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How to Kill a Startup Idea with Google Keyword Planner and AdWords: A Case Study

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Re: How to Kill a Startup Idea with Google Keyword Planner and AdWords: A Case Study

#161

Post by jlokier »

cortesoft wrote: post #114
cabaalis wrote: post #2

This is very useful insight that I want to apply to my own planned side-projects (like 30-something domains registered as ideas...) Too often I've thought "that's a great idea" and then focused on the tech of implementation rather than the viability. At that point it's just a hobby, or skill-sharpening exercise. Regarding the example shown, I would think that "uber for" ideas (meaning facilitate a connection between…

As others have said on this thread, this model is not very good for frequent, repeated services that are provided by the same person each time. When that happens, it becomes really easy to cut the middle man out and pay the service provider directly. These services are matchmakers, and the matchmaker can only really be expected to be paid to make the match... not in perpetuity. This is why services like Uber, where y…

For one on one personal service yes.

For something where people get some value out of using the intermediary over and over, even if it's the same teacher, see Peloton.

I could see that idea working for remote music lessons if the teachers were great.

Re: How to Kill a Startup Idea with Google Keyword Planner and AdWords: A Case Study

#162

Post by throwawayjava »

_-o-_ wrote: post #147
tobr wrote: post #122

This might come off as awfully naive, but this doesn’t sit right with me: > XYLO's mobile music lesson technology is the easiest way to learn new music, right from the comfort of your home. Our platform can teach your child any instrument on any schedule, and let them replay lessons forever. As far as I understand, this is... a complete lie? You just made some crap up to see if you can make people click?

It's a lie, but only in a sense that they don't have a product yet. But that's something that they could have striven for if they were funded.

Can't you say the same for financial fraud?

"It's fraud, but only in the sense that we don't have the profits yet. With some investment we'll surely be able to make that much profit and more."

Also, it's not just a landing page. They take PII. I'm honestly a bit surprised this is legal.

Re: How to Kill a Startup Idea with Google Keyword Planner and AdWords: A Case Study

#163

Post by sweeneyrod »

kbuchanan wrote: post #25

This may strike some as silly, but before the iPhone was invented, there were ZERO searches for the term "iPhone". (I assume, ha!) By all means, do market analysis, but remember that demand is not static—it can be shaped by what you offer. I co-founded a firm 13 years ago that now employees 50 people that most certainly would have been killed by this type of analysis.

It seems like the authors made the unspoken assumption that the product would not significantly embiggen the market. That seems very reasonable in this case.

Re: How to Kill a Startup Idea with Google Keyword Planner and AdWords: A Case Study

#164

Post by rchaud »

chasd00 wrote: post #159
xenadu02 wrote: post #107

Earlier quoted context omitted.

There's a large opportunity cost to that strategy. If you allow consulting to make up 80% of revenue by default the business will inevitably turn into a consulting business, not a software business. Consulting can be a great way to bootstrap but you need to know when the tail is at risk of wagging the dog.

money is money IMO. If the business turns into a consulting business because that's where the money is then so be it.

during a business downturn, it can be hard to get consulting contracts as everyone is under pressure to cut costs. That's when having a viable software business can be helpful.

Re: How to Kill a Startup Idea with Google Keyword Planner and AdWords: A Case Study

#165

Post by rchaud »

briandear wrote: post #88
IAmGraydon wrote: post #63

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Not only that, I’m amazed that VCs call the awful ads they tested “marketing”. What they created is simple, uncompetitive, uncreative advertising, and that kind of thing doesn’t stand a chance in today’s world. Of course it performed terribly. Marketing today takes just as much creativity as the product you’re selling. Actually, I would argue it takes more in many cases. It’s like building a race car and putting low…

If the ads were higher quality, the click through would improve but conversions wouldn’t. So it would drive up the acquisition costs even more — further making the point that this was a loser idea.

higher clickthroughs to the landing page would have zero incremental effect on conversions? How do you figure that?

why would anyone bother to A/B test ad copy or landing page CTAs if this were true?

Re: How to Kill a Startup Idea with Google Keyword Planner and AdWords: A Case Study

#166

Post by libertine »

tobr wrote: post #122

This might come off as awfully naive, but this doesn’t sit right with me: > XYLO's mobile music lesson technology is the easiest way to learn new music, right from the comfort of your home. Our platform can teach your child any instrument on any schedule, and let them replay lessons forever. As far as I understand, this is... a complete lie? You just made some crap up to see if you can make people click?

You have platforms that thrive on this : Kickstarter, Indiegogo.

They are filled with concepts, prototypes, what ever that's sold as end products.

Yet they ask for money, here it's offered the possibility to get more information.

Re: How to Kill a Startup Idea with Google Keyword Planner and AdWords: A Case Study

#167

Post by rchaud »

toohotatopic wrote: post #33
eschulz wrote: post #26

This startup also faces a fatal problem when users find a great music teacher, and then they just cut out the startup for future dealings with the teacher. They lose both the parents and the best teachers. Similar to those startups that pair you with a maid.

... or a soul mate, aka dating platforms.

Dating platforms subsist on ads and the sale of user data. Subscription revenues are a tiny proportion of their revenue base.

Re: How to Kill a Startup Idea with Google Keyword Planner and AdWords: A Case Study

#168

Post by rchaud »

rmason wrote: post #76

This is a very dangerous idea. It seems logical until you go and try it. The potential market is too small so you pass. Only to see the market blow up into billions of dollars that gets harvested by someone else. Do you think electric cars were that big an idea in July 2003 when Martin Eberhard and Marc Tarpenning started Tesla? It also doesn't factor when you commit to an idea you become an expert. Often that knowle…

They're not inventing any brand new technology. They're evaluating the business case for being a middle man in an oversaturated industry where both the customer and service provider want to cut out said middleman as soon as possible.

Re: How to Kill a Startup Idea with Google Keyword Planner and AdWords: A Case Study

#169

Post by rchaud »

luord wrote: post #155

> Lastly, I can't imagine that tech won't win here with non-human based teaching. It's affordable, convenient, and scalable to any genre, language, right from home on many platforms. That's just sad, even if probably true I'd still hope teachers remain. I'd rather have a human mentor when it comes to art.

They're assuming that because justin.tv exists and is popular, and that e-learning is now common in a number of fields, that this will apply to music as well.

Not so in my experience. I quickly learned that I can't follow along with my virtual guitar tutor if I broke the strings while attempting to tune it and have no idea how to re-string it.

Re: How to Kill a Startup Idea with Google Keyword Planner and AdWords: A Case Study

#170

Post by rchaud »

dragonwriter wrote: post #27
kbuchanan wrote: post #25

This may strike some as silly, but before the iPhone was invented, there were ZERO searches for the term "iPhone". (I assume, ha!) By all means, do market analysis, but remember that demand is not static—it can be shaped by what you offer. I co-founded a firm 13 years ago that now employees 50 people that most certainly would have been killed by this type of analysis.

> before the iPhone was invented, there were ZERO searches for the term "iPhone". Before the Apple iPhone was invented, there were probably some searches for “iPhone” because infogear had a product with that name in 1998, and Cisco (who has purchased infogear) started using it for Linksys products not long before the Apple iPhone launch.

there was also the Moto ROKR, which was a Jobs-blessed product. But in any case, keyword research isn't just about punching the exact term into a search engine. It's about looking at all the different combinations of terms that would identify user interest in your product.

For the iPhone that would have included search terms for "camera phone quality", "phone with web browsing", "phone with headphone jack" etc. At the time, the vast majority of phones came with a non-standard 2.5mm jack for a wired headset. The concept of listening to music on your phone was alien to all except maybe a couple of Blackberry and Nokia models.

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