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Will Cloudflare R2 Win Customers from Amazon S3?

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Re: Will Cloudflare R2 Win Customers from Amazon S3?

#161

Post by nightpool »

sam0x17 wrote: post #83
heipei wrote: post #53

Slight miscalculation which should have been obvious: "For example, Backblaze B2’s free operations threshold is capped at 2,500 a day, and if R2 simply let you make a GetObject request every second of every day, that would be something like 86,400 FREE daily Gets, which would cost ~$335 daily on B2 or $122,000 a year." Backblaze B2 Class B operations are priced at $0.004 per 10k operations which the author did not ta…

I wonder how this compares with Wasabi. I was very bullish on them a few years ago.

Wasabi has the most horrendous reliability record of any provider I've ever worked with. Uploads will be broken for days at a time with no status posted, downloads will flake, it's just not a competitive solution for consumer-facing storage.

Re: Will Cloudflare R2 Win Customers from Amazon S3?

#162

Post by electroly »

kondro wrote: post #159
res0nat0r wrote: post #9

The lower egress fees are super nice, but until someone can beat the Glacier Deep Archive pricing @ $0.00099 per GB I'm going to keep using that.

Great pricing, but a 48 hour retrieval window sucks for everything except things you basically never need to retrieve. I'm not even talking backups here, if you need a backup at all, you probably need it ASAP. This is a governance product.

You do have the option for 12 hour retrieval; 48 hour is the discount restore option. We keep the latest backup in the Standard tier and use GDA for older backups.

Re: Will Cloudflare R2 Win Customers from Amazon S3?

#163

Post by nightpool »

luhn wrote: post #148

This article touches on the one major unanswered question I have about R2: CloudFlare's CDN ToS make it clear CF is meant to host websites and APIs, not content downloads [1]. Does R2 have similar ToS? It's reasonable that CF doesn't want R2 customers that use 500MB of paid storage and 500TB of free bandwidth, so what is acceptable use? [1] The Services are offered primarily as a platform to cache and serve web pages…

Cloudflare's CEO (eastdakota) has said publicly that that section doesn't apply to R2 and that they'll update their TOS to clarify: https://news.ycombinator.com/item?id=28682885

Re: Will Cloudflare R2 Win Customers from Amazon S3?

#164

Post by Smerity »

Eugr wrote: post #149
Smerity wrote: post #146

Earlier quoted context omitted.

You're right, I misread it and now can't edit my comment. This puts it all in quite a similar position to Wasabi[1] who have a 1:1 storage:transfer ratio per month and a 90 day minimum storage duration as well. In fact, their price per terabyte is almost exactly the same ($5.99 for Wasabi vs $6 for Rstor). It's a shame as I love aspects of this type of storage service, even with the caveats, but they're not useful if…

That's interesting... When talking to their reps I mentioned Wasabi and asked if they have similar limitations and they said "no". I wonder if enterprise customers are treated differently?

From the pricing page I linked to[1]:

> There are no charges for outbound data transfer when using a dedicated network connection to the RSTOR network and direct peering is established. These connections are charged separately. To find out more please contact us.

I would imagine for enterprise customers you might either be using direct peering / similar or they're able to charge based upon ballpark bandwidth usage. Otherwise I'm unsure as it does seem quite in line with Wasabi otherwise.

[1]: https://console.rstor.space/pricing

Re: Will Cloudflare R2 Win Customers from Amazon S3?

#165

Post by rsync »

jacurtis wrote: post #121
greg-m wrote: post #98

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Hey, R2 PM here - there's no question that the product will have 0 egress charges, regardless of destination. For archival use-cases, you do still pay us for data storage. We're referring to not charging for operations for infrequent access - we'll likely drop the stored data charge down too, eventually, but the current pricing is complex enough.

Ok, thanks for the clarification. After I wrote that statement about Infrequent Access, I was thinking about it more and realized that you probably pay for storage but simply have no access fees. In other words you don't really distinguish between storage tiers. I think that is good. S3 technically has 7 storage tiers, with all permutations of limited availability zone, reduced redundancy, infrequent access, archival…

"I am an AWS administrator/architect for work so we are always trying to weigh pros and cons."

Very informal survey ... but I wonder if you are familiar with the 'rclone' tool:

https://rclone.org/

... just curious ...

Re: Will Cloudflare R2 Win Customers from Amazon S3?

#166

Post by stavros »

greg-m wrote: post #98
jacurtis wrote: post #47

Earlier quoted context omitted.

According to their press release it says: > That's why Cloudflare plans to eliminate egress fees, deliver object storage that is at least 10% cheaper than S3, and make infrequent access completely free for customers A few elements of concern. It says they "plan to", so we don't know if this is near term or some moonshot type of goal. It also states earlier in the press release that the free egress frees are offered v…

Hey, R2 PM here - there's no question that the product will have 0 egress charges, regardless of destination. For archival use-cases, you do still pay us for data storage. We're referring to not charging for operations for infrequent access - we'll likely drop the stored data charge down too, eventually, but the current pricing is complex enough.

This is rather offtopic, but what's with your documentation "code" fields being uncopiable? Those are the exact fields I need to copy!

E.g. https://developers.cloudflare.com/cloudflare-one/connections...

Re: Will Cloudflare R2 Win Customers from Amazon S3?

#168

Post by SiVal »

nvahalik wrote: post #144
mattjaynes wrote: post #139

Earlier quoted context omitted.

As mentioned in another comment, don't forget to consider B2's weekly 2 hour maintenance windows during the US work day: https://www.backblaze.com/scheduled-maintenance.html

This was the reason we ended up moving away from B2. It may be durable but their storage isn't a drop-in replacement for S3 or similar products. They are really an S3-compatible target for backup softwares.

This would be fine for an automated system that could schedule requests or could fail, wait 30min, and try again. But it would be unusable by a human working interactively. You would constantly get complaints and monitor warnings that your "system is down".

I don't mind services that cut price dramatically in exchange for only supporting some (not all) use cases. That can be a very attractive offer, but does Backblaze explicitly position B2 for non-interactive use cases?

Re: Will Cloudflare R2 Win Customers from Amazon S3?

#169

Post by selcuka »

stavros wrote: post #166
greg-m wrote: post #98

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Hey, R2 PM here - there's no question that the product will have 0 egress charges, regardless of destination. For archival use-cases, you do still pay us for data storage. We're referring to not charging for operations for infrequent access - we'll likely drop the stored data charge down too, eventually, but the current pricing is complex enough.

This is rather offtopic, but what's with your documentation "code" fields being uncopiable? Those are the exact fields I need to copy! E.g. https://developers.cloudflare.com/cloudflare-one/connections...

Wow, that's really weird. They seem to have specifically disabled it. You can use the userscript I just made for myself [1] as a workaround for now.

https://gist.github.com/selcuk/90ce1ce8b8d46c869efd6da24cde1...

Re: Will Cloudflare R2 Win Customers from Amazon S3?

#170

Post by stavros »

selcuka wrote: post #169
stavros wrote: post #166

Earlier quoted context omitted.

This is rather offtopic, but what's with your documentation "code" fields being uncopiable? Those are the exact fields I need to copy! E.g. https://developers.cloudflare.com/cloudflare-one/connections...

Wow, that's really weird. They seem to have specifically disabled it. You can use the userscript I just made for myself [1] as a workaround for now. https://gist.github.com/selcuk/90ce1ce8b8d46c869efd6da24cde1...

It is really weird, yeah, expecially since the examples seem to be meant to be copied. Thanks for the script!
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