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Stripe bans Trump campaign

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Re: Stripe bans Trump campaign

#161

Post by AYBABTME »

Andrew_nenakhov wrote: post #94
djakaitis wrote: post #67

Earlier quoted context omitted.

I think you are missing the point of my question. I’m pointing out that not all opinions should be protected equally. Opinions of hate or violence are bad for society. I don’t understand why the suppression of those things is considered totalitarian? Especially when it comes from private enterprise.

Because if you block 'bad' opinions, you'll need to arbiter them to distinguish bad ones from good. This process is corruptible and eventually you'll find that opposing a current government is 'bad' (this happened in my country in a short span of 15 years). So it turns out that allowing all speech, even 'bad' is less harmful for society in the long run than trying to suppress some speech.

Canada has restrictions on free speech that prevent things like saying hateful stuff. And so far Canada looks pretty democratic and fair to me.

Have a read: https://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/Freedom_of_expression_in_Can...

Re: Stripe bans Trump campaign

#162

Post by klaudius »

awat wrote: post #64

Not to be reductionist but I don’t see this as a totalitarian issue. This is a free market decision. $Company decides to sever ties with another organization. That choice can be good, bad, reactive, overreactive, misguided, etc but it’s still a market participant choice. Market remains open for other market participants to make other choices.

You could look at countries as being part of a market. If one country decides to ban your speech, you just move to another one, right? But that's not how it works because switching countries is very difficult. We demand free speech from a government even if we theoretically have the option to move.

If you have a colluding oligopoly in something crucial to do business such as payments or communication, where it's difficult to switch due to network effects, being banned by them is like being banned by government.

Re: Stripe bans Trump campaign

#163

Post by ceejayoz »

intricatedetail wrote: post #117
mattsears wrote: post #96

Earlier quoted context omitted.

There's a big difference in wrong opinion and inciting violence. This isn't the government doing this. This is private companies taking action against the spread hate and lies. These are companies I want to do business with.

Where do you draw a line? These days in a snowflake culture any opinion can cause outrage and violence. It's just a matter of interpretation and who reads the message. Should companies be allowed to restrict your freedom to information? It's quite patronising.

> Where do you draw a line?

Somewhere on the right side of "storming Congress with a mob".

Re: Stripe bans Trump campaign

#164

Post by adnzzzzZ »

DaiPlusPlus wrote: post #120
chrissnell wrote: post #101

Earlier quoted context omitted.

The mob has been coming for law enforcement and federal buildings in many major cities in America for nine months now. This mob actively organized on Twitter and other social media. Where was the outrage in June? Most of the organizations that organized this destruction still have their Twitter accounts.

> The mob has been coming for law enforcement and federal buildings in many major cities in America for nine months now They're "coming for" police reform and transparency. Please don't misrepresent or generalise very disparate groups of demonstrators.

Capitol protestors were "coming for" election transparency.

Please don't misrepresent or generalise very disparate groups of demonstrators.

Re: Stripe bans Trump campaign

#165

Post by [deleted] »

cblconfederate wrote: post #136

I m sorry but all this concerted action feels (from afar) a lot like "if people don't vote the way we want, we re just gonna have to force them". It's not about overreach, but companies are not political entities, and reversing this relationship is a self-defeating travesty And if they are doing it for cheap popularity points -- well trump may be gone in a week, but his voters won't leave. this just reinforces mistru…

[deleted]

Re: Stripe bans Trump campaign

#166

Post by logicslave »

sacks2k wrote: post #26

The people cheering this on will not be protected when the mob comes for you. We live in a digital age. If having the wrong opinion means you can get your bank accounts and all Internet presence removed from you, it's not any different than living under a fascist government.

The mob is coming. People are completely underestimating what can happen. History is riddled with stories that start just like this.

Re: Stripe bans Trump campaign

#167

Post by logicslave »

bigcorp-slave wrote: post #52
sacks2k wrote: post #26

The people cheering this on will not be protected when the mob comes for you. We live in a digital age. If having the wrong opinion means you can get your bank accounts and all Internet presence removed from you, it's not any different than living under a fascist government.

I don’t know if you were paying attention last week, but the mob literally came for the members of Congress. There are wrong opinions, and then there is “six million Jews were not enough” and “hang the Vice President”, and a violent mob attacking the Capitol. No one is under any obligation to tolerate such actions in a civil society. If I advocate for your murder, am I just expressing an opinion that should be conseq…

"Give me liberty or give me death"

Re: Stripe bans Trump campaign

#168

Post by axguscbklp »

bigcorp-slave wrote: post #52
sacks2k wrote: post #26

The people cheering this on will not be protected when the mob comes for you. We live in a digital age. If having the wrong opinion means you can get your bank accounts and all Internet presence removed from you, it's not any different than living under a fascist government.

I don’t know if you were paying attention last week, but the mob literally came for the members of Congress. There are wrong opinions, and then there is “six million Jews were not enough” and “hang the Vice President”, and a violent mob attacking the Capitol. No one is under any obligation to tolerate such actions in a civil society. If I advocate for your murder, am I just expressing an opinion that should be conseq…

[flagged]

Re: Stripe bans Trump campaign

#169

Post by [deleted] »

adnzzzzZ wrote: post #164
DaiPlusPlus wrote: post #120

Earlier quoted context omitted.

> The mob has been coming for law enforcement and federal buildings in many major cities in America for nine months now They're "coming for" police reform and transparency. Please don't misrepresent or generalise very disparate groups of demonstrators.

Capitol protestors were "coming for" election transparency. Please don't misrepresent or generalise very disparate groups of demonstrators.

[deleted]

Re: Stripe bans Trump campaign

#170

Post by kuzimoto »

DaiPlusPlus wrote: post #120
chrissnell wrote: post #101

Earlier quoted context omitted.

The mob has been coming for law enforcement and federal buildings in many major cities in America for nine months now. This mob actively organized on Twitter and other social media. Where was the outrage in June? Most of the organizations that organized this destruction still have their Twitter accounts.

> The mob has been coming for law enforcement and federal buildings in many major cities in America for nine months now They're "coming for" police reform and transparency. Please don't misrepresent or generalise very disparate groups of demonstrators.

So the ends justify the means? Only certain ideas are allowed for mobs to be okay?
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