustainable. They were dead wrong, especially given the horrendously predatory loans backed by the government and barred from bankruptcy. If we fix the college financial system, enrollment would likely skyrocket.

The loans are exactly why the colleges were able to continue jacking up the prices. As with homes, people will pay as much as institutions are willing to loan them. In both cases the currently low interest rates allow the loan principal to be much higher (given that folks calculate cost based on recurring payments). If you remove the student loan system then tuition would become cheaper. However that does unfairly im…

Here in Canada the government simply dictates to universities how much they can charge. It seems beyond insane to me to do it any other way, seeing as our entire societies are dependent on getting enough people educated to perpetuate a service economy.

To be fair, this kind of means that universities should be completely public. And although they are for all intents and purposes, in theory they are still non-governmental entities. And that's strange as well.

Re: More than 1M fewer students are in college, the lowest numbers in 50 years

#167

Post by bart_spoon »

ChicagoDave wrote: post #127
ars wrote: post #47

Earlier quoted context omitted.

That's what the vaccine is for. And if you're really concerned about spring break, then add all these restrictions 2 weeks before spring break.

Do you not understand “vulnerable population”? There are actually people that the vaccines won’t help. They are immunocompromised. They can only be protected by high vaccination rates and zero exposure to Covid.

Yes, but those people will never stop being vulnerable. Covid is never going away, period. Anyone saying otherwise has been living in a fantasy for nearly 2 years at this point. So completely distorting society to ensure zero Covid exposure has not only proven itself to be relatively ineffective, but it would be required to be done forever.

The situation will be no different in a year or 5 years than it is from now, so continuing to argue for societal shutdown is completely untenable.

Re: More than 1M fewer students are in college, the lowest numbers in 50 years

#168

Post by contravariant »

xyzzy_plugh wrote: post #108

This is nearly a strictly American problem. Much of the rest of the world has realized that society requires and is capable of supporting advanced education for all -- after all we want humanity to be advancing , right? America is still stuck in this alternate universe where it's a great privilege to have the opportunity to learn, which is of course true to some extent, but they really put it on a pedestal there. Com…

Some of the 'let's saddle students with debt' vibe seems to have pollinated the Netherlands, though for reasons that I applaud but don't quite understand pretty much everyone now considers it a bad idea.

Re: More than 1M fewer students are in college, the lowest numbers in 50 years

#169

Post by VikingCoder »

bagacrap wrote: post #71
ChicagoDave wrote: post #28

I have 3 college-aged kids and one nearly there. Their universal concern is the cost. It has become prohibitive. Colleges assumed the trend of charging $25k to $50k per year would be sustainable. They were dead wrong, especially given the horrendously predatory loans backed by the government and barred from bankruptcy. If we fix the college financial system, enrollment would likely skyrocket.

The loans are exactly why the colleges were able to continue jacking up the prices. As with homes, people will pay as much as institutions are willing to loan them. In both cases the currently low interest rates allow the loan principal to be much higher (given that folks calculate cost based on recurring payments). If you remove the student loan system then tuition would become cheaper. However that does unfairly im…

Here's what I don't get -

Where the hell is the money _going_?

Are Colleges and Universities pocketing the money? Are they publicly traded and distributing dividends? Are they building rockets?

I know some of it goes back to financial aid, and some goes to football coaches...

But we're talking about so much freaking money, and I just can't visualize where it's going.

Re: More than 1M fewer students are in college, the lowest numbers in 50 years

#170

Post by epistasis »

HWR_14 wrote: post #141
epistasis wrote: post #56

Earlier quoted context omitted.

I've heard tales of people with interest rates of 7%+ on student loans, and the official rates are not incredibly low either: https://studentaid.gov/understand-aid/types/loans/interest-r... Any loan that is charging 6.28% interest and also cant be discharged by bankruptcy is just usury with current interest rates.

> Any loan that is charging 6.28% interest and also cant be discharged by bankruptcy The interest rates are high because so few loans can be discharged by bankruptcy. You can refinance your mortgage with anyone. Far few companies will refinance your student loans. Meanwhile, it makes prefect sense that bankruptcy cannot discharge student loans. Otherwise, every single student would have crappy credit from 21-28 and n…

If "makes perfect sense" solution to college is usury, we have serious problems with our higher education system.

It's time to start funding these schools adequately so that they do not immiserate everyone except those with wealthy parents. It's the opposite of a meritocracy.

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