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Preparing Our Partners for iOS 14

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Re: Preparing Our Partners for iOS 14

#161

Post by usmannk »

partiallypro wrote: post #141
shajznnckfke wrote: post #102

In iOS 13, Apple and third-party ad tracking were both controlled by the same opt-out setting. In iOS 14, the settings have been split, with third party tracking disabled and and Apple’s tracking enabled by default. Blatant anticompetitive behavior to promote their own tracking services in the guise of protecting users. Genius move by Apple. https://twitter.com/eric_seufert/status/1291730115253145600?...

This is my main issue with it. If Microsoft say, added something to your host file, that blocked all ad trackers except from the Microsoft network, everyone would be up in arms. But since it's Apple, people think this is out of the goodness of their heart when really they just want all the data for themselves which they will eventually use in their in-app advertising. Heck maybe they will use this to subsidize any lo…

> If Microsoft say, added something to your host file, that blocked all ad trackers except from the Microsoft network, everyone would be up in arms.

You'll love this: https://www.bleepingcomputer.com/news/microsoft/windows-10-h...

Re: Preparing Our Partners for iOS 14

#162

Post by StavrosK »

oblio wrote: post #63
criddell wrote: post #3

> We believe that industry consultation is critical for changes to platform policies, as these updates have a far-reaching impact on the developer ecosystem. Why should platform makers consult the advertising industry? It's not like the advertising industry consulted anybody before they started collecting every bit of data they could.

I'm honestly interested about this, Facebook is a big company. Is there no case of FB screwing over its partners? Like locking or limiting an API that they had offered in the past, etc. One thing that comes to mind immediately is that Facebook Messenger used to be accessible through XMPP and then they blocked that.

You used to be able to fetch public events (not for a user, not private events, just public events that you can easily browse to anonymously) and I had made a site that showed everything that was going on in my city. It was fantastic, you could see all concerts/gigs/plays for each day at a glance.

One day, Facebook just killed that endpoint for "privacy reasons". Anyone can still open a web browser and visit the event page, but accessing the data programmatically is now gone.

I guess they wanted to be the only event viewer, and since everyone only adds their events to Facebook and nowhere else, there is now no way to get event info.

Re: Preparing Our Partners for iOS 14

#164

Post by filleokus »

shajznnckfke wrote: post #102

In iOS 13, Apple and third-party ad tracking were both controlled by the same opt-out setting. In iOS 14, the settings have been split, with third party tracking disabled and and Apple’s tracking enabled by default. Blatant anticompetitive behavior to promote their own tracking services in the guise of protecting users. Genius move by Apple. https://twitter.com/eric_seufert/status/1291730115253145600?...

Hmm, what is "their own tracking services"? iAd is dead since long, the only ads they serve are Apple Search Ads right? Is there any evidence/suggestion that they are using usage data from outside the App Store to target ASA? The promo-page doesn't seem to indicate that at least [1].

I mean, still in iOS 14, Google can use your data from e.g Google Maps / Chrome to target ads in the Youtube app on the same device without requiring any accounts by using identifierForVendor [0]. AFAIK this wouldn't require them to show the scary pop-up either, since they are only sharing the info with themselves?

But yeah, even without "tracking" the users, the ASA is of course in a privileged position, both in its prominent position in the (only) App Store, and by the possibility to charge per e.g app install. Doing reliable app install tracking without IDFA is next to impossible. Taking it further by restarting iAd now would be highly problematic imho.

[0]: https://developer.apple.com/documentation/uikit/uidevice/162... [1]: https://searchads.apple.com/privacy/

Re: Preparing Our Partners for iOS 14

#165

Post by ogre_codes »

multiplegeorges wrote: post #155
ziftface wrote: post #91

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Apple absolutely does abuse their power as a monopoly. I'm not sure how that's related to asking users for permission to share data with third parties, which is what this was about.

Monopoly of what? A platform of their own creation? It's not of the app market or the mobile phone market, there are strong viable competitors in both. No one says Toyota is a monopolist of Toyota cars and yet Apple is called a monopolist of the App Store, iOS, and Apple phones.

Strangely, nobody says Microsoft has an xBox monopoly either. Likewise, no complaints about the PS4/5 monopoly or Nintendo Monopoly.

Re: Preparing Our Partners for iOS 14

#166

Post by rodgerd »

techbra wrote: post #52
RcouF1uZ4gsC wrote: post #12

> Ultimately, despite our best efforts, Apple’s updates may render Audience Network so ineffective on iOS 14 that it may not make sense to offer it on iOS 14. Seems like Apple is really backing up their rhetoric with real action. Awesome news for anyone that values privacy. Kudos to Apple.

Only if they made this accessible to everyone. You need a thousand dollar phone which is useless in 3 years

Yes, it's a tragedy that the iPhone SE and 6S became unsupported after squints 6 years and counting.

Re: Preparing Our Partners for iOS 14

#167

Post by criddell »

dhimes wrote: post #111
criddell wrote: post #69

Earlier quoted context omitted.

On Facebook, information that users voluntarily and explicitly provide is fair game for targeting IMHO. The rest should come from the content of the page.

If by "explicitly" you subsume "knowingly" then I agree.

I prefer explicitly.

Facebook has a pretty good idea where I am by looking at the data associated with my connection. I know they have that, but if I don't want them to use that for advertising, they shouldn't.

Re: Preparing Our Partners for iOS 14

#168

Post by grishka »

madeofpalk wrote: post #157
danShumway wrote: post #113

Earlier quoted context omitted.

To be fair though, don't you remember how the DNT header worked really well for everybody involved, and how all these advertisers today universally respect it, and how they totally didn't abandon the entire concept as soon as it started seeing mainstream use and platforms started turning it on by default? What could go wrong if we give them another spot at the table? I mean, PRAM has already released so many good pla…

The problem with DNT was that it was off by default, advertisers didnt support it, and that it was yet another bit advertises used to create IDs for anon users.

The only real solution is to do away with third-party cookies being on by default. There are very narrow use cases that are beneficial to the end user, but the user-hostile ones far outweigh those.

DNT is based on a flawed assumption that ad tech has good faith. In the real world, though, you don't ask for privacy, you take it.

Re: Preparing Our Partners for iOS 14

#169

Post by rodgerd »

gregorythecat wrote: post #48

Given the attitude on HN about iOS14, I don’t think most here grasp the implication of gutting ad attribution. All publishers (news sites, indie games, etc) are going to see huge drops in CPM. It could easily be a business ending shift. Sure removing IDFA will help protect user privacy, but let’s not kid ourselves that there will not be collateral damage. Being a third party publisher will be that much harder and wal…

If this was twitter, this would be where I reply with the gif of Donald Glover saying "good".

Business models come and go. This one isn't as bad as slavery or child labour, but but I'd happily tap-dance on its grave.

Re: Preparing Our Partners for iOS 14

#170

Post by ogre_codes »

freeone3000 wrote: post #53
ffpip wrote: post #46

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Sue Apple for putting privacy first and informing users of clear opt-out choice right below the opt-in?

Yes. Apple is using their monopoly position to harm their business of selling private data of consumers.

You need to make it clear if you are being sarcastic or not here.
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