Lemmy – A link aggregator for the fediverse • Hacker News Board

Re: Lemmy – A link aggregator for the fediverse

#161

Post by reginold » Wed, Sep 08, 2021, 2:58 PM UTC

Open-Sourcery wrote: post #150

kixiQu wrote: post #147

Earlier quoted context omitted.

In this case it's really about the burden of community moderation. It's a fairly impotent restriction, and yet it serves the social function of discouraging a certain sort from making Lemmy their home. Most Reddit alternatives become really scummy because they attract the people (not "the kind of people", the literal individuals) who get banned from Reddit for pushing anti-Semitism, racism, and misogyny past what Red…

But we aren't talking about a single centralised community. This is a part of the fediverse (decentralised) and where anyone can create a server to host their own community. If the lemmy team wants to have their slur filter for their "official" instance, they are free to. However, part of being decentralised is to give people the power to run their communities as they see fit and so they shouldn't be beholden to the…

Yeah exactly. I would expect a tool like Lemmy to acknowledge that slur lists are a thing, make them easy to modify by admins, and make them exposed and easy to reference by users. Join Server / Policies / Word block list. Put it up front and center.

Re: Lemmy – A link aggregator for the fediverse

#162

Post by reginold » Wed, Sep 08, 2021, 3:01 PM UTC

lewiscollard wrote: post #156

account42 wrote: post #114

Earlier quoted context omitted.

> use a fork [5] if you can’t stand the slur filter I'd rather not support the ecosystem at all if they pull stunts like this.

If it was possible to write an effective slur filter, I would not find it completely objectionable. Not because that would be useful to stop people saying completely shit-headed things if they really wanted to (I strongly suspect you could get the entirety of Mein Kampf past that filter), but as a "people who use these words are not welcome" signal, which definitely has some value. As it is, it's bashing the problem…

Writing an effective slur filter is undesirable. No one can stop people saying completely shit headed things. For one, people just work around it. And more importantly for every shit headed thing you restrict you also cut out someone else, even if it's just because of their perception of constraints. The mind has a funny way of editing thought before it even arrives. We can't afford this anymore in our online spaces.

Re: Lemmy – A link aggregator for the fediverse

#163

Post by SerLava » Wed, Sep 08, 2021, 3:08 PM UTC

kypro wrote: post #115

enumjorge wrote: post #42

Earlier quoted context omitted.

By and large what “isn’t allowed” on major tech platforms is racist, xenophobic, and homophobic content. You can still find a lot of non-PC, fringe content on YouTube, Facebook, Twitter and Reddit. I get that censorship in major tech platforms is problematic, but the sense of martyrdom in comments like yours feels a little overwrought.

Are you even paying attention? This isn't true. You can be censored from social media for all sorts these days. This last year we had a UK media organisation banned from YouTube for questioning the UK COVID response. People in the US are no longer allowed to question the legitimacy of their elections on most social media platforms. Even US media outlets like the NYPost were censored for running stories Twitter didn't…

>I mean even the US president was banned for "violence" despite asking rioters to go home

So if I was to try to get you killed on this forum but then my next post said "violence is bad though" would that make the first part go away?

Re: Lemmy – A link aggregator for the fediverse

#164

Post by SerLava » Wed, Sep 08, 2021, 3:11 PM UTC

radicalriddler wrote: post #75

I would define myself as pretty progressive, but Reddit's been absolutely dog** due to all the anti-capitalist, populist rhetoric. Every post seems to be filled with comments these days of "eat the rich". Like, you'll have a gif of a dude petting a dog, and then in the comments, they'll be like, "Bro, you're financially oppressing this dog and that's why it's forced to be pet by you" (Hyperbole, but I've seen some cr…

Reddit banned the main catch-all leftist subs, and all of the accounts that posted there are now not allowed to congregate in a subreddit or it will be banned, and they can't create subreddits, regardless of what they actually posted

Re: Lemmy – A link aggregator for the fediverse

#165

Post by SerLava » Wed, Sep 08, 2021, 3:18 PM UTC

lmm wrote: post #34

LeoPanthera wrote: post #4

Earlier quoted context omitted.

You're being rapidly downvoted but to play devil's advocate I wonder if you could explain why you think "American leftism" is "disturbing".

I'm not the person you replied to, but today's American leftism practically mandates a belief in blank-slatism on race, gender, and IQ, to an extent that’s inimical to sincere science in those areas. And that ends up having a wide impact on science generally and policy generally.

Oh they don't like it when you repeatedly point out your favorite very sincere scientific facts collected by sincere scientists with the best calipers?

Re: Lemmy – A link aggregator for the fediverse

#166

Post by Igelau » Wed, Sep 08, 2021, 3:26 PM UTC

seszett wrote: post #69

unraveller wrote: post #39

The front-end is still buggy and needs a designer's touch. And the real-time aspects wear thin at scale with all the notifications in a mismatch of languages showing up in the main feed. Lemmy is practically unusable without a personal feed filter, it seems that of the new reddit alternatives only retalk_[1] want to get this right. If you do decide to run an instance of lemmy be sure to nuke the absurd word filter -…

Weird, so you can't talk about Main Coons on Lemmy? Or even say that your train was delayed in French. That list seems very Americanocentric.

> That list seems very Americanocentric.

Indeed it is. There are comments here and there in the GitHub issues where the devs defend the filter as being targeted at making it harder for "the [American] right wing" to use the platform.

It's naïve, and they don't want to talk about it.

Re: Lemmy – A link aggregator for the fediverse

#167

Post by candreasen » Wed, Sep 08, 2021, 3:26 PM UTC

reginold wrote: post #161

Open-Sourcery wrote: post #150

Earlier quoted context omitted.

But we aren't talking about a single centralised community. This is a part of the fediverse (decentralised) and where anyone can create a server to host their own community. If the lemmy team wants to have their slur filter for their "official" instance, they are free to. However, part of being decentralised is to give people the power to run their communities as they see fit and so they shouldn't be beholden to the…

Yeah exactly. I would expect a tool like Lemmy to acknowledge that slur lists are a thing, make them easy to modify by admins, and make them exposed and easy to reference by users. Join Server / Policies / Word block list. Put it up front and center.

seems to be the direction they're heading https://github.com/LemmyNet/lemmy/issues/1773

Re: Lemmy – A link aggregator for the fediverse

#168

Post by SerLava » Wed, Sep 08, 2021, 3:26 PM UTC

jim-jim-jim wrote: post #32

LeoPanthera wrote: post #4

Earlier quoted context omitted.

You're being rapidly downvoted but to play devil's advocate I wonder if you could explain why you think "American leftism" is "disturbing".

Somebody can correct me if my timeline is off, but I think Lemmy was largely embraced by exiled Chapos, much like Voat became a Groyper den. I don't think it's even worth considering such a community left-wing. They're more like an anime poisoned grooming circle that embraced red aesthetics for shock value. However pathetic that sounds though, I'm the bigger loser for even being familiar with this nonsense.

Sure I'll bite, none of what you said is true, in either timing or circumstances.

-They didn't go to Lemmygrad

-No definition of leftism would exclude the very leftist people who went over to Hexbear, the Lemmy instance for exiled r/Chapotraphouse posters

-they don't seem to be particularly into anime

-they are very into left politics, socialism, trade unionism, anti-imperialism, and so on. So like they are left-wing

Re: Lemmy – A link aggregator for the fediverse

#169

Post by ddingus » Wed, Sep 08, 2021, 3:33 PM UTC

type0 wrote: post #129

ddingus wrote: post #93

Earlier quoted context omitted.

I did not say it was welcome. Learning how to talk with others and understand one another better is real work. I did say it was worth doing, more or less.

> I did say it was worth doing it is not worth anyone's time

Generally speaking, that is true until it isn't.

People experiencing hard times is one catalyst.

Another is loneliness.

There are others.

Re: Lemmy – A link aggregator for the fediverse

#170

Post by hjek » Wed, Sep 08, 2021, 3:33 PM UTC

seszett wrote: post #69

unraveller wrote: post #39

The front-end is still buggy and needs a designer's touch. And the real-time aspects wear thin at scale with all the notifications in a mismatch of languages showing up in the main feed. Lemmy is practically unusable without a personal feed filter, it seems that of the new reddit alternatives only retalk_[1] want to get this right. If you do decide to run an instance of lemmy be sure to nuke the absurd word filter -…

Weird, so you can't talk about Main Coons on Lemmy? Or even say that your train was delayed in French. That list seems very Americanocentric.

It's the Scunthorpe problem all over again. It's like Youtube flagging that chess channel for hate speech[0] (perhaps because words like "black", "white" and "attack" were used a lot). It will annoy people who're accidentally caught by the filter, and people who want to get past it will figure out a way anyway (by look-alike character substitution or whatever). I think it's the wrong approach to that problem.

[0]: https://news.ycombinator.com/item?id=27914261