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Apple expands independent repair program to Mac after US antitrust investigation

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Re: Apple expands independent repair program to Mac after US antitrust investigation

#161

Post by oblio »

phh wrote: post #160
Polylactic_acid wrote: post #151

Earlier quoted context omitted.

That was a dumb idea to begin with. We don't need phones that work like lego. Just reverting to how phones worked 5 years ago would be a massive improvement. For almost all users all they will ever need to do is replace the battery. We used to be able to replace the battery with no tools or skills and the screen was pretty easy if you had some skill at all. The problem we face now is that the user can't fix anything…

Then you could vote with your wallet and take a Fairphone :-)

This doesn't work. You can't rely on individual action for massive scale initiatives. Look how far that got us for the ozone layer (solved through governmental action), climate change (unsolved, because there is no governmental action), decent working conditions (everything achieved was through unions, protests and government intervention), etc

Re: Apple expands independent repair program to Mac after US antitrust investigation

#162

Post by megous »

LockAndLol wrote: post #147
ComputerGuru wrote: post #70

Just for some perspective, I can call up my Dell small business sales rep (who reached out to me after I bought just three or four machines over a period of some years) and give him an obscure part number. He says he needs a minute to look up the part, etc and asks if I’m taking this to a Dell-authorized technician; I say no. He takes advantage of how long it takes for the likely instantaneous result to pop up on the…

Apple really doesn't like the environment, does it? You're forced to get a new device every time. God for business, shit for the world. But Apple customers don't seem to care one bit.

I guess it's a bit more nuanced. On one hand they support and update their phone's OS for quite a long time, relative to others, and on the other this anti-repair stuff, platform closedness and making a kind of fetish out of having a new phone every year with their superhyped (people camping in front of stores for a phone, really?) yearly release cycle.

Re: Apple expands independent repair program to Mac after US antitrust investigation

#163

Post by deepstack »

sushshshsh wrote: post #60
sinak wrote: post #31

Earlier quoted context omitted.

This is Apple trying to avoid real Right to Repair legislation by taking actions that look like they support independent repair. Consider taking a moment to donate to https://repair.org/ - we're pushing to get Right to Repair laws passed in state legislatures across the US.

I am a real believer in right to repair. But I wonder, if we are unable to achieve legislative results, what can be done to build hardware on open standards?

Apple is hardware maker. Of course it make sense for them to design the hardware so only they can repair it. It is part of their business model.

Re: Apple expands independent repair program to Mac after US antitrust investigation

#164

Post by oxfordmale »

Lack of repairability is the main reason I do not buy Mac Books. Yes, they are more reliable, however, if you encounter a problem, you endure a long wait at a Mac Book repair centre that is miles away. My work laptop developed an issue while I was on holidays in Spain, and if it had been a PC it could have been easily fixed by any of the local repair centres. Of course Apple being Apple, I would have to drive 2 hours to the nearest Apple repair centre with no guarantee it would have been fixed in time before I returned back home.

Re: Apple expands independent repair program to Mac after US antitrust investigation

#165

Post by ornornor »

oxfordmale wrote: post #164

Lack of repairability is the main reason I do not buy Mac Books. Yes, they are more reliable, however, if you encounter a problem, you endure a long wait at a Mac Book repair centre that is miles away. My work laptop developed an issue while I was on holidays in Spain, and if it had been a PC it could have been easily fixed by any of the local repair centres. Of course Apple being Apple, I would have to drive 2 hours…

They’re not more reliable. I’m still using a thinkpad from 2013 as my daily driver. My work mbp failed after 6 months because dust specs got under the keyboard keys and stopped them from registering presses anymore.

Re: Apple expands independent repair program to Mac after US antitrust investigation

#166

Post by haezee »

deepstack wrote: post #163
sushshshsh wrote: post #60

Earlier quoted context omitted.

I am a real believer in right to repair. But I wonder, if we are unable to achieve legislative results, what can be done to build hardware on open standards?

Apple is hardware maker. Of course it make sense for them to design the hardware so only they can repair it. It is part of their business model.

Except.. They're not the only ones who can repair it (even though they act like it). And their efforts to hurt independent repairshops show signs of antitrust, which is the topic at hand.

Re: Apple expands independent repair program to Mac after US antitrust investigation

#167

Post by girishso »

LockAndLol wrote: post #147
ComputerGuru wrote: post #70

Just for some perspective, I can call up my Dell small business sales rep (who reached out to me after I bought just three or four machines over a period of some years) and give him an obscure part number. He says he needs a minute to look up the part, etc and asks if I’m taking this to a Dell-authorized technician; I say no. He takes advantage of how long it takes for the likely instantaneous result to pop up on the…

Apple really doesn't like the environment, does it? You're forced to get a new device every time. God for business, shit for the world. But Apple customers don't seem to care one bit.

I’ve wondered the same for some time, they intentionally used to degrade performance of older iPhones on OS upgrade. Or sell spare parts at obscene prices, actually buying a new device makes more sense than repairing, creating more e-waste. Calls itself a green company!

Disclaimer: you can call me a Apple fanboy, exclusively using multiple Macs for > 12 years, never owned a smartphone that’s not iPhone.

Re: Apple expands independent repair program to Mac after US antitrust investigation

#168

Post by wsay »

richrichardsson wrote: post #158
munk-a wrote: post #143

Earlier quoted context omitted.

I disagree that making your device easily serviceable necessarily makes it less attractive to that portion of the population. I think that making your device brittle, fragile and easy to tamper with makes it less attractive to that portion of the population - having open documentation about the ways to approach repair and then letting the electronics repair shops all be able to repair your device makes it really attr…

I think the point was that making it easier to repair will compromise something like device size or weight, making it less attractive to the larger portion of the population. If they could provide the same form factor and make it easily repairable, then I think you would be right that would be attractive to all, however I think small size and repairability are mutually exclusive properties.

Ten minutes watching YouTube will demonstrate that amateurs are certainly capable of repairing todays devices, even down to something small like an apple watch, so small size and reparability are clearly not mutually exclusive. Why would they be anyway? Certified repair technicians aren't magic, they just have access to training, parts and tools that help.

Re: Apple expands independent repair program to Mac after US antitrust investigation

#169

Post by djaychela »

deepstack wrote: post #163
sushshshsh wrote: post #60

Earlier quoted context omitted.

I am a real believer in right to repair. But I wonder, if we are unable to achieve legislative results, what can be done to build hardware on open standards?

Apple is hardware maker. Of course it make sense for them to design the hardware so only they can repair it. It is part of their business model.

But in many cases this is achieved solely by supply-side restriction of replacement parts - stopping IC manufacturers from supplying those chips to people who could easily repair the device given those parts (macbook power IC springs to mind - same device as a commercial one, just a different pinout for the unobtainable Apple version), or making replacements locked down (such as on new macbooks - you can't just swap a screen now).

Re: Apple expands independent repair program to Mac after US antitrust investigation

#170

Post by jstummbillig »

kyriakos wrote: post #129
sinak wrote: post #31

Earlier quoted context omitted.

This is Apple trying to avoid real Right to Repair legislation by taking actions that look like they support independent repair. Consider taking a moment to donate to https://repair.org/ - we're pushing to get Right to Repair laws passed in state legislatures across the US.

Apple's workaround may work in US but don't think it will get very far in EU

I don't know. It's infuriating what Apple gets away with in Germany. For example right now to maybe get my 2018 MacBook Pro keyboard fixed, I have to relinquish the unit for a minimum of five workdays. Mind you nobody guarantees me that they will actually do the repair within the time frame or that it will in fact be covered by the extended warranty. This is just the minimum time they will hold the unit to have a look at it and tell me what's up. Cool.
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