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Vitamin D deficiency and Covid-19 mortality [pdf]

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Re: Vitamin D deficiency and Covid-19 mortality [pdf]

#161

Post by mellosouls »

devaboone wrote: post #155
mellosouls wrote: post #134

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Without a reference to go by a quick Google indicates toxicity is only likely by taking far above recommended levels (max recommended is 4000iu daily) for an extended period. Presumably people on those kind of doses are taking it under medical supervision, or are idiots/under the control of idiots. I am not a doctor, but without further information it seems that as ever, following the guidance on legit supplies speci…

There are some very vocal people who argue that the risk of toxicity is very low. The studies aren't great. But for most people, taking a moderate dose of Vitamin D will be safe. Unfortunately, I have treated many patients who come to me with high calcium levels due to taking Vitamin D. They do not have parathyroid disease (I have treated thousands of patients with parathyroid disease). They have simply been taking h…

Thanks for the reply and contextual information.

Re: Vitamin D deficiency and Covid-19 mortality [pdf]

#162

Post by devaboone »

jessriedel wrote: post #118
conorh wrote: post #89

I've mentioned this before, but my wife is a parathyroid surgeon (parathyroids are the glands that regulate the calcium in your neck) and would beg you to PLEASE monitor your calcium levels if you are supplementing with Vitamin D. She often sees patients on high doses of Vitamin D from well intentioned doctors, but with out of whack calcium levels because of it, and the patients can be very sick without understanding…

All the vitamin D supplements I see in the pharmacy come combined with calcium. Should that take care of it or does "out of whack" mean calcium could be too high as well as too low?

Calcium supplements often include Vitamin D because it aids in intestinal absorption of calcium. That is actually one of the main roles of Vitamin D. You can find Vitamin D by itself, in anywhere from 400 to 5000 units per pill. Taking high doses of Vitamin D can cause high calcium (due to more being absorbed in the intestines), and taking extra calcium would just exacerbate that. If someone has low calcium levels, I recommend taking both calcium and Vitamin D. Low Vitamin D can cause low calcium levels.

Re: Vitamin D deficiency and Covid-19 mortality [pdf]

#163

Post by [deleted] »

James_Henry wrote: post #57
jcampbell1 wrote: post #46

Earlier quoted context omitted.

After having several kitesurfing vacations ruined by sunburns, I decided to just go to a tanning salon in the winter. It had a profound mood effect and respiratory effect almost immediately. Now I go a few times per month in winter regardless if I am going to the tropics. The UV does is completely metered. It may be a risky, but given that people that work outside have half the risk of melanoma as people who work ind…

One concern that I would have is that I've heard that the light from a tanning salon doesn't match the light output by the sun. Supposedly the sun has more UVB or something and there are reasons to believe it may be healthier. Do you, or anyone else, have any knowledge on this?

[deleted]

Re: Vitamin D deficiency and Covid-19 mortality [pdf]

#164

Post by devaboone »

dropin685 wrote: post #144
conorh wrote: post #89

I've mentioned this before, but my wife is a parathyroid surgeon (parathyroids are the glands that regulate the calcium in your neck) and would beg you to PLEASE monitor your calcium levels if you are supplementing with Vitamin D. She often sees patients on high doses of Vitamin D from well intentioned doctors, but with out of whack calcium levels because of it, and the patients can be very sick without understanding…

Here (below) is a quote from the article, on the subject of calcium. (I suppose some of us may be reluctant or unable to have calcium levels monitored. But it seems all of us should be taking vitamin K2 along with our vitamin D.) >The authors explicitly point out that each vitamin D supplementation must be accompanied by sufficient vitamin K2. This certainly prevents the rise of the calcium level in the blood, which…

Vitamin K2 does help bones absorb calcium, but it will not prevent the blood calcium level from rising if you are really taking more Vitamin D than you need. This is simply wishful thinking.

Re: Vitamin D deficiency and Covid-19 mortality [pdf]

#165

Post by LegitShady »

Florin_Andrei wrote: post #131
graeme wrote: post #68

Earlier quoted context omitted.

They’re single use doses. These are often used by doctors to treat severe deficiency, e.g. weekly 50,000 UI. It is plausible that in an ICU situation with limited time a single, even larger dose makes sense. For an individual not critically ill, more gradual daily boosting of vitamin D is possible. The ICU patients didn’t have this time.

What's the LD50 for vitamin D?

You experience issues with hypercalcemia long before the ld50 becomes an issue if you plan on supplementing too much

Re: Vitamin D deficiency and Covid-19 mortality [pdf]

#166

Post by pure_simplicity »

devaboone wrote: post #146
woko wrote: post #137

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Not a doctor, but I have had kidney stones. The answer is a loss of calcium, so high level found in urine test: if you had way too much vitamin D, then you would start releasing the calcium from your bones. I don't think that taking calcium supplements would help, because calcium metabolism ( https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Calcium_metabolism ) is much more complex than that.

Calcium metabolism is complicated, but there are a few things that are straightforward. 1. Vitamin D helps the intestines absorb calcium, so taking more Vitamin D can lead to more calcium being absorbed in your intestines, and thus more calcium in the blood. The excess calcium in your blood is caused by increased absorption from the intestines, not from bone release. (High calcium with parathyroid disease is caused b…

Do you know what could be happening if taking vitamin D gives you severe headaches that last for days and gradually get weaker?

If you need more information, please ask away.

Re: Vitamin D deficiency and Covid-19 mortality [pdf]

#167

Post by ColanR »

devaboone wrote: post #160
ColanR wrote: post #102

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Right now, I'd rather have a calcium problem than a Covid-19 problem. Also, some of the studies being thrown around in this discussion have mentioned that safe levels of Vitamin D are much higher than a lot of medical professionals actually think. > there is virtually no risk of toxicity in supplementing up to 10,000 IU of vitamin D3 daily https://sci-hub.se/https://www.sciencedirect.com/science/art...

I read the study that is cited on your link. It was a review article about Vitamin D, not a study on Vitamin D toxicity. And in fact, in the references for that article, there is no study cited directly related to Vitamin D toxicity that I can see. The cutoff at 10K is largely someone's opinion. I cannot say how many people will be harmed by taking such a high dose, but I know with certainty that toxicity at that dos…

Thanks for the response. I'm curious what your wife thinks about this article [0], mentioned elsewhere in this discussion. It makes the case that the current RDA for Vitamin D is based on a statistical error, and that the recommended dose should be closer to 8000 IU for young adults.

[0] https://pubmed.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/28768407/

Re: Vitamin D deficiency and Covid-19 mortality [pdf]

#168

Post by graeme »

devaboone wrote: post #143
wpasc wrote: post #96

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Would you mind elaborating on what you mean by "wacky" levels? I can't tell from your comment if that means high or low. Asking as a Vitamin D supplement user who uses 2-3k IU a day

Hi, I'm the wife. High dose Vitamin D can cause elevated calcium levels (meaning over 10.0 mg/dl for adults over 40, it can be a little higher for younger adults). I usually don't see that occur with doses at 2-3 K IU daily. You can also check your Vitamin D 25-OH levels (the level that will be done if you just get a standard "Vitamin D level") and these should be in a reasonable range. What constitutes reasonable ma…

Great answer, thanks. So measuring blood levels of vitamin D and setting a specific target no higher than 50 ng/ml should be enough to avoid this problem for most people? Or could taking a high daily dose for a short time to get to the desired blood level cause trouble as well?

Finally, do you see much difference in getting to that high blood level of vitamin D from sun exposure vs D in diet (fish, etc) vs supplements?

I recently started trying to get more vitamin D from the sun, a sperti vitamin d lamp, and food, in order to reduce the amount of pills needed for a given IU. I use the dminder app to track estimated blood levels between tests.

Re: Vitamin D deficiency and Covid-19 mortality [pdf]

#169

Post by devaboone »

crawfordcomeaux wrote: post #159
devaboone wrote: post #143

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Hi, I'm the wife. High dose Vitamin D can cause elevated calcium levels (meaning over 10.0 mg/dl for adults over 40, it can be a little higher for younger adults). I usually don't see that occur with doses at 2-3 K IU daily. You can also check your Vitamin D 25-OH levels (the level that will be done if you just get a standard "Vitamin D level") and these should be in a reasonable range. What constitutes reasonable ma…

Does this material affect your advice? https://pubmed.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/28768407/

No, it doesn't. I haven't had a chance to really critically review the studies that are cited in that article, so I can't give an in-depth answer as to why that article is wrong. But I know that my recommendations are based on patients I have treated. And I have treated thousands of patients with parathyroid, calcium, and Vitamin D problems. That is all that I have done for the last 6 years, in fact. I've never had a patient require 8000 units of Vit D daily to get to a normal level - never. Yet this article would have me believe that 98% of people require over 8000 units to get Vit D in the normal range?! That is absurd. Anyone who has prescribed Vitamin D and watched levels knows that this isn't true. Many things published in medical literature are not valid, and not reproducible.

Re: Vitamin D deficiency and Covid-19 mortality [pdf]

#170

Post by [deleted] »

devaboone wrote: post #155
mellosouls wrote: post #134

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Without a reference to go by a quick Google indicates toxicity is only likely by taking far above recommended levels (max recommended is 4000iu daily) for an extended period. Presumably people on those kind of doses are taking it under medical supervision, or are idiots/under the control of idiots. I am not a doctor, but without further information it seems that as ever, following the guidance on legit supplies speci…

There are some very vocal people who argue that the risk of toxicity is very low. The studies aren't great. But for most people, taking a moderate dose of Vitamin D will be safe. Unfortunately, I have treated many patients who come to me with high calcium levels due to taking Vitamin D. They do not have parathyroid disease (I have treated thousands of patients with parathyroid disease). They have simply been taking h…

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