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Israeli study finds 94% drop in symptomatic Covid-19 cases with Pfizer vaccine

reuters.com

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Re: Israeli study finds 94% drop in symptomatic Covid-19 cases with Pfizer vaccine

#161

Post by dm319 »

jansan wrote: post #10

The Google COVID-19 statistics for Israel show that cases and deaths are declining, but not at a faster rate than elsewhere in the world. Reported deaths lag behind sometimes for weeks and new deaths were caused by infections weeks ago, so vaccination may not have much effect on deaths, yet. But the number of positive tests should have gone down considerably with 50% of the population vaccinated. Are all these aympto…

The data for age group specific data is available freely in the UK. I did a quick analysis in R, and even though all over 75 and most over 70 have been vaccinated, I didn't see any increase in the rate of descent compared to other age groups. So not quite having a public health impact in overall numbers just yet (it's the lockdown that is doing that), but I have no doubt it will eventually. I wonder if part of it is that people are more willing to abide by the rules, now that we have possible way out of it.

Re: Israeli study finds 94% drop in symptomatic Covid-19 cases with Pfizer vaccine

#162

Post by throwaway_Ie8th »

VBprogrammer wrote: post #151
throwaway_Ie8th wrote: post #147

There is a terrifying whistleblower interview from a Berlin elderly home, about the events after the vaccination. Of 31 patients who were vaccinated 8 died within 14 day, another 11 are in decline. https://2020news.de/en/whistleblower-from-berlin-nursing-hom... Similar reports came out of Sweden and other countries, after the first report. https://2020news.de/auch-in-schweden-sterben-die-alten-mensc... There are many…

This is most likely going to get flagged into oblivion, for those who come later it's a list of supposed cases where there are mass deaths after the COVID-19 vaccination. Of course 15 million people have received the vaccine in the UK, so any sudden deaths even at the level of 0.01% would be quite noticeable by now.

The deaths are classified as Covid-19, so good luck figuring this out.

Sometimes you don't need statistics. 8 deaths on 31, similar figures from other locations are sufficiently obvious.

Re: Israeli study finds 94% drop in symptomatic Covid-19 cases with Pfizer vaccine

#163

Post by kalleboo »

peteretep wrote: post #62
scrollaway wrote: post #24

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Yes I agree, the UK is also doing very well considering. It just baffles me that no other country is even in the same category as israel in terms of readiness, despite nine months to prepare.

There’s just not that many countries as rich as Israel who could be, though? UK and UAE are doing pretty well. All EU countries are subservient to the EU on this, America and Canada are geographically huge and of course America has Covid and medicine as an outsized political issue, Oz and NZ don’t need to rush it ... I guess maybe the Asian tigers are lagging a bit here?

The Asian countries also don't appear to really need to rush it

Re: Israeli study finds 94% drop in symptomatic Covid-19 cases with Pfizer vaccine

#164

Post by VBprogrammer »

hef19898 wrote: post #124
readittwice wrote: post #64

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Absolutely, however the EU's politicians are playing dumb and claim that they couldn't foresee that mass production could be a problem. The EU ordered too late and simply not enough. Now they are trying to blame everyone else for their failure.

They ordered one slightly later than the UK and the US (let's ignore Israel which is basically a large scale trial). The main difference: the EU used normal certification processes, just sped them up considerably. The UK and US used emergncy certification. The volumes the EU ordered initially were absolutely sufficient with 4+ doses per EU inhabitant. Manufacturing capacities were sufficient for that as well. It all…

I think that's a very charitable interpretation of events. Realistically the EU negotiated on behalf of the 27 member countries to try to get the best deal on price, and perhaps more importantly, to avoid the inevitable tensions which would follow from one member country securing more than another member country. This process slowed down the negotiation process.

Whether there is any truth in the EUs certification being conducted differently is a bit moot given they have approved the same vaccines based on the same trial data.

Re: Israeli study finds 94% drop in symptomatic Covid-19 cases with Pfizer vaccine

#165

Post by jacquesm »

dageshi wrote: post #154
jacquesm wrote: post #140

Earlier quoted context omitted.

And pays more than 10x as much per dose.

And that really doesn't matter compared to the cost of locking down a country and the lives saved by quicker vaccination.

Agreed. But given the lack of production this was an easier deal to make for Israel than for say all of the EU, no matter what the price, those vaccines are not available in that quantity.

Re: Israeli study finds 94% drop in symptomatic Covid-19 cases with Pfizer vaccine

#166

Post by kharak »

scrollaway wrote: post #57
kharak wrote: post #35

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Isn't the vaccination distribution a zero sum game between nation states? Supply is limited. Some countries will get it sooner than others. Europe lost the bit against several other powers. Not to my surprise, I must say.

Is it zero sum? People keep saying that but if you give the suppliers more money, that allows them to scale up more and faster. It's not a given that they're just at 100 percent of their production capacity.

Actually, they do seem to be at their limit. There have been articles about this (which I merely glanced over). Scaling up manufacturing for vaccines, especially new RNA based ones, isn't something that scales infinitely with money. Not in the short or medium term, at least. In some cases, scaling up required downscaling of current production.

Searched for the well written article I've seen, to link it here, but I'm only getting SEO bullshit.

Re: Israeli study finds 94% drop in symptomatic Covid-19 cases with Pfizer vaccine

#167

Post by ImaCake »

lucd wrote: post #104

Here is some chart showing vaccination effect on hospitalization for severe forms. Very telling. https://ourworldindata.org/grapher/israel-severe-hospitaliza...

This is a really uplifting chart. These trends should continue as vaccination rates increase even more.

Re: Israeli study finds 94% drop in symptomatic Covid-19 cases with Pfizer vaccine

#168

Post by krzyk »

mschuster91 wrote: post #74
ulfw wrote: post #51

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Yea but that's for first dosage given until end of June. That's still 4.5 months away. A long time considering thousands of infections and hundreds of deaths. Maybe paying a bit more would have been more intelligent (see Israel) than negotiating for months on end.

The problem was, as usual, EU countries' nationalism and wealth disparity. Macron insisted that the EU not order more doses from Germany's Biontech than from French Sanofi. So far so usual, but the worst problem were the Eastern European countries - they insisted on also keeping AstraZeneca with their 1.78€ a dose on board because well they are poor and can't afford more.

> So far so usual, but the worst problem were the Eastern European countries - they insisted on also keeping AstraZeneca with their 1.78€ a dose

I thought AZ was €5 a dose.

Well, as for EE countries, the largest by population size (EE country that is in EU) is Poland and they (we, I live here) ordered from multiple sources, and AZ isn't the largest one (J&J is, followed closely by Pfizer):

  Janssen Pharmaceutica NV / Johnson&Johnson 16,98 mln
  Pfizer / BioNTec                           16,74 mln
  Astra Zeneca                               16    mln
  CureVac                                     5,65 mln
  Moderna                                     6,69 mln
Source: http://urpl.gov.pl/sites/default/files/OFICJALNY%20DOKUMENT%...

The biggest issue for me is that I don't think I'll be able to select which vaccine I want to use, I don't like the AZ inferior efficacy compared to mRNA vaccines, not to mention how it handles the SA version of COVID-19 virus.

Re: Israeli study finds 94% drop in symptomatic Covid-19 cases with Pfizer vaccine

#169

Post by throwaway_Ie8th »

ImaCake wrote: post #159
throwaway_Ie8th wrote: post #147

There is a terrifying whistleblower interview from a Berlin elderly home, about the events after the vaccination. Of 31 patients who were vaccinated 8 died within 14 day, another 11 are in decline. https://2020news.de/en/whistleblower-from-berlin-nursing-hom... Similar reports came out of Sweden and other countries, after the first report. https://2020news.de/auch-in-schweden-sterben-die-alten-mensc... There are many…

These links appear to be, to use a technical term, Bullshit. From my admittedly bad German skills, I can see that the level of reporting here is terrible, completely focused on the single issue of "vaccines are bad", and probably will lead to the deaths of a lot of people.

Would you even be able to disagree with authority? Have you ever in the past?

Re: Israeli study finds 94% drop in symptomatic Covid-19 cases with Pfizer vaccine

#170

Post by fenk85 »

dm319 wrote: post #161
jansan wrote: post #10

The Google COVID-19 statistics for Israel show that cases and deaths are declining, but not at a faster rate than elsewhere in the world. Reported deaths lag behind sometimes for weeks and new deaths were caused by infections weeks ago, so vaccination may not have much effect on deaths, yet. But the number of positive tests should have gone down considerably with 50% of the population vaccinated. Are all these aympto…

The data for age group specific data is available freely in the UK. I did a quick analysis in R, and even though all over 75 and most over 70 have been vaccinated, I didn't see any increase in the rate of descent compared to other age groups. So not quite having a public health impact in overall numbers just yet (it's the lockdown that is doing that), but I have no doubt it will eventually. I wonder if part of it is…

Thats because UK only gave second dozes to 1% of people, as they made a decision to spread out second doze, also i believe they are using a different vaccine to Pfizer one
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