I Feel Like I Have No Real Interests; My Only Interest Is Making Money • Hacker News Board

Re: I Feel Like I Have No Real Interests; My Only Interest Is Making Money

#161

Post by cweagans » Mon, Nov 30, 2020, 6:59 PM UTC

piva00 wrote: post #112

pyrrhotech wrote: post #6

I felt like that until I got to around $2.5 million liquid net worth. Now I still like money, but each additional dollar is starting to show diminishing marginal utility. Though of course I'm still trying to grow my net worth, it's no longer the main focus of my life, especially now that I'm "retired" from my main career at least. I split my time between gaming, running, reading, socializing and working on my trading…

> I think while you don't have "FU money" it's important for money to be the main focus of your life. You don't have freedom if you don't have a lot of money and you can't be 100% happy without freedom, at least in my experience, though I know opinions vary here. The thing is that not everyone can or will achieve that. If we know that, what's the main drive for others to do that? We don't live in a system where this…

I think that the amount of money is more of a secondary point here. You're shackled to somebody else's schedule, whims, priorities, etc. until you have the money to not do that anymore. That doesn't necessarily mean 2.5m liquid though.

How much would you need to work if you bought a small-ish house, lived on a very strict budget, and generally kept expenditure to a minimum? There are places in the US where you can buy a house on a bit of land for just over $100k (ex: https://www.zillow.com/homedetails/904-Grant-St-Tupelo-MS-38...). What could you do with half an acre of land, a paid off house, and minimal day-to-day obligations? Imagine: work for an hour or two per day so that you have money to buy food, pay power/electric, etc., then idk... read? write that book you've always thought about writing? get in shape? start a garden? go fishing? There are so many possibilities.

I recognize that moving across the country, having the money to pay off a $120k house, etc. is an enormous privilege for some people and I'm certainly not asserting that it's an opportunity that anyone could take advantage of. Only pointing out that the bar for FU money might be lower than you might think.

Re: I Feel Like I Have No Real Interests; My Only Interest Is Making Money

#162

Post by dusted » Mon, Nov 30, 2020, 7:28 PM UTC

ghaff wrote: post #97

dusted wrote: post #78

Earlier quoted context omitted.

>But I bet the quality of health care available to you exceeds the imagination of those kings and emperors. This raises the question of what should be included in the definition of wealth. That king probably had one or more personal doctors, people they more or less owned, whose sole purpose and responsibility was their well-being. Even if the efficiency of that person might have been low, it's certainly a lot more t…

>That king probably had one or more personal doctors, people they more or less owned, whose sole purpose and responsibility was their well-being. (Assuming we're talking a couple hundred years ago or longer.) Who didn't have access to antibiotics, vaccines, or any of a plethora of other modern drugs, germ theory of disease, anesthetics, etc. etc. I'll take an hour of a modern physician's time and access to hospital/p…

> Quantity doesn't always beat quality.

I even implied as much. What I'm trying to say is that being wealthy has nothing to do with the technological level of your country at some given point in history. It may have some correlation to how good access you have to whatever the highest technology available at your point in history is.

Re: I Feel Like I Have No Real Interests; My Only Interest Is Making Money

#163

Post by jandrewrogers » Mon, Nov 30, 2020, 8:17 PM UTC

artemonster wrote: post #14

pyrrhotech wrote: post #6

I felt like that until I got to around $2.5 million liquid net worth. Now I still like money, but each additional dollar is starting to show diminishing marginal utility. Though of course I'm still trying to grow my net worth, it's no longer the main focus of my life, especially now that I'm "retired" from my main career at least. I split my time between gaming, running, reading, socializing and working on my trading…

how is it possible to save 2.5 mil from salary? I am from upper 5% in germany in terms of salary, and I can only manage to save ~10kEur/year, while maintaining decent lifestyle. An order of magnitude lower than you'd need to retire with such a sum after 20 years or so. How do you do that? Genuine question

The top 5% household income in the US starts at ~$270k, which leaves at least $100k for investing after taxes and ordinary expenses. Combine this with US investment market performance e.g. the S&P500 over the last decade, and it is straightforward how someone with a good income might arrive at $2.5M in a relatively small number of years starting from zero.

Americans have notoriously poor investment/saving habits, which obscures the fact that it is remarkably easy to accumulate liquid wealth in the US if you are a diligent saver. The median US household has enough investable income, after all ordinary life expenses, to accumulate a couple million dollars over a typical career. High earners can easily save 10x that amount.

Re: I Feel Like I Have No Real Interests; My Only Interest Is Making Money

#164

Post by exabrial » Mon, Nov 30, 2020, 8:26 PM UTC

finnthehuman wrote: post #132

exabrial wrote: post #4

Seek discomfort. Go help at a homeless shelter or local food kitchen. The problem is you've insulated yourself from the reality others live in. There's a lot of good you can do when you have resources.

I don't think that's quite the advice they need. For any outcome short of dropping everything to rededicate their life to charity full time, the author will still have all the same questions about direction and priorities in their professional life. I can share from my own experience (and from talking with the friends I've made along the way) dedicating your time and resources to charity volunteering is a fulfilling…

I agree. See the first line: "Seek Discomfort". The the first step. There wasn't an implication that this was going to solve his problems, it's that the first step is popping the bubble you live in.

Re: I Feel Like I Have No Real Interests; My Only Interest Is Making Money

#165

Post by ryandrake » Mon, Nov 30, 2020, 8:51 PM UTC

pc86 wrote: post #123

analognoise wrote: post #93

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Live like a hobbit while never marrying and being in the top .5% of all tech salaries for a decade. You might as well get the advice "marry rich" - it's probably more likely.

I mean the snarkiness just doesn't have any reflection of reality. Debt is a killer. I used to have a lot of credit card and personal debt, and was paying over $1,500/mo in interest on less than $100k USD/year. If you get stuck in that trap it's damn near impossible to get out of if you overextend yourself. A lot of folks grossly underestimate what they spend eating out and drinking. Probably less of a problem now th…

> If you max out your 401(k) you are saving about $20k/yr while only reducing your taxable income by ~$15k/yr depending on your marginal tax rate. A Roth adds another $6k to that if you're under the cap (something like $140k for 2020)

Even if you are above the Roth cap, you can contribute post-tax $6k to a tradtional IRA, then immediately roll into a Roth IRA. This is known as a "backdoor Roth".

Additionally, some employer 401(k) plans allow you to contribute post-tax money to your 401(k). The IRS specifies an upper limit of the total of [employee pre-tax + employer match + employee post-tax], which was $57k in 2020. The post-tax portion of the above can also be rolled into a Roth IRA. This is commonly referred to as the "mega-backdoor Roth"

Also, don't forget catch-up contributions to each if you are over 50.

Point is if you have the income to support it, you can save much more in a tax advantaged way than just that $19.5k pre-tax 401(k). Please look up the tax consequences of any of these options before doing them. They are straightforward but contain a few pitfalls, such as the pro-rata rule affecting rolling over traditional IRAs into Roth IRAs.

Re: I Feel Like I Have No Real Interests; My Only Interest Is Making Money

#166

Post by aerojoe23 » Mon, Nov 30, 2020, 8:56 PM UTC

I think this is more of a focus problem than not having an interest in anything.

Starting your own thing is different than being in school or being an employee. If you were "gifted" with the blessing of being good at school life, not having a defined goal for you could be part of the issue. With school

The ability to focus is like a muscle or any other skill, you have to practice it.

Re: I Feel Like I Have No Real Interests; My Only Interest Is Making Money

#167

Post by sershe » Mon, Nov 30, 2020, 9:01 PM UTC

artemonster wrote: post #47

pietrovismara wrote: post #28

Earlier quoted context omitted.

You just can't. And that's how it's supposed to work. Only a very small minority of the population can reach that kind of worth. It's the foundation of this system, no matter if the baselines grows, there will always be rich and poor.

I really don't undestand this "that's how it's supposed to work". Baseline doesn't grow, it only gets worse. Why the hell my landlord, just by the virtue of being born 30-40 years before, was able to afford buying a nice apartment, while working without education, for which I am giving away today a third of my net salary and with 0 chances of buying one, ever?

Nobody forces you to rent from him; and why are you comparing yourself-now vs him 30-40 years later, relatively speaking?

There are plenty of places in the US where you can buy a house now - housing in the US overall is actually cheaper than it used to be per sqft as far as I recall. Then, in 30-40 years you may too be renting out a paid-off house.

Re: I Feel Like I Have No Real Interests; My Only Interest Is Making Money

#168

Post by sershe » Mon, Nov 30, 2020, 9:12 PM UTC

pastacacioepepe wrote: post #41

pyrrhotech wrote: post #6

I felt like that until I got to around $2.5 million liquid net worth. Now I still like money, but each additional dollar is starting to show diminishing marginal utility. Though of course I'm still trying to grow my net worth, it's no longer the main focus of my life, especially now that I'm "retired" from my main career at least. I split my time between gaming, running, reading, socializing and working on my trading…

So are you saying that since the big majority of people in the world will never get to your kind of net worth (2 mil++) they will never have real freedom? Glad that we agree, that's what I believe too and that's why I strongly hate capitalism. You aren't free at all unless you have enough capital to stop being forced to take any job offer just to survive.

What is your alternative? Those tried so far involved being forced to take a job all the same, except you didn't even get a shot at freedom while doing it.

Re: I Feel Like I Have No Real Interests; My Only Interest Is Making Money

#169

Post by sershe » Mon, Nov 30, 2020, 9:24 PM UTC

recursivedoubts wrote: post #12

All the money in the world ain't gonna by you meaning. But pursuing it might distract you from that fact. For a while.

Every time I see a platitude like this it reminds me of those self-compensating put-downs people use like "well she's so pretty, she must be dumb" etc. that have no reason to be true.

I feel like meaning is vastly oversold. People didn't have any meaning beyond "survive and make children" for millennia and they did fine. The whole search for meaning I feel has sprung up only among the people who have too much free time ;) I found that I became much happier when I explicitly rejected it, absurdism-style, and then at least partially internalized the notion... it doesn't quite get you back to the natural lack of concern that you have when you are young and don't think of life as finite, but it's the step in the right direction.

Re: I Feel Like I Have No Real Interests; My Only Interest Is Making Money

#170

Post by benhurmarcel » Mon, Nov 30, 2020, 9:50 PM UTC

mstipetic wrote: post #44

artemonster wrote: post #14

Earlier quoted context omitted.

how is it possible to save 2.5 mil from salary? I am from upper 5% in germany in terms of salary, and I can only manage to save ~10kEur/year, while maintaining decent lifestyle. An order of magnitude lower than you'd need to retire with such a sum after 20 years or so. How do you do that? Genuine question

Germany is not set up to have people get rich from a salary. Everyone has a comfortable life, but it's very hard to get "rich." That's one of the reasons I left Germany

Funnily enough, one of the reasons I'm looking to move to Germany is to get richer. Salaries in Germany are significantly better than most of western Europe (UK, France, Spain, Italy…) for a similar cost of life.