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Tech giants join call for funding U.S. chip production

reuters.com

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Re: Tech giants join call for funding U.S. chip production

#161

Post by dang »

lsllc wrote: post #89
dang wrote: post #66

Earlier quoted context omitted.

On HN, it only counts as a dupe if the previous submission got significant attention. This is in the FAQ: https://news.ycombinator.com/newsfaq.html . Lots of past explanation here too: https://hn.algolia.com/?dateRange=all&page=0&prefix=true&que...

Didn't know that! I always search for links before submitting and many times I've seen a previous submission with little to no traction (and then subsequently not posted it to avoid dupes).

Thanks for searching first! If it's a good article and hasn't had attention yet, we certainly hope you will post it - that's why we allow reposts, to give good articles multiple cracks at the bat.

Re: Tech giants join call for funding U.S. chip production

#162

Post by alexgmcm »

century19 wrote: post #9

Couldn't this be a positive long term benefit of Corona? A push back against globalisation and more domestic production in each region of the world.

Isn't it a net benefit to everyone if each country pursues its comparative advantage though?

I don't see why becoming some sort of Juche state would help anyone.

Re: Tech giants join call for funding U.S. chip production

#163

Post by dang »

dhduusheff wrote: post #150

Couldn't disagree more. We throw tons of money at people who contribute nothing, I've no problem seeing that much money allocated to something worthwhile even if the profits aren't public. The value is the security and the supply chain, it's still more then what we get for helping dregs.

Please don't use HN for ideological battle and please don't create accounts to break the site guidelines.

https://news.ycombinator.com/newsguidelines.html

We detached this subthread from https://news.ycombinator.com/item?id=27122390.

Re: Tech giants join call for funding U.S. chip production

#164

Post by Nasrudith »

XGeneral wrote: post #88
century19 wrote: post #9

Couldn't this be a positive long term benefit of Corona? A push back against globalisation and more domestic production in each region of the world.

> A push back against globalisation and more domestic production in each region of the world. There are many countries that have always wanted to be self reliant but the powers be can't allow it. Coz it's sets a bad example that countries can exist without certain giants. I don't think they are about to allow that

For damned good reason. "Self reliant" countries tend to behave like complete assholes internationally even by the standards of Realpolitik. North Korea is one of the most Autarkous nations on earth.

The "victimized by a conspiracy" anthromorphization is also deeply wrong. They cannot be oppressed - they do not have rights.

Governments are fundamentally made of coercion. Without it they are an empty pile of words, a rules card for poker when the deck is being used for blackjack or building houses of cards. The coercion may be used to support rights like "not being murdered" but granting it rights to further human rights is like trying to increase a number by multiplying a negative number by a grearer than one positive number.

To sum it up if you apply the "corporation as a sociopath" conception governments are basically so alien to be cthulu. Corporations are at least made of people essentially, at least until the first AI run no human owner corporation is founded.

Re: Tech giants join call for funding U.S. chip production

#165

Post by spaced-out »

paganel wrote: post #152
robbrown451 wrote: post #31

To all those saying that those companies can afford it themselves, remember that there are reasons they don't. The economics don't add up. Companies tend to do what is in their economic interest to do. Something like this can change the economics, which could be a good thing.

> Companies tend to do what is in their economic interest to do It will be in their economic interest when the PLA will show up at TSMC's door. Of course, that won't probably happen in the next few quarters, so on that you are correct, it's not in their short economic interest. What these companies are basically doing is asking the US government to subsidise the costs incurred by geo-politics.

>It will be in their economic interest when the PLA will show up at TSMC's door.

Not necessarily, maybe those companies can just make a deal with the CCP to keep access to TSMC's fabs.

Re: Tech giants join call for funding U.S. chip production

#166

Post by dang »

axiosgunnar wrote: post #149

@dang, > All: this thread got a flash flood of angry-predictable-obvious comments. Please don't post those! They're really bad for this site. The issue with such points isn't that they're wrong, it's that they're not interesting. Nothing predictable and obvious is. We want interesting conversation here, and that comes from curiosity. If you're feeling agitation rather than curiosity, please wait until that polarity f…

> What "flash flood of angry-predictable-obvious comments" are you talking about?

They're collapsed at the bottom of the page now. Before that, they were the page.

Downweighting low-quality generic subthreads is one of the key things moderators do here to try to improve the quality of the threads—which unfortunately tends to go to the lowest common denominator by default.

p.s. "@dang" is a no-op. I only saw your question by accident. Please send such questions to hn@ycombinator.com instead (see https://news.ycombinator.com/newsguidelines.html).

Re: Tech giants join call for funding U.S. chip production

#167

Post by fighterpilot »

dhduusheff wrote: post #160
fighterpilot wrote: post #156

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Then stop giving money to dregs. Yet more government excess is not the solution, even if this case of spending is slightly less bad than most of the others.

I would if the money wasn't taken forcefully through my taxes. It's hardly excess for one of the most important assets a country can have right now and it beats the hell out of seeing the money go to yet another useless social welfare program for fuckups.

Both of those things are wasteful and harmful government excesses. Handouts just take the cake between the two

Re: Tech giants join call for funding U.S. chip production

#168

Post by dang »

qntty wrote: post #154
axiosgunnar wrote: post #149

@dang, > All: this thread got a flash flood of angry-predictable-obvious comments. Please don't post those! They're really bad for this site. The issue with such points isn't that they're wrong, it's that they're not interesting. Nothing predictable and obvious is. We want interesting conversation here, and that comes from curiosity. If you're feeling agitation rather than curiosity, please wait until that polarity f…

The ideology of the tech elite is to see themselves as cool, detached, rational observers of the world. So when people feel regular human emotions in response to things, they need some way to deride them for it.

That's a misunderstanding. We're just trying to have an internet forum that doesn't suck in predictable ways. People come to HN for relief from that, in the hope of finding something that's a little more interesting. If they come here and see people yelling the same angry, recycled points over and over again, that's obviously not interesting. It isn't because of emotion per se, and the idea that the people operating this site have any sort of anti-emotional ideology is far off base! I don't identify with that any more than I imagine you do.

Re: Tech giants join call for funding U.S. chip production

#169

Post by coliveira »

azinman2 wrote: post #158
ohashi wrote: post #99

If the US tax payer gets a significant stake in the chip fab venture, I would be OK with this. We want to secure national security via chip manufacturing and you want billions of dollars? Give us some upside. I don't want to hear it creates jobs, it generates blah blah blah, a real equity stake and possibly repayment of the capital. Creating jobs should be a happy by-product of subsidizing an industry that is probabl…

Government subsidies protecting industries rarely pay off in a peaceful world to the entire country. I personally get nothing out of Chevron getting tax breaks. However, if those incentives meant supply was harder to disrupt, and in a war time the country has better access to fuel, then it does seem like a worthwhile trade off. In this case, the risk is that China literally takes over (one way or another) the vast ma…

The ones who should be very worried and willing to pay for this "protection" are exactly the huge companies that have a lot in stake. It is completely absurd that they still want to reach for the taxpayer to pay for protecting their monopolies.

Re: Tech giants join call for funding U.S. chip production

#170

Post by colinmhayes »

century19 wrote: post #9

Couldn't this be a positive long term benefit of Corona? A push back against globalisation and more domestic production in each region of the world.

Globalization is a good thing. It is directly responsible for the almost complete elimination of global poverty.
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